Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Retro]

I don't see the monarch's spouse listed there, for example -- do they still require rooms? What about Duke's consort?

Does the militia captain overlap with the sheriff, or are they separate?

Code: [Select]

[POSITION:MONARCH]
[SPOUSE_MALE:king consort:kings consort]
[SPOUSE_FEMALE:queen consort:queens consort]

Spouses are listed within the position-holder's info, as seen here. Whether that means they require nothing or all the same things as the position-holder, I don't know. Toady, do spouses of position-holders (ie. the king/queen) require the same things as the position-holder, or do they just share and not need anything all to themself?

@Hieronymous: I was wondering about the room stuff myself as I asked whether we need to house the outpost liason and/or the diplomat as well.

Here's the listed requirements for both of those. Seems like yes, you do.

Code: [Select]

[POSITION:OUTPOST_LIAISON]
[REQUIRED_BOXES:3]
[REQUIRED_CABINETS:2]
[REQUIRED_RACKS:2]
[REQUIRED_STANDS:2]
[REQUIRED_OFFICE:1500]
[REQUIRED_BEDROOM:1500]
[REQUIRED_DINING:1500]

[POSITION:DIPLOMAT]
[REQUIRED_BOXES:3]
[REQUIRED_CABINETS:2]
[REQUIRED_RACKS:2]
[REQUIRED_STANDS:2]
[REQUIRED_OFFICE:1500]
[REQUIRED_BEDROOM:1500]
[REQUIRED_DINING:1500]


[smjjames]

Yea, but the thing is, the outpost liason and diplomat are for the most part, only visiting your fort. I know that when the king comes, the liason becomes the advisor, no idea about the diplomat though. However, its just not entirely clear whether we will have to house them and even when. I've seen the dwarven diplomat in legends, never had one come to the fort. It would be cool if another civ or fort sent one to set up a trade agreement, but that will have to wait until the caravan stuff.

There is already a question asking how many more nobles we will have to make rooms for, so my question would get answered at the same time as my question.

[Mel_Vixen]

@Heph: Besides the fact that it would be as valuable as anything else from the animal (which would be x10 if its unchanged from the way it is now), maybe it would vary by culture. Like some believe that the horn is an aphrodisiac, ground horn would have medical properties (in the real world, you may as well eat your fingernails as thats what rhino horns are made of, keratin, like your fingernails....)....

I wasnt going for the worh of the material. I want the physical properties like the shearpoint etc. A Unicorn-horn spear could be a very piercing experience.

[Shoku]

I think Toady mentioned that advisor-liason change was just a strange hard coded thing so it sounds like he's just dropped the name change. The diplomat sounds like it will have a bigger role in later releases.

What kind of room design have you got that can't stand to have some more rooms thrown on though?

[Greiger]

The room information for diplomats just looks like it's there for consistency's sake to me.  That way if toady does decide to do something with them they are already set up just like the others and he doesn't have to hassle with figuring out proper rooms for them later.

[Mel_Vixen]

I hope the Position holders get "theyr" rooms in the Mountainhomes too and recognize them.

[Footkerchief]

I looked in the species raws.  It looks like the [liKES_FIGHTING] tag combines with [CAN_CIV] (which is included in [INTELLIGENT], I think) to create attackers.  I guess these must be species-level tags.

Nope, it's a caste level tag:

The number of tokens that are creature rather than caste specific is very small.  Creatures handle the overall name, biome, whether the creature is considered fanciful/doesn't exist (for art), vermin information (so, no, Fault, sorry!... too much depends on that right now), whether groups hang together closely, whether it is mundane (from real Earth for age name purposes), population information including good/evil/savage, if it is equipment, sphere information (not sure how long that'll last, but there were annoyances), and that looks like it (they also have some general categories that have caste overrides, like child names and speeches for adv mode).  Everything else, including body information, is held in the castes.

So yeah, it'll be interesting to see how Igfig's scenario plays out.

Question about the "Humanoid"-Template: Do we get Random Animalman on the Map at some point? Would they appear in the same Biomes as the parent animal? Like one Northern Forrest (retreats) gets wolfman while a jungle gets Cheetah-men? Or foulblendecIcewolf/Unicorn-men if said biome is sinister/sphere influenced?

