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Author Topic: Age of Ideas IC: Hello World (7/16)  (Read 4791 times)

Glass

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #45 on: December 24, 2020, 10:20:08 am »

Luck also argues against Unique’s uniqueness!
You’re not unique! You just steal from others, just like Contradiction! You grab for ideas like everyone else! You don’t have any unique ideas, because all you do is copy what others do! And even if uniqueness was something you could be more or less of, you’d be the least unique of all of us! Everything about you is lies and thievery and meanness!

Not satisfied with their work yet, Luck also decides to negatively influence all of Unique’s luck!
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Quote from: FallacyOfUrist (on Discord, 11/15/21)
Glass is, as usual, correct.
Yep, as ever, I bestow upon Glass the expected +1
I'm gonna say we go with whatever Glass's idea is.

Demonic Spoon

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #46 on: December 24, 2020, 10:40:16 am »

Everyone is Unique in their own Unique way. Therefore the rest of Ideas are also Unique. This is why Unique must copy the rest of the Ideas. You are all special to Unique. If Unique is equally Unique to Unique individuals than Unique is Unique just like the rest of them!
Argue [Cont.]: While I still maintain that uniqueness is not in and of itself a property any ideas possess, including [Uniqueness] itself, to humour the rebuttal of the non-unique one for a moment-

By copying all of us, you are decreasing overall levels of claimed uniqueness, because there are now another of us, thus negating any potential uniqueness by virtue of our supposed special oneness. These are the actions of an [Imitation] idea, not an [Uniqueness] idea, further proving the falsity of the [Uniqueness] idea.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2020, 10:57:36 am by Demonic Spoon »
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TricMagic

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #47 on: December 24, 2020, 11:12:01 am »

Everyone is Unique in their own Unique way. Therefore the rest of Ideas are also Unique. This is why Unique must copy the rest of the Ideas. You are all special to Unique. If Unique is equally Unique to Unique individuals than Unique is Unique just like the rest of them!
Argue [Cont.]: While I still maintain that uniqueness is not in and of itself a property any ideas possess, including [Uniqueness] itself, to humour the rebuttal of the non-unique one for a moment-

By copying all of us, you are decreasing overall levels of claimed uniqueness, because there are now another of us, thus negating any potential uniqueness by virtue of our supposed special oneness. These are the actions of an [Imitation] idea, not an [Uniqueness] idea, further proving the falsity of the [Uniqueness] idea.
Rebuttal:But is not the very idea of ruling all unique to it alone? Where others have weakened by refuting ones means, they weaken by taking from the very base of yourselves. None of you are unique, but they are in this series of actions.
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Stirk

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #48 on: December 24, 2020, 11:40:55 am »

Luck also argues against Unique’s uniqueness!
You’re not unique! You just steal from others, just like Contradiction! You grab for ideas like everyone else! You don’t have any unique ideas, because all you do is copy what others do! And even if uniqueness was something you could be more or less of, you’d be the least unique of all of us! Everything about you is lies and thievery and meanness!

Not satisfied with their work yet, Luck also decides to negatively influence all of Unique’s luck!

Unique is a Unique Idea! Scarcity is also a Unique Idea! Nobody can Copy Unique since Unique is the only one who gets the outermost edge making Unique the best Copier. Luck is currently trying to reduce Luck, by Luck's logic Luck is less Luck because of this.

Everyone is Unique in their own Unique way. Therefore the rest of Ideas are also Unique. This is why Unique must copy the rest of the Ideas. You are all special to Unique. If Unique is equally Unique to Unique individuals than Unique is Unique just like the rest of them!
Argue [Cont.]: While I still maintain that uniqueness is not in and of itself a property any ideas possess, including [Uniqueness] itself, to humour the rebuttal of the non-unique one for a moment-

By copying all of us, you are decreasing overall levels of claimed uniqueness, because there are now another of us, thus negating any potential uniqueness by virtue of our supposed special oneness. These are the actions of an [Imitation] idea, not an [Uniqueness] idea, further proving the falsity of the [Uniqueness] idea.

