Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[King Zultan]

People can keep those new fangled drones and AI powered garbage, I'll just stick to the old crap I already have.

[Duuvian]

OK grandpa

Personally I'd prefer they be done properly in the public interest

[scriver]

OK grandpa

Personally I'd prefer they be done properly in the public interest

So not at all then

[dragdeler]

Yeah give everyone some widget to hammer onto some plushie, lest we get a moment of realizisation.

[jipehog]

Corridor Digital claims their ‘AI-generated’ anime could ‘change animation forever’ but some professional animators disagree

Thoughts?

[jipehog]

People can keep those new fangled drones and AI powered garbage, I'll just stick to the old crap I already have.

How about 'Get Off My lawn AI'? let the kids have fun with your killer drones and space lasers while you enjoy a cold one

[lemon10]

For AI animation on this scale to be a crucial step in the animation process two things need to happen.
1) It needs to be significantly faster then the current stuff. From what I know this is already the case.
2) It needs to not result in a significant and noticeable quality drop. From what I know this is not the case yet.

Once #2 is true AI assisted animation will slowly but inevitably replace traditional stuff in the exact same way that digital animation replaced hand drawn.
It won't matter what the artists want, its just a simple matter of economics.

The anime linked itself shows some significant issues with quality in places (notably shadows), but for that style at least it feels like its at a place where consumers would be willing to accept it assuming the underlying story, ect, are good enough. Maybe not in top anime of the season or anything, but I totally see it being used to great results in very low budget animes where it could add lots of detail and allow the animators to focus their time on big fight scenes or whatever.

E:
A lot of opposition to this stuff is outrage driven, which shows that on some level artists are very scared about how viable all this is. They aren't wrong, and I would indeed say that maybe not this specific technique, but AI powered anime in general is the future.

[Robsoie]

Sure the example animated short has some problems and etc..., but they're irrelevant when you know tools , hardware and ai will continue to improve.
 
And obviously it will reach a point in which the computing and hardware + the AI will produce such result that it is going to kill a lot of jobs in the animation sector because it will cost a lot less for production for a roughly similar result in the future :/

Same as it happened in most manufacturing industries when they started to use robots that were replacing tons of human employees for the same thing and cheaper costs.

Wonder how more industries will progressively get harder and harder to get into once the AI will have developped a lot more...
If the guys in power around the world haven't found a way to give people (that will be unable to get a job thanks to robot+AI) good living standards, i have no doubt there's going to be a lot of blood.

Because once people are getting desesperate and see they have no way to build their life anymore because they can't access a job, the less i can say is that it will not end well.

[Lord Shonus]

"Technology is guaranteed to improve with no ceilings" is not a safe assumption. The ceiling for automation hasn't really gone up very much in the last twenty years, possibly the last thirty - the much-hyped Breakthrough Robots from five or six years ago are discontinued and their manufacturers defunct because they just didn't actually offer much. Computers no longer become massively more powerful each year, because we're hitting the limits of what can actually be done with silicon. Every tech has a limit.


The sort of AI generation we're seeing now seems like revolutionary tech that came out of nowhere, but it really isn't. The underlying tech has been under development for decades and has just now reached the status of "oh, we can turn this into something that might pass muster if you don't look at it too hard". Fundamentally replacing human creatives, or even the workaday illustrator toiling in the Simpsons mines, won't happen until humanity creates an AI that can actually think. And it wouldn't surprise me if we got Ragnarok or the Second Coming of Christ before that happens.

[lemon10]

The sort of AI generation we're seeing now seems like revolutionary tech that came out of nowhere, but it really isn't. The underlying tech has been under development for decades and has just now reached the status of "oh, we can turn this into something that might pass muster if you don't look at it too hard". Fundamentally replacing human creatives, or even the workaday illustrator toiling in the Simpsons mines, won't happen until humanity creates an AI that can actually think. And it wouldn't surprise me if we got Ragnarok or the Second Coming of Christ before that happens.

Iteration and ease of use upgrades on the current stuff won't replace humans, but it should be more then enough to replace *most* human creatives in certain fields.