The animalman types aren't randomly created.  The animalman creature variation is applied manually to specific creatures (here are the actual raws for a variation and its usage), so you'll only get animalmen that Toady specifically added, and they'll show up in their assigned biomes just like any other creature.

Speaking of unicorns what are the physical properties of theyr horn? Is it in some way extra pointy/sharp? What odd Monster-materials can we exspect?

This is the most "wait and see" thing ever.

Yea, but the thing is, the outpost liason and diplomat are for the most part, only visiting your fort. I know that when the king comes, the liason becomes the advisor, no idea about the diplomat though. However, its just not entirely clear whether we will have to house them and even when. I've seen the dwarven diplomat in legends, never had one come to the fort. It would be cool if another civ or fort sent one to set up a trade agreement, but that will have to wait until the caravan stuff.

You only have to house them if they're living at your fortress permanently, i.e. if your fortress becomes a mountainhome.

[KaelGotDwarves]

From dev_now

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Let's see, Zach's dwarves insisted on drinking from a pond instead of drinking their booze, but he managed to melt a dwarf with magma and have the rest killed by underground beasts within ten minutes, which is positive. Adventure mode was kind of a mess on the other hand... he somehow started with a complete set of adamantine equipment, with which he couldn't injure a mob of leatherclad villagers despite my testing a similar scenario in the arena mode. I didn't ask him why there was a mob after him. Prior to that, they sent him to find a demon at a vague location to get a quest... dunno if that was a bug or not, since I haven't checked the legends. Anyway, more to do.

I love hearing about bugs.

[Mephansteras]

Sounds like great fun. Although those dwarves are truly demented right now. I mean, preferring water over booze? Broken souls, indeed.

[smjjames]

It could have been a number of factors in the preferring water over booze thing.

Still, I'm wondering about the Philosopher as well since he isn't in that positions list.

Kind of cool that the DM can now be assigned or something.

[Reese]

Question about the "Humanoid"-Template: Do we get Random Animalman on the Map at some point? Would they appear in the same Biomes as the parent animal? Like one Northern Forrest (retreats) gets wolfman while a jungle gets Cheetah-men? Or foulblendecIcewolf/Unicorn-men if said biome is sinister/sphere influenced?

The animalman types aren't randomly created.  The animalman creature variation is applied manually to specific creatures (here are the actual raws for a variation and its usage), so you'll only get animalmen that Toady specifically added, and they'll show up in their assigned biomes just like any other creature.

assigned biomes...

as in assigned specifically to the implementation of the animal man, or assigned to the base creature?

I just really want turtle men to be found in the underground... bonus points if they ambush and and can be armed with a staff, flail, sword, or sai...

[Greiger]

Don't forget the legendary wrestler ratman.

[Outcast Orange]

I'm so excited!
Things are going to be really FUN.

Ah, my first ultra bug-filled DF release.
I'll be sitting right here on the front lines.

[Footkerchief]

The animalman types aren't randomly created.  The animalman creature variation is applied manually to specific creatures (here are the actual raws for a variation and its usage), so you'll only get animalmen that Toady specifically added, and they'll show up in their assigned biomes just like any other creature.

assigned biomes...

as in assigned specifically to the implementation of the animal man, or assigned to the base creature?

I just really want turtle men to be found in the underground... bonus points if they ambush and and can be armed with a staff, flail, sword, or sai...

The animalman can use the base creature's biomes, or override them.  In the example I linked above, the cave fish man just uses the base creature's biomes, although it replaces AQUATIC with AMPHIBIOUS:

Spoiler: Toady's reply (click to show/hide)

1) What do they look like?  Can we see a preview?

