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[PatrikLundell]

The only tame animals that need food are grazers, so a tame GCS doesn't need to be fed (but they can't be fully tamed, and so need regular retraining, which involved giving them a random piece of food).

My understanding is that unhappy thoughts from masterworks clothing being destroyed aren't particularly harmful because the clothiers get more than enough happy thoughts from producing new ones. However, I dispose of worn and sub quality clothing through the garbage disposal services, a.k.a. caravans.

[DwarfStar]

The only tame animals that need food are grazers, so a tame GCS doesn't need to be fed (but they can't be fully tamed, and so need regular retraining, which involved giving them a random piece of food).

Ah right. So, same problem.

My understanding is that unhappy thoughts from masterworks clothing being destroyed aren't particularly harmful because the clothiers get more than enough happy thoughts from producing new ones. However, I dispose of worn and sub quality clothing through the garbage disposal services, a.k.a. caravans.

That’s true in general, and that’s the connection to why my silk farm indirectly caused the unhappy dorfs: because I had over produced, I had stopped production of new clothes long enough that those unhappy thoughts (probably combined with “unable to practice a craft” thoughts) built up enough that a few clothiers started to get depressed.

[FantasticDorf]

The only tame animals that need food are grazers, so a tame GCS doesn't need to be fed (but they can't be fully tamed, and so need regular retraining, which involved giving them a random piece of food).

Ah right. So, same problem.

Fully tame GCS's can be obtained by and from Kobold's since they amass those creatures for their poison, often you will never preface with a kobold site without a artifact rumor leading there and caves are normally unseen on the map, not to mention kobolds tend to get thinned out by megabeasts anyway. If there's any theif activity, leave out some bait, let rumors perpetrate into your tavern and pile in excess soldiers to retrieve livestock.

A alternative option is that in the same world as a hearthsperson scout out areas of interest to try and make them visible to your pre-existing site, then retire and reload your fort (not ideal due to disurption of liquids/objects/dwarves)

[DoubleG]

Impressive. How many Z levels does that take up? Some of the designs I've seen online go to extremes. This one seems more manageable.

[DwarfStar]

My design is just two level. The wiki example has a third level, but it doesn’t seem necessary to me. I think a lot of folk go to a lot of trouble to make sure the falling webs don’t hit dwarves. In previous versions maybe that caused more damage than it does now? I have seen it happen with this design (it showed up in combat reports) but the dwarf didn’t take any damage.

[hanni79]

Has anyone tested if there were viable targets for tame GCS in 47.05 ?

I modded GCS to lay eggs so I can fully tame them, but had found no target which tame GCS would actually spew webs at.

Also, using three levels has one serious advantage, you can add two bridges to control falling webs. just use a 2 x 1 minecart setup with pressure plates. One gets hooked up to the first layer, the other one to the second layer (and the door of the lowest layer). This way you can easily control access to the gathering room as well as prevent falling webs onto your dwarves  .

[DwarfStar]

I still don’t understand what the third layer is for. Maybe you need it because you use a retracting bridge instead of raising? The raised bridge blocks LOS between gatherers and GCS/bait, right up along the fortifications. Sure some webs get atom smashed, but is quantity really a problem?

I could put a door on the collection room, but I don’t think it’s necessary, and it would risk trapping a dwarf inside. I actually am forgoing the collection room entirely in my latest fort, just having the webs drop down right next to the workshops. I do have the landing zone marked as low traffic, and I do get a job cancellation message about once a month because “webbed”. But it seems to have no serious effects on the unlucky dwarves. I think the concern about injuries from falling webs must have been fixed since that lore came about.

Don’t know anything about tame spiders. I can tell you that trained ones make a lousy defense force, because I just tried it. Spider ichor everywhere. And the legs. So many legs.

[DwarfStar]

Actually maybe my experience is relevant to your question. Here’s the scene. One trap-avoid (modded) gobbo makes it past the magma traps, towards a field of cage traps in front of my GCS pen. I figure it’s a good time to let the GCSs out to see if they want a bite. They do not. They do not attack or throw a single web, just running panicked en masse. The goblin was still hacking away at fleeing GCSs until I sent in a squad to dispatch him.

So maybe experiment a bit before you plan any elaborate traps. Perhaps as part of the GCS nerf a few versions back, trained (and therefore also maybe tame) GCSs were nerfed even worse.

[hanni79]

I still don’t understand what the third layer is for. Maybe you need it because you use a retracting bridge instead of raising?

Yes, I use retracting bridges. Two of them prevent LOS of the Bait. I don't know if damage from falling webs is still a thing, but I didn't want to smash dwarf heads just to test it.

[anewaname]

Very light falling items could destroy ears or noses in previous versions and might still be able to in the current version.

[DwarfStar]

I just checked my weavers and I didn't see any with damaged noses or ears, so maybe that was indeed fixed. There's a data point, at least. Here's my latest setup, since pictures are worth 1000 words:



Lowered bridge



Raised bridge blocks LOS



Webs fall into production area one floor below.

[DwarfStar]

Two new GCS experiment data points to report. In the interest of dwarfy science, I modded my GCSs to be war trainable, to see if that would hell. First test after training, a couple of stray goblins, resulted in complete failure. Not a single attack or web thrown by GCSs, who got taken apart methodically by the goblins while attempting to flee (they literally got tired and had to catch a breather in the middle).

I was about to give up, but then a forgotten beast snuck into my fort due to a construction oversight and ended up in my GCS pen. Somehow they were willing to fight, and as soon as the beast was webbed he fell into a cage (not an accident since they are on every tile there). So that worked. No idea if the war training was important to their willingness to attack.

This actually matches up with my experiments with non-tamed spiders although it may be a coincidence (i.e. it might be for different reasons). I can never get them to attack or web anything but semi+ mega beasts.

[Bumber]

Sounds like they're retreating due to morale. I've had the HFS avoid my dwarves when I had too many well-trained, well-equipped squads together. Moving some of them away caused the HFS to attack.

What if you mod GCSs to have legendary discipline? Or just have more allied creatures nearby?