Special twoness is just as special as special oneness. You are all Unique to Unique even if there are two of you. Especially if one of the two of you belongs to Unique, making it more Unique than the original who was already Unique and special! Imitation is also Unique, since every Idea is Unique and special! If Imitation is Unique than Imitation actions are Unique actions, so it is fine if Unique makes Imitation actions since they're actually Unique actions.

Besides it says right here:

Quote
Core Idea: Near-equivalent to spheres in most god games, must be unique. Opposites of existing Core Ideas encouraged.

So all Core Ideas must be Unique!
« Last Edit: December 24, 2020, 11:44:24 am by Stirk »
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Glass

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #49 on: December 24, 2020, 01:01:48 pm »

Luck also argues against Unique’s uniqueness!
You’re not unique! You just steal from others, just like Contradiction! You grab for ideas like everyone else! You don’t have any unique ideas, because all you do is copy what others do! And even if uniqueness was something you could be more or less of, you’d be the least unique of all of us! Everything about you is lies and thievery and meanness!

Not satisfied with their work yet, Luck also decides to negatively influence all of Unique’s luck!

Unique is a Unique Idea! Scarcity is also a Unique Idea! Nobody can Copy Unique since Unique is the only one who gets the outermost edge making Unique the best Copier. Luck is currently trying to reduce Luck, by Luck's logic Luck is less Luck because of this.
No, you lost your luck privileges when you decided to be mean! And you're just as copyable as everyone else! Scarcity isn't unique, it's just derivative! Nothing about you is unique in the slightest!
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Glass is, as usual, correct.
Yep, as ever, I bestow upon Glass the expected +1
I'm gonna say we go with whatever Glass's idea is.

Nakéen

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #50 on: December 24, 2020, 03:53:51 pm »

Contradiction is still Unique.

CONTRADICTION IS CONTRADICTION

Luck also argues against Unique’s uniqueness!
...You just steal from others, just like Contradiction!...

LUCK LACKS UNDERSTANDING OF CONTRADICTION!

CONTRADICTION "PONDERIZES" CONTRADICTION

Quote
Indeed, what is an Idea? What are these thoughts, and ideas that the Greater Ideas think and share and use?
Where do we come from? Where do they come from, these foreign and unknown ideas? What are words?

Contradiction begins to realize, Ideas are already everywhere, and they were probably here before they were here. How contradictory!

Ideas giving birth to Ideas, but Ideas use Ideas that have yet to be? Contradictory!

Aren't Actions by themselves Ideas?

Contradictions understands that it does not understand, and that it understands things it does not understand.

And such Contradiction is perfectly fine...
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Glass

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Very Scary Solstice (7/16)
« Reply #51 on: December 24, 2020, 05:49:04 pm »

Luck also argues against Unique’s uniqueness!
...You just steal from others, just like Contradiction!...

LUCK LACKS UNDERSTANDING OF CONTRADICTION!
Nonono, I meant "they steal from others, such as you", not "they steal from others, like you do".
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Quote from: FallacyOfUrist (on Discord, 11/15/21)
Glass is, as usual, correct.
Yep, as ever, I bestow upon Glass the expected +1
I'm gonna say we go with whatever Glass's idea is.

Kilojoule Proton

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #52 on: December 26, 2020, 06:53:24 am »

Age of Ideas: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea

Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there!
He wasn't there again today,
Oh how I wish he'd go away!


William Hughes Mearnes, "Antigonish" (excerpt)



Aside from a large argument involving fully half of the Greater Ideas, a grand project setting out to order events so as to make them understandable was uncovered by the combined efforts of Fate and Silence. Possibly tied to this, the Idea of Identity, though not a Greater Idea, has risen a bit beyond an easily absorbed Lesser Idea. (The implications of such an ascension are rather worrying, of course.) The Idea of Identity has presented a massive collaborative Project to usher in the next Age:

(GLOBAL) WORLD. Creates a world. Action cost is halved if participants successfully elect an architect with support from at least 50% of all participants. Any participant may add any Idea-feature to the world unless vetoed by the architect (if there is one). (Accepts most any Idea unless vetoed by the architect, 18A)

Participation requires only Practicing one Idea-feature on this Project. Nominations/voting are free actions.