Here's the current animal person one.  Removed tags need to be added afterward if you want the information:

Code: [Select]

[CREATURE_VARIATION:ANIMAL_PERSON]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:NAME]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:GENERAL_CHILD_NAME]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:GENERAL_BABY_NAME]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:CASTE_NAME]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:CHILDNAME]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:BABYNAME]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:SMALL_REMAINS]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:DESCRIPTION]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:PETVALUE]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:PENETRATEPOWER]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_EATER]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_HATEABLE]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_GROUNDER]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_FISH]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_SOIL]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_SOIL_COLONY]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:VERMIN_ROTTER]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:TRIGGERABLE_GROUP]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:PET_EXOTIC]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:NOT_BUTCHERABLE]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:SPEED]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:SWIM_SPEED]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:MUNDANE]
[CV_CONVERT_TAG]
[CVCT_MASTER:BODY]
[CVCT_TARGET:QUADRUPED]
[CVCT_REPLACEMENT:HUMANOID]
[CV_NEW_TAG:LARGE_ROAMING]
[CV_NEW_TAG:SAVAGE]
[CV_NEW_TAG:SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[CV_NEW_TAG:GRAVITATE_BODY_SIZE:70000]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CAN_LEARN]
[CV_NEW_TAG:CAN_SPEAK]

And here it is being used to make a cave fish man -- the body stuff doesn't work there because the original fish is not a quadruped, so it uses a custom variation on the spot, which is processed and executed right in there:

Code: [Select]

[CREATURE:CAVE_FISH_MAN]
[COPY_TAGS_FROM:FISH_CAVE]
[APPLY_CREATURE_VARIATION:ANIMAL_PERSON]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:AQUATIC]
[CV_ADD_TAG:AMPHIBIOUS]
[APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION]
[GO_TO_TAG:BODY]
[CV_REMOVE_TAG:BODY]
[APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION]
[BODY:HUMANOID:SIDE_FINS:DORSAL_FIN:TAIL:HEART:GUTS:ORGANS:NECK:SPINE:BRAIN:SKULL:MOUTH:RIBCAGE]
[GO_TO_END]
[SELECT_CASTE:MALE]
[CASTE_NAME:cave fish man:cave fish men:cave fish man]
[SELECT_CASTE:FEMALE]
[CASTE_NAME:cave fish woman:cave fish women:cave fish woman]
[GO_TO_START]
[NAME:cave fish man:cave fish men:cave fish man]
[DESCRIPTION:A humanoid creature with the head of a blind cave fish.  They live in colonies in watery regions far underground.]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:30:50]
[CLUSTER_NUMBER:5:10]

The [APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION] runs all of the custom commands you've saved up so far (variations from files are run immediately).  There's also the strange go to stuff in there -- some tags need to be before other tags, so this was a quick fix.  The proper way might be to have it understand the requirements a little better and collect the strings into ordered groups that are invisible to the user or something, but there will be one annoyance or other either way.

2) Will sequentially invoked variations basically act like a nested template?  E.g., we'd want separate templates ARTHROPOD and CRUSTACEAN, where a creature invokes them in that order and CRUSTACEAN assumes that ARTHROPOD has already been invoked and modifies the ARTHROPOD stuff.

Yeah, it applies things as it goes to a list of strings floating around in memory, so you can nest them by applying them in sequence.  Following their evolutionary hierarchies may or may not be a good idea depending on how much the bodies morph.  Bodies are one of the more irritating things, since it's all one giant tag.  You can change and insert things within a tag, but you kind of have to keep track yourself what it looks like at any given stage.

3) Is there any way for a creature entry to deactivate a tag (like DIURNAL) applied by a template?  I guess you could create a special variation just for deactivating that one tag...

Yeah, you can see this in the fish man when it changes AQUATIC to AMPHIBIOUS.  For yours, you'd just do [CV_REMOVE_TAG:DIURNAL] followed by, say, [CV_ADD_TAG:ALL_ACTIVE] then [APPLY_CURRENT_CREATURE_VARIATION], which hands those two changes then clears the queue.  You don't need to add a replacement if it's not required.

4) Any other gotchas with the variations?

I'm sure there are...  the invisible cursor/go-to stuff is probably the most annoying.  CV_NEW_TAG and CV_ADD_TAG are the same and they both work.  I just got confused halfway through.

The underground turtlemen aren't likely -- turtles only live aboveground in the current version.

[Bunny]

I'm getting overexcited now.  I keep telling myself that the bug testing is likely to take a LONG time since so very much has been added, but just knowing we're at that stage now keeps making me go all gooey with joy.