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Author Topic: LGBTQ+ Thread  (Read 71307 times)

Vector

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #585 on: April 08, 2023, 10:41:07 pm »

Theory: Once 'out', a gay person transgresses by making themselves look and act different from the 'normal' person that they should/could be. You can at least be aware of them, tolerate them as long as it suits you, you know precisely whee they are, should you have any concerns about them.. But the  "ultimate point" of being trans is to be at least as much like that they are not as they can, which means that they're dangerous to the less accepting kind of worldviews.

With respect, I don't think that any of this is true... I can see why people would see it that way, but for example, for nonbinary people who don't exist, the goal may be to deliberately be/exist as openly Other.

Many binary trans people want to pass. Many also aren't that worried about it.
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KittyTac

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #586 on: April 09, 2023, 12:22:54 am »

I may be a very queer person in a hostile country but I don't protest because I value my own hide too much.
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EuchreJack

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #587 on: April 09, 2023, 01:51:22 am »

Law and Government is currently designed around a 2 gender model, male and female.  So trans have to get the Government to add at least one more box to forms, regulations, etc.  Which means a lot of reform is necessary, and there will be some resistance from anyone that has to work with those forms & regulations.

To make things worse, the Computer systems aren't as easy to fix as paper forms.  And Computers have taken over.
The Computer only accepts two answers, and fails to proceed without that answer.

alway

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #588 on: April 09, 2023, 02:35:43 am »

Yeah Starver, that's actually kinda backward actually? Like, its more that we aren't seen because no one wants to see us, and so ignore us sitting in plain sight in front of them. This stretches to a frankly absurd degree, because if you were never taught to think outside gender binaries, all other possibility is seen as impossible. I'll be sipping from my trans pride flag mug in work meetings, and I'm still not actually out there as far as I'm aware. Not because I want to blend in(I dont), but because I'm not familiar enough with the politics of everyone around me to know whether or not I'm endangering myself and my family by being out in the space that pays our rent. Hiding isn't the point, it's the necessity from living in a society where powerful bias against you may ruin your life if you are out in the wrong spaces. Most trans folks I know are GNC with the gender they have claimed as their own. A woman is a woman regardless of how she presents herself, and the same goes regardless of whether she's cis or trans. This is an important point to remember. Being trans generally doesn't mean just lying down and conforming to a different set of societal expectations; more often its an exploration.
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Starver

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #589 on: April 09, 2023, 06:16:26 am »

I was really thinking about the rumbling dark undertones (TERFs, etc, poisoning the well), which makes it harder to establish even baseline equalities and the like.

But there'll be other effects, as mentioned in response. Relative sparsity (even within a 'gay village' social centre) is probably not helpful, there may be more AA meetings than trans-support group events.

Perhaps even arising from a basis of benevolance from others. I'm now worried that while I've always(?) been happy to accept people, my not staring might be taken as passive-agressive by someone who is used to being stated at by all and sundry. Even if they'd prefer not to be. - I'd consider myself a trans-ally, but I'm not particularly good at social balancing, so what if my 'normal' stand-offishness is interpreted as an 'attitude' towards someone (even when also exhibited towards anyone else, book-ending this particular encounter). Or, through anxiety from over-thinking it[1], go into a meet-and-greet wrongly in other ways.

...I was summarising that other thing, though, and you can definitely consider it debunked, if you will. It was just a late-night jump to a rather narrow thought-experiment about what I thought was being described.


[1] It was bad enough at a 'clan meet', the other day.
...so I tend to put on a mask of universal amiableness when it comes to other meet-and-greets and I'm sure that the more perceptive acquaintances can spot it as 'false', though not necessarily why it is.
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Magmacube_tr

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #590 on: April 12, 2023, 03:42:06 pm »

Ugh.
 
I see those bastards who call their transphobia and bigotry as protecting children, and fume. Reaaon? I mean, what gallantry, right?