So instead of needing 10 animators you need 5, instead of hiring a logo design specialist you do it in house with Stable Diffusion type tools, or instead of hiring someone on commission for your quest for like 50(?) bucks per image you do it yourself or hire someone to do it for 5 bucks per image instead.
This doesn't just apply to artist either, entire fields (accountants, programmers, customer support/tech support via phone) and ripe to having the number of people needed cut down significantly for the same quality of work.

None of that stuff requires fundamental technology advances, and in some cases is currently happening.

Yes, going from 10 animators to 0 requires some pretty fundamental advances, but its really really going to suck for artists long before then.
---
I still disagree with the notion that AI isn't going to continue to advance at a really rapid pace though, and we don't need true strong AI to fundamentally revolutionize the entire world.

[Starver]

Corridor Digital claims their ‘AI-generated’ anime could ‘change animation forever’ but some professional animators disagree

Thoughts?

I shall subscribe to corridor...  <blink> ...eh? What was that? I must have blanked out for a moment.

[jipehog]

Fundamentally replacing human creatives, or even the workaday illustrator toiling in the Simpsons mines, won't happen until humanity creates an AI that can actually think. And it wouldn't surprise me if we got Ragnarok or the Second Coming of Christ before that happens.

Yeah that is common thinking, that our narrow AI is just mimicking and it would not be unable to achieving the unique intelligence that is innate to human creativity, and yet it is already on the way to drastically reduce the need for creative workers ( and not just, he mentions how he does with 3 people on set what Hollywood does with a hundred). It also raise the question of what would be the incentive to invest years in studying painting and developing your unique style, if in minutes your skill can be copied and replicated as simple filter for others to use.. would we need new type of copy right protection?


I recall TED talk saying that eventually AI will replace all work except creative, empathy (for things like schooling) and menial (like nursing wiping patience asses) work. But given advances in AI and later with biometric integrations I am less sure about the first two. Some argue that AI will create new job in other fields, however, I am not as optimist about the numbers and I suspect that most will require higher skill qualifications. So I wonder what will happen to lower skilled workers from tech support to professional drivers made obsolete by self-driving cars. At the very least people should think about their country investment in job retraining e.g. Germany which invested in that much more than USA wasn't hit as hard by globalization its policies.


The scary part for me is what if AI will replace us. I have to admit that I have hard time to imagine a world where we don't have to work (or can only work at nursing) it sounds nice, but I suspect that overwhelming majority of people wouldn't do too well.

[Duuvian]

OK grandpa

Personally I'd prefer they be done properly in the public interest

So not at all then

Not quite, just that regulation seems to be quite captured.

One thing that did irk me recently is that the bingbot is being integrated into Windows. That is part of a troubling trend in the OS that has me determined to switch to linux one day already (looking at you Edge) where things are added through the appallingly bad windows updater in patches without asking user consent. Using Edge as an example, it requires 3rd party software to remove and frequently re-inserts itself as patches are done. Others examples are the windows webcap app and News and interests built into the start menu. If a patch contains those I should have an option to install them or not as I have no use for either.

[King Zultan]

That kind of stuff is why I think anything Windows did past 7 is shit and refuse to use it.

People can keep those new fangled drones and AI powered garbage, I'll just stick to the old crap I already have.

How about 'Get Off My lawn AI'? let the kids have fun with your killer drones and space lasers while you enjoy a cold one

As cool as something like that sounds I probably won't live long enough to see it.

[jipehog]

I don't know long you have left to live, but I am not sure this future is far removed.

I think little of specific AI tools, but I find the general trend indicate that AI is the ground-shaking economy transforming industrial revolution sort of innovation. It doesn't mean it's going to happen tomorrow even the steam engine, electricity and computer took several decades to realize their potential with initial reduction in productivity.

But I think its already clear that this general purpose innovation, with a verity of applications across all industries, with plenty of knock on and spillover effect, and with wide margin for potential improvement is such a tech. Which even now promise to dramatically boost a human worker's productivity or possible replace them outright including in pervious unexpected fields.

So yeah I think its important to pay attention to possible problems, better than whine after the fact about how the system was designed without you in mind.