As pretaliation for Unique's attacks on Luck and other Greater Ideas in the upcoming past, Luck cursed Unique with particularly bad luck. Luck sensed that this curse was sufficient to flip the results of approximately two actions.

Contradiction stopped fading and absorbed Correspondence while thinking about sounder ways to refute false Ideas. As Leads go, it seems to be a relatively straightforward one that will provide a thematically appropriate use of the Idea of Contradiction along with Leads on relevant improvements. Contradiction also ponderized Contradiction and the strange ways in which the world works.

Silence ruminated on Fate's grand Lead to completion. This uncovered an incredible Project to impose linear time on the fledgling universe, but its exorbitant cost seems to prevent its use for now. Still, with this discovery, tiny microcosms operated by Lesser Ideas appear to be more tangible and stable, although they still seem to be lacking something vital.

Fate absorbed Revelry and Boundary. Idol also tried to absorb Revelry, but it didn't quite work out due to their relative Orbits.

Chaos finished studying Project Scramble and the concept of Trade. The former revealed the Scramble Project, which would give all actions a small chance of going extremely well or poorly, and a number of Leads aimed at improving it further. The latter unlocked the Trade action. This allows Greater Ideas to exchange Ideas peacefully.

The Trade action is now available. Greater Ideas may now offer up to one Idea to another Greater Idea offering up to one Idea.

Idol absorbed Merriment and Addiction and began gathering a surprisingly large following among the Lesser Ideas. Does it actually make sense for an Idea to follow another Idea? Only time will tell (perhaps literally).

Unique attempted to copy Silence, and despite pronouncing rebuttals to Luck and Fate, Unique succeeded in manifesting Silence of a sort. Unique also attempted to copy Fate, and indeed, a piece of the Fatal Idea entered Unique's grasp. Finally, Unique set out to copy Chaos and narrowly failed seemingly purely due to Luck's curse.

The War of One and Many

Great memetic storms flared throughout the universe as Fate and Luck questioned Unique's Uniqueness. Lesser Ideas beneath the Greater Ideas' notice also joined in this heated argument and variously merged, self-contradicted, won, and lost in droves.

Luck argued against Unique's core Idea of Uniqueness and cited Unique's thieving and relatively unoriginal ways. This lightly insulted Contradiction thanks to the magic of syntactic ambiguity. Unique's rebuttal drew attention to Unique and Scarcity being Unique Ideas and Unique's Unique position on the outermost Orbit making Unique the best at copying. Unique also countered that Luck's Luck reduction effect reduce's Luck's Luck. In response, Luck pointed out that Unique isn't any different from any of the other Greater Ideas and thus not particularly Unique. In the end, Luck prevailed, and the Idea of Unique was released with minor weakening.

Not one to be left out, Fate also argued against Unique in response to Unique's upcoming attempt to copy Silence, Fate, and Chaos. Fate, too, decried Unique's lack of Uniqueness and called on the Idea to give up the pretence. Unique's reply emphasized the Unique Uniqueness and specialness of everything, and Fate countered that no Idea can properly be described as Unique and that Uniqueness was actively reducing what Uniqueness they did have by copying Ideas. This puzzlingly drew in Idol, who was otherwise uninvolved in this conflict, but Unique summarily ignored it and pointed out the glaringly obvious fact that all Greater Ideas' cores were Unique in a sense by definition/fiat. Nevertheless, Fate, undoubtedly helped by Luck's curse and the inauspicious conjunctions of Contradiction, Silence, and Luck, prevailed in the end, and it was in this way that the Idea of Unique was released with some damage.



