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Author Topic: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.  (Read 1682284 times)

RoguelikeRazuka

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13830 on: August 17, 2016, 07:28:49 am »

Thanks to all for the help provided, but my character died the next turn. I used the lignification potion and in tree form my GrFi had merely 32 AC, which perfectly contributed to the stone giant finishing the work. Hence I think just quaffing an undefined number of potions of curing and reading a teleportation scroll when healed enough could have made my deliverance somewhat more feasible at that time, considering the decent AC and SH scores and resistances I possessed (rCorr, rPois, rElec, rNeg+++, rC++, rF+++, and MR++++). Also I absolutely lament my neglecting the very reasonable idea of equiping the vampiric eveningstar before even entering the fifth floor. Moreover, I had had a fine opportunity to fully recharge the wand of healing long before I ended up in that condition, god knows why I deemed that not worth spending one scroll of recharging and a moment of time.   

This is the second time my gargoyle fighter dies on the fifth floor of the vaults, all thanks to a tentacled monstrosity constricting him before he manages to make his retreat, or a vault warden sealing the stairs.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2016, 07:57:22 am by RoguelikeRazuka »
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Il Palazzo

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13831 on: August 17, 2016, 07:40:57 am »

I find Vault 5 hilariously easy. Get some 3 or 5 scrolls of immolation, at least rF++ (easy to do by the time you get there), make some noise to call in monsters from outside your sight range, and watch everything explode with next to no effort on your side.
Granted, you still can die in the nooks and crannies of V5, but that goes for almost everywhere else.
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TheDarkStar

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13832 on: August 17, 2016, 07:58:40 am »

I usually kill the initial Vault:5 mob by stepping downstairs for one turn, then immediately stepping back up. This usually doesn't provide time for a vault warden to seal the stairs and allows me to deal with the enemies 1-8 at a time. As long as you can kill 8 vault guards at once and you have something to deal with vault wardens should the need arise, you should be fine.
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RoguelikeRazuka

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13833 on: August 17, 2016, 08:11:01 am »

I usually kill the initial Vault:5 mob by stepping downstairs for one turn, then immediately stepping back up. This usually doesn't provide time for a vault warden to seal the stairs and allows me to deal with the enemies 1-8 at a time. As long as you can kill 8 vault guards at once and you have something to deal with vault wardens should the need arise, you should be fine.
The problem is that vault wardens typically appear from afar (in my replays they always do), disabling the stairs immediately, and if you're playing a pure melee character you sometimes have to use a different strategy to kill them as fast as possible. And if an ancient lich or 2-3 elf annihilators turn up, then things become far worse.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2016, 08:27:03 am by RoguelikeRazuka »
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Sarrak

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13834 on: August 17, 2016, 09:01:08 am »

I usually kill the initial Vault:5 mob by stepping downstairs for one turn, then immediately stepping back up. This usually doesn't provide time for a vault warden to seal the stairs and allows me to deal with the enemies 1-8 at a time. As long as you can kill 8 vault guards at once and you have something to deal with vault wardens should the need arise, you should be fine.
The problem is that vault wardens typically appear from afar (in my replays they always do), disabling the stairs immediately, and if you're playing a pure melee character you sometimes have to use a different strategy to kill them as fast as possible. And if an ancient lich or 2-3 elf annihilators turn up, then things become far worse.
Teleport, teleport like never before! Usually, by this stage you'll have plenty of Tele scrolls, which are close to useless since wands of teleport become more common. Fighting versus three sphinx, GD and/or liches is near suicidal (since more monsters would come and get you sooner or later). Teleporting is a viable alternative for a melee fighter, as you can normally survive whatever situation you're thrown into. Teleport until you find/clear a safe spot and start exploration anew from there.

