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Which update would you like the most?

Randomized Backstories
- 67 (25.9%)
Genetic Additions
- 98 (37.8%)
Mess Hall
- 50 (19.3%)
Revamped Area
- 44 (17%)

Total Members Voted: 257


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Author Topic: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*  (Read 821853 times)

Googolplexed

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9480 on: April 03, 2010, 08:24:16 am »

Well, its just a git repository. Download msys-git and get the hang of it. The basic procedure is to git init, git pull, git commit, git push
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9481 on: April 03, 2010, 09:22:51 am »

Well, that took a while...

I just spent a long time finding out what address to use, and then getting it to at least work. This would be equivalent to the first command listed there.

I am using a GUI version, and it doesn't have pull!


Edit: Finally, I think I might be doing it *right* now.

Edit again: Yes, I finally got it to download everything.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2010, 09:43:52 am by qwertyuiopas »
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Orb

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9482 on: April 03, 2010, 10:42:45 am »

Superheating is fun...here's a tutorial:

Right click plasma can.
Edit the temperature of "the gas" to be infinity.

or you can do it the non-admin way, which is:
APRIL FOOLS!

Where do you live

Its April 3rd for me  :P

Probably Mars, since their orbit is slower.

Also, couldnt you make a bomb via using the plasma from the engine? o_O

It be a server crashing bomb, though.  :-\
Excuse me, but the server will survive an engine-bomb. If you make it early enough, that is.  5k bombs won't crash the server, but will annihilate most of the station.  I got myself banned once that way. It was fun.
P.S. Head don't be hating you stupid vindictive pain in my rear.


I always keep the rule of thumb that any bomb above 4000 degrees has the potential to crash, so I just try to avoid it.

Also, if no bomb crashes the server, I worry what those 10m watt engines could create...

We still need a server.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2010, 10:44:32 am by Orb »
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Pillow_Killer

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9483 on: April 03, 2010, 10:49:38 am »

I remember dicking around a lot on PA server. We were testing quita lot explosive properties of plasma, an no. No bomb, never did, and never will crash a server. I hate to repeat this all the time someone brings this up, but it was not possible for a very long time. Largest bomb in not-sandbox I blew up was 370k. It did not crash: just lagged everyone out, but two minutes after everyone was able to reconnect. We blew much bigger bombs in sandbox. The "Crashes" you speak of come from impatient hosts who kill the server since it freezes for a minute and over.
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zchris13

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9484 on: April 03, 2010, 10:56:10 am »

That speaks to MASSIVE coding inneficiencies.  Unless your calculating the blast wave front and its effects, that sort of FPS is inexcusable!  1/120 fps.  Wow. 1 frame, every 2 minutes.
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9485 on: April 03, 2010, 11:40:47 am »

Wow, and my solution will be to add an asynchronus var to the bomb call that defaults to 1, and if it is true, it will spawn() and then strategically sleep().

If it lags everyone out, tht means that it wnt into a very long loop and denied flow-of-control to the unseen server functions that update the clients.

Hint: The server seems to try to handle every code in what I assume ot be a queue, and then does non-code updates, including networking, and adding delays so that the maximum is 10 ticks per second or less, if you change the in-game setting to be less. So, if the clients time out, then something is looping without a sleep(), and going on for an intolerable ammount of time.

So, the fix is to make it asynchronus so that if it continues, the effect is broken periodically to let the server keep the clients from timing out.

Also, a server can(and will) crash during such a loop, for example if it has a stack overflow or malloc failure because the loop accumulates data or recurses, and it goes on for too long without cleaning up or finishing. The fact that the server merely froze for two minutes means that it was well-designed, so did not recurse enough to crash, and didn't accumulate data that fast either, but was poorly implemented, because it didn't pass of flow-of-control occasionally.

Also, if any of them are reading this, all this is my assumptions based on a decent understanding of some problems with the older powernet code, and an understanding that the code is likely not multithreaded to make it easier to work with, since you don't have to worry about a variable being accessed by another proc mid-statement.

Quote
Format:
sleep(Delay)
Args:
Delay: The amount of time to sleep, in 1/10 seconds.
Pause the current proc (and its callers) for a specified amount of time. If no delay is specified, it will be scheduled to resume as soon as other immediately pending events are processed.

This implies that BYOND has in internal queue for each pending tick, and sleep and spawn append the proc call to the end of the queue {n} ticks later, or the current one if 0.

Furthermore, as a long loop will lag clients as well, it implies that non-code server events happen between ticks, so using sleep(0), spawn(0), or not delaying at all will perpetually postpone updating the clients until the code is finished, and after a certain delay, the clients assume that the server has crashed, and disconnect. So, by adding an occasional sleep(1) to your long code, you are delaying it until after the server has had a chance to inform the clients that yes, in fact, it *is* still running.

Edit: and, reading the manual, it seems that sleep(-1) was *designed* for this. Also, set background

Edit again:
Rethinking some of that, maybe client communications are handled from within the code anyway.