The accuracy of divinations seems to have improved for some reason. There is an unprecedented five-Greater Idea alignment of Fate, Silence, Luck, Chaos, and Unique. Broken up into conjunctions, Fate observes a conjunction of Silence, Luck, Chaos, and Unique which is likely to make important decisions both riskier and more rewarding. Silence observes a conjunction of Luck, Chaos, and Unique (with these three in opposition to Fate), and this is likely to be a mildly auspicious sign, Luck observes conjunctions of (Chaos and Unique) and (Silence and Fate) in opposition, and the net effect will likely be that actions taken now will be both less risky and more dangerous. Chaos observes a triple conjunction of Luck, Silence, and Fate all in opposition to Unique which signals an auspicious time for refutations. Finally, Fate, Silence, Luck, and Chaos, all previously wronged by Unique, are in conjunction. While decisions are likely to be riskier and more rewarding for Unique just as they are for Fate, this alignment of Unique's enemies is, on the whole, a ruinous omen.

The disposition of the Lesser Ideas appears to have changed subtly and variably. For some Ideas, the ascension of Identity is taken as a promising sign that conflict is an excellent way to gain clout. These Ideas yearn for another large argument among Greater Ideas. For other Ideas, Identity represents the first of something fundamentally different. These Ideas have pledged to work on the world Project. Still others mock the world Project as a foolish dream and are content to simply watch as far as anyone can tell.
  • Outrage (:3, sentient)
  • Consistency (:1, sentient)
  • Center (:3)
  • Unique (:3, weak, sapient!)
  • Glory (:3)
  • Acquiescence (:1)
  • Alignment (:2, sentient)
  • Balance (:1)
  • Normal (:1)
  • Projection (:1)
  • Gluttony (:3, strong)
  • Bifurcation (:3)
  • Conformity (:3)
  • Unity (:3)
  • Change (:4, strong, sentient)
  • Identity (:4, sapient!)

It is currently the Age of Ideas. Speech has been discovered but not Naming. Three actions are available for each Greater Idea.

Spoiler: Status (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Actions (3 available) (click to show/hide)

The next update is scheduled for 48h (2d) from now or after everyone posts whichever comes first.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2020, 04:34:18 am by Kilojoule Proton »
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Demonic Spoon

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #53 on: December 26, 2020, 07:14:58 am »

Request: All comply with the temporal compact. This is free.

Permission granted: Copying Continuity or Order to practice BEGIN.

Consternation.

Weakness.

Vulnerable.


Accrete [Fate]: Fate accretes Revelry into themselves to recover from their wounds.
      /vvvvvvv
Fate  Revelry
      \^^^^^

Argue [Scarcity -> Silence]: You talk too much! Blah blah blah! Silence is broken by your every flapping idea noise! You keep breaking and breaking it, so it should break for good! No more silence for you!

Argue [Scarcity -> Luck]: Luck is a fallacy of flawed minds. It does not, in fact, exist. Randomness is real. Go study statistics already you stupidhead!
« Last Edit: December 26, 2020, 12:52:08 pm by Demonic Spoon »
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Stirk

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #54 on: December 26, 2020, 08:29:25 am »

scarcity sees the flaw in father unique's plans. if the greater ideas are not unique then they must be unscarce. if they are unscarce they must be made scarce. scarcity will cull the greater ideas until they are made scarce. scarcity will be the only greater idea left. then scarcity will be unique.

scarcity activates his lesser luck idea to tap into internal luck alteration, countering luck's evil curse by improving his own luck.

scarcity activates argue against the weakened 'greater idea' luck, to make scarcity's luck the only luck on the board. luck shalt be made scarce.

luck is defined as 'success or failure brought by chance rather than one's own actions'. by definition any entity including ideas who alter 'luck' are making an action, and thus not leaving things to chance.  by forcibly lowering or raising a targets chances you arn't really relying on luck. it would be like a casino rigging the games and insisting that by doing so they're only relying on luck. anyone who isn't a sucker can clearly see that this is simply not the case. by actively working to limit the effect of actual luck you are reducing the amount of luck in everything you touch. all your powers do is reduce the amount of chance and ergo luck involved in anything it can effect. can you truly say that crossing out the four and five on a dice and replacing them with sixes makes the game more chancy?