I used this strategy both as normal fighter and as Messiah of Beogh, dying only three times out of dozen attempts - the deaths being Orb of Destruction into face at max (?) distance, sphinx-induced paralysis when fighting several GD at once and one not-so-lucky trial run with spriggan 'warrior'.
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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13835 on: August 23, 2016, 08:26:01 pm »

I tend to make sure I have a bolt attack on V:5. Bolt of Fire spell (unlikely unless mage), some bolt wand (usually acid or draining, considering that fire and cold have been removed), etc. At the _very_ least a ball attack (iceblast etc.). These are good for quickly killing wardens at the edge of vision if you don't think you could survive a random teleport.

Also, _always_ read ?oMM on V:5. Save at least one for this occasion. It's very valuable. (Come to think of it, every rune ending should get a ?oMM when possible, but V:5 is maybe the most important of the Usual Three.)
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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13836 on: August 23, 2016, 08:34:02 pm »

I don't know if it's the best way, but if there's any combination of equipment that gives me Rf+++, I'll use scrolls of immolation to greet the party waiting in V:5.  Definitely one of the more satisfying moments one can have in crawl.
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13837 on: August 24, 2016, 02:42:59 am »

You have the honor of dying in several places at once.
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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13838 on: August 24, 2016, 08:55:40 am »

cast inner flame on yourself
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Quote from: King James Programming
...Simplification leaves us with the black extra-cosmic gulfs it throws open before our frenzied eyes...
Quote from: Salvané Descocrates
The only difference between me and a fool is that I know that I know only that I think, therefore I am.
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TheDarkStar

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13839 on: August 24, 2016, 09:01:55 am »

I usually just stairdance the greeting party to death, but that's because I play silly tanky characters (I think I had one with 60 AC by the time I reached V:5) that can tab through almost anything.
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it happened it happened it happen im so hyped to actually get attacked now

Sarrak

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13840 on: August 24, 2016, 11:05:28 am »

Stairdancing seems especially fun to me while following Beogh. Surprise party of orc knights and warlords never ceases to amuse me by tearing poor vault guards apart. Descending with a whole orc army might be tricky, though, as many would die to dragon breath and spells.
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Science is always important. But it needs more flaming cats. Can't we build bridge-based catapults and fling flaming cats at the dust and goo?

It's time for the ATHATH Death Counter to increase once more in celebration for the end of the world.

monk12

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13841 on: August 24, 2016, 11:31:07 am »

Stairdancing seems especially fun to me while following Beogh. Surprise party of orc knights and warlords never ceases to amuse me by tearing poor vault guards apart. Descending with a whole orc army might be tricky, though, as many would die to dragon breath and spells.

Ah, that's one of my favorite crawl memories. I had been going to just stairdance it like a sensible person, but I got shoved off the stairs and couldn't get back, so I retreated down the hall, called my enormous army, and charged into a glorious melee. Everything died except for like 2 insanely high level warlords, and I burned a lot of resources to boot, so we didn't make it through Zot, but that fight's probably my second favorite fight ever.

Aoi

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13842 on: August 24, 2016, 11:50:06 am »

I don't know if it's the best way, but if there's any combination of equipment that gives me Rf+++, I'll use scrolls of immolation to greet the party waiting in V:5.  Definitely one of the more satisfying moments one can have in crawl.

About how much damage do you expect to take at rF+++?
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IcyTea31

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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13843 on: August 24, 2016, 11:59:06 am »

About how much damage do you expect to take at rF+++?
I did some quick math, and according to it, you can expect an average of 6,4 damage per adjacent creature. (Worst case: 12 damage/creature)
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Re: Dungeon Crawl: Stone Soup. Or: THAT DAMN SIGMUND.
« Reply #13844 on: August 24, 2016, 09:46:30 pm »

Yeah, I suppose I should say I usually only get that far on tanky beserkers, so it's not something you want to do as a spriggan in a robe.  But then again, if I've got a character like that with Rf+++ I'll burn an ?Imm for any large gang just to save time.  Pop Trog's hand or Regen and enjoy the show.
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