However, it still won't happen within a loop than never sleep()s and is not set backgrounded.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2010, 11:48:26 am by qwertyuiopas »
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Sukasa

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9486 on: April 03, 2010, 12:02:37 pm »

I'm pretty sure that bombs crashing the server isn't related to the bomb directly, but the bomb's effects on certain networks.  I know that solar panels and solar control computers have a few bugs which aren't fixed in the master branch that might partly be responsible.
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Mono124

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9487 on: April 03, 2010, 12:53:23 pm »

Superheating is fun...here's a tutorial:

Right click plasma can.
Edit the temperature of "the gas" to be infinity.

or you can do it the non-admin way, which is:
APRIL FOOLS!

Where do you live

Its April 3rd for me  :P

Probably Mars, since their orbit is slower.

Also, couldnt you make a bomb via using the plasma from the engine? o_O

It be a server crashing bomb, though.  :-\
Excuse me, but the server will survive an engine-bomb. If you make it early enough, that is.  5k bombs won't crash the server, but will annihilate most of the station.  I got myself banned once that way. It was fun.
P.S. Head don't be hating you stupid vindictive pain in my rear.


I always keep the rule of thumb that any bomb above 4000 degrees has the potential to crash, so I just try to avoid it.

Also, if no bomb crashes the server, I worry what those 10m watt engines could create...

We still need a server.

You mean the two billion watt engine we have right now?
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9488 on: April 03, 2010, 01:17:29 pm »

I actually got around to working on it, and now I will test some bombs.

What var do I edit?

If I knew, I could blow up bombs, each 10 times more powerful than the last, until one of them actually crashed the server. After each one, I would start a new round, so that there is maximum station remaining to lag the destruction.

Edit(And forgot to post):
While creating plasma, >2e7 temp, server crashed due to errors once I set it to enter a cannister. This is likely the biggest crash issue, if not fixed in a branch.
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9489 on: April 03, 2010, 01:34:55 pm »

Let's play a game called "What's wrong with this code?"

Code: [Select]
/obj/machinery/atmoalter/canister/proc/healthcheck()
if(src.gas.temperature >= 2300)
src.health = 0
healthcheck()
return
..... (omitted) .....

Might be the current crash bug?
(Hint: removing both
      healthcheck()
      return
should fix it)
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head

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9490 on: April 03, 2010, 01:44:43 pm »

Let's play a game called "What's wrong with this code?"

Code: [Select]
/obj/machinery/atmoalter/canister/proc/healthcheck()
if(src.gas.temperature >= 2300)
src.health = 0
healthcheck()
return
..... (omitted) .....

Might be the current crash bug?
(Hint: removing both
      healthcheck()
      return
should fix it)

Wasn't that commented out o.O.

Well fuck.

My fault.

Edit: this is why you don't code at 4am and stop halfway and then go to bed.
Edit2: also to change bomb temp edit the Bombs/gas var(its a ref) tempature
« Last Edit: April 03, 2010, 02:03:00 pm by head »
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9491 on: April 03, 2010, 02:02:38 pm »

Promising!

A 10k bomb, and only some lag.

The effect was surreal, however, as you see the station blow up line by line. That is already going to be fixed by simply having it shuffle the turf order.

Next test: 100k


Also, it was odd to see the whole thing stop as soon as the bomb deleted itself. That, too, is likely a result of my work-in-progress, and is fixed as far as I know, though I can't tell for sure until I test again.

Edit: also, a small fix so that it won't try logging stuff until the world is finished /New, eliminating a few log errors as it trys to access "null.log" (since world is null at that point)
« Last Edit: April 03, 2010, 02:04:10 pm by qwertyuiopas »
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head

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9492 on: April 03, 2010, 02:11:21 pm »

Promising!

A 10k bomb, and only some lag.

The effect was surreal, however, as you see the station blow up line by line. That is already going to be fixed by simply having it shuffle the turf order.

Next test: 100k


Also, it was odd to see the whole thing stop as soon as the bomb deleted itself. That, too, is likely a result of my work-in-progress, and is fixed as far as I know, though I can't tell for sure until I test again.

Edit: also, a small fix so that it won't try logging stuff until the world is finished /New, eliminating a few log errors as it trys to access "null.log" (since world is null at that point)
Wonderfull pushed the crash fix and some other minor crap to the depo.

also fucking awesome
btw server up.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2010, 02:15:36 pm by head »
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9493 on: April 03, 2010, 02:15:31 pm »

The 100k test?

Far from deadly, actually. It took a *whole minute*(Or more) to destroy the station, since it was "only" destroying 500 turfs per second.

I have upgraded it to 1k per second, and will try a 20k bomb, and see how long it takes.

However, it is much deadlier than before, where you could simply flee north, but now everywhere gets hit at roughly the same time.

And anything less than 31x31 tiles in effect should finish in under one second
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #9494 on: April 03, 2010, 02:27:45 pm »

Well, that worked.

As a side effect, massive Z-level destroying bombs are less deadly then lower temperature ones, since a 10k bomb would give users ample time to flee as long as they didn't run into a turf as it exploded or have problems with the space turfs appearing everywhere and sucking the air out of the station. In fact, anyone with a spacesuit and air can survive simply by running to the nearest *already destroyed* turf and waiting for the bomb to finish.

It would be quite easy to improve the destructive force, since 100 turfs per 1/10th of a second is an arbitrary number.

I think I am done, so I will now try to upload the changes. I don't know if I will succeed...
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