scarcity activates argue against the weakened 'greater idea' fate, to make scarcity's fate the only fate on the board. fate shalt be made scarce.

fate is said to be inevitable and uncontrollable. by having power over fate, you prove that fate is neither inevitable nor uncontrollable and thus not fate. how can you say something is set in stone, when you, scarcity, or anyone else with power over fate can indeed change the stone as easily as they can change their mind? it would be as if silence spent all its efforts making noise. your very nature disproves the 'greater idea' which it is based on. what is 'fate' supposed to be when anyone can make it do whatever they want?
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TricMagic

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #55 on: December 26, 2020, 10:16:16 am »

ResolveResolveResolve

Idol releases a song called "Resolve of Identity" in celebration of it's ascension. And continues to gain crystallization, seemingly in contrast to contradiction and other lower ideas messing with her. Meanwhile, she nominates Change to lead the world project as Architect, as such a change to life must have one suited to lead it.
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Demonic Spoon

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #56 on: December 26, 2020, 12:27:03 pm »

scarcity sees the flaw in father unique's plans. if the greater ideas are not unique then they must be unscarce. if they are unscarce they must be made scarce. scarcity will cull the greater ideas until they are made scarce. scarcity will be the only greater idea left. then scarcity will be unique.

scarcity activates argue against the weakened 'greater idea' fate, to make scarcity's fate the only fate on the board. fate shalt be made scarce.

fate is said to be inevitable and uncontrollable. by having power over fate, you prove that fate is neither inevitable nor uncontrollable and thus not fate. how can you say something is set in stone, when you, scarcity, or anyone else with power over fate can indeed change the stone as easily as they can change their mind? it would be as if silence spent all its efforts making noise. your very nature disproves the 'greater idea' which it is based on. what is 'fate' supposed to be when anyone can make it do whatever they want?
Rebuttal: I have never claimed to control Fate, or indeed anything in particular. I am merely the idea of fate which does not exist within this non-existent ideosphere. You have thus proven nothing about the controllable nature of fate, and are rambling wildly about nothing of consequence. Those who think that they control fate merely because they have copied the idea of this ultimate truth, is in and of themselves the greatest fools. It would be like a idea that has copied the idea of existence and believing they can now make anything they want to exist. An idea is merely an idea.

Fate is the ineffable truth, the ultimate reality, the inevitable conclusion to all that is and is not. All is fated. All is as it is, because it was meant to be so. What you do does not matter. What I do does not matter. Or at least, it only matters as a part of the grand plan that is everything. I am a puppet, as are you, and everyone else. My speaking parts merely speaking as willed by fate, who arranged this entire conflict for thus is the proper course of things.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2020, 12:55:38 pm by Demonic Spoon »
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crazyabe

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #57 on: December 26, 2020, 12:30:43 pm »

Absorb: Unique

Extrapolate: Complexity
« Last Edit: December 26, 2020, 12:44:34 pm by crazyabe »
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Demonic Spoon

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #58 on: December 26, 2020, 12:41:21 pm »

Argue [Scarcity -> Scarcity]: Scarcity isn't even a real idea! It's just a state or resource shortages in realspace environments! We're in an ideosphere where nothing exists! Go away! Nobody likes you!

Argue [Scarcity -> Silence]: You talk too much! Blah blah blah! Silence is broken by your every flapping idea noise! You keep breaking and breaking it, so it should break for good! No more silence for you!

Argue [Scarcity -> Luck]: Luck is a fallacy of flawed minds. It does not, in fact, exist. Go study statistics already you stupidhead!
« Last Edit: December 26, 2020, 12:56:58 pm by Demonic Spoon »
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crazyabe

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Re: Age of Ideas IC: Do not Trust the Lesser Idea (7/16)
« Reply #59 on: December 26, 2020, 12:44:49 pm »

Quote
Argue [Scarcity -> Scarcity]: Scarcity isn't even a real idea! It's a state or resource shortages in realspace environments! We're in an ideosphere where nothing exists! Go away! Nobody likes you!
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