When those children who you are claiming to protect get traumatised and die because of the persecution you yourself put upon them, that is not exactly protecting them is it?

Just say you are a bloodthirsty maniac who delights in seeing children die, like you are. You are not fooling anybody

SPINELESS VERMIN
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McTraveller

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #591 on: April 12, 2023, 03:48:12 pm »

What's that quote from CS Lewis?  Ah yes:

Quote
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
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alway

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #592 on: April 13, 2023, 06:47:36 pm »

Missouri AG just banned effectively all transition related healthcare for all people with an "emergency order": https://mobile.twitter.com/ErinInTheMorn/status/1646579015719813139
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Great Order

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #593 on: April 13, 2023, 09:43:39 pm »

It feels like the US, over the past 6 months to year, has really just leaped off the cliff after spending so long teetering and threatening to jump.

It's like the abortion ban just unleashed a torrent of hateful insanity.
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I may have spent too long in darkness
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Frumple

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #594 on: April 13, 2023, 10:32:06 pm »

For what staggeringly little it's worth, it's not all of the US. Mostly just the GOP parts. The SCOTUS pissing on precedent like they did and strongly signally the conservative majority means the court's willing to make batshit insane rulings definitely did exacerbate things, though.

... I'd probably expect it to get worse before it (hopefully) gets better. There's a presidential election next year, reactionary fucksticks aren't going to get quieter in the near future :-\
« Last Edit: April 13, 2023, 10:33:58 pm by Frumple »
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Vector

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #595 on: April 13, 2023, 10:46:31 pm »

I fucking told people. But no. They wouldn't listen. It was "just politics" they said.

(I don't mean here. I mean IRL where they have been treating me like I am complaining about nothing for years).
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"The question of the usefulness of poetry arises only in periods of its decline, while in periods of its flowering, no one doubts its total uselessness." - Boris Pasternak

nonbinary/genderfluid/genderqueer renegade mathematician and mafia subforum limpet. please avoid quoting me.

pronouns: prefer neutral ones, others are fine. height: 5'3".

Great Order

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #596 on: April 14, 2023, 04:27:17 pm »

Welp, spent £100+ on tucking underwear. They arrived, and they're not really all that similar to how they appeared on the site. Made of some crappy thin material that you can literally see through that feels artificial as all hell. Took them far longer than they'd said to arrive too, and it seems unlikely I can get a refund due to them being based in a foreign country and having a no refunds policy.

Screw you, Origami Customs.
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Quote
I may have wasted all those years
They're not worth their time in tears
I may have spent too long in darkness
In the warmth of my fears

EuchreJack

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #597 on: April 15, 2023, 06:39:27 pm »

Welp, spent £100+ on tucking underwear. They arrived, and they're not really all that similar to how they appeared on the site. Made of some crappy thin material that you can literally see through that feels artificial as all hell. Took them far longer than they'd said to arrive too, and it seems unlikely I can get a refund due to them being based in a foreign country and having a no refunds policy.

Screw you, Origami Customs.
Looks like you got scammed.
In the future, you'll want to stick with reputable vendors.
Best to get advice from folks before spending that kind of money.

And screw you, Origami Customs!

Oh, they're in Montreal. You can probably get a refund from them.
Protip: Complain in French, if you possess that language knowledge.

scriver

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #598 on: April 16, 2023, 08:25:50 am »

I'd try for a refund. A try doesn't cost anything (other than the anxiety of writing the mail, I know ;) ) so it's worth a go. 100 pounds is a lot of money and I'd let the anxiety of losing those fuel my heart against the anxiety of having to interact with strangers, if it were me
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Great Order

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Re: LGBTQ+ Thread
« Reply #599 on: April 16, 2023, 01:16:39 pm »

I am trying. Filled out their "contact us" form since that's the only real way to get in contact it seems.
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Quote
I may have wasted all those years
They're not worth their time in tears
I may have spent too long in darkness
In the warmth of my fears
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