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[sketchesofpayne]

I've had one guy picking fist fights and he ended killing someone and sending his wife and son the the hospital.  There are 2 problems I see.  First is that the other people don't fight back, no matter what -- and nobody else intervenes.  So that means the stressed out guy just keeps wailing on their target until they snap out of it, or *hopefully* the target goes unconscious and gets carried off to the hospital. The second problem is that they just keep going even after the target has passed out -- which can result in the death of the target.

The target should respond.  They are panicked -- you can see it in their thoughts, but they don't run away.  They don't fight back.  Possibly they will go off to do a job if one comes up, but they are divorced from the fight in every way, except for getting beaten to death.  Also, the fight should end on some kind of trigger -- not just when some random time is up.  You've broken the guy's arm -- it's time to stop!  You've exploded their leg into gore -- well beyond time to stop! They've passed out... No, you shouldn't take that as a queue to grab their neck.  There's a difference between a fist fight and murder.

But, my fighting dwarfs *do* end up with disorderly conduct.  However, if you don't have a sheriff/captain of the guard, people won't report it, so there will be no witnesses.  I locked up my murderous dwarf for 28 days (after a beating), but realising he'll definitely kill again (his combat skills are getting quite good), I'll have to exile him, which is a shame.

I've noticed these stress related fights often don't get reported.

I don't know if I can replicate it, but I had a dwarf who started picking fights.  When he did, the captain of the guard/mayor saw him and smacked him around until he was unconscious.  He was taken to the hospital, healed, and a week or two later started another fight.  The captain of the guard was on him like a rat on a Cheeto and knocked him out again.  After another hospital visit the dwarf entered a state of depression and just wandered around very slowly.  He didn't have any family in the fort so I expelled him to another site, but he starved to death on his way off the map.

[FantasticDorf]

I had a fight crime report break out after a dwarf tried to assault a dog, picked it up then kept dropping it leading to multiple cases of the same charge of assault because it couldn't punch it properly with the fighting rules after the dwarf underwent a lot of stress, it was witnessed & reported (which is important, crimes are omniscient and the dwarf probably has to KNOW who the captain of the guard is)

Captain of the guard later kills criminal by ripping their throat out with his teeth in the middle of a beating to bleed to death until i simply exiled and killed him, later bust someone's toe into a bloody pulp for a unrelated incident caused by stress while dishing out another beating. here's the report if you're looking for guard violence. http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=10861

Besidest that, i dont really see dwarves lean towards vandalism, though tell a lie i have had a dwarf attempt to destroy a door but was unable to actually finish the job so until i did something about it (i can't remember exactly what) they got stuck in a beserk state even while being calm without the targeted door to destroy because id removed it.

[andrei901]

I haven't read through the whole thread, so I don't know if this is a well-documented effect or not, but putting my dwarves in military squads set to train 2 months out of the year significantly reduced the number of stressed dwarves in my fort. I have professional L+5 axe/fight/dodge/armor+ squad leaders as trainers, and the repeated skill gains seem to keep dwarves happy.

Edit: actually, one of my military dwarves was constantly on the verge of happy/unhappy, and had the "constant state of internal rage" trait, and after retiring them from active duty to lead calisthenics with the civvies, they are now ecstatic.

[PatrikLundell]

It's known that a very common need for dorfs is to engage in martial arts. As far as I've seen, that need is fulfilled by increasing a military skill, so I don't know what happens long term, when they get very good, and thus rarely improve. One month is often not enough to get even recruits to improve, but two months seems to do it usually.
Once a need is fulfilled, getting to fulfill other needs helps further.

[FantasticDorf]

Moving people in and out of squads will cause spam (each instance of leaving and rejoining is kept in the units history), its much more efficient to alter the schedules of static inactive squads and set certain dwarves up for training, this effectively can help militarise your fortress when they wear their armor & weapons to their professions.

Very handy in a hostile enviroment or in the event of expecting a siege to arrive.

[andrei901]

It's known that a very common need for dorfs is to engage in martial arts. As far as I've seen, that need is fulfilled by increasing a military skill, so I don't know what happens long term, when they get very good, and thus rarely improve. One month is often not enough to get even recruits to improve, but two months seems to do it usually.
Once a need is fulfilled, getting to fulfill other needs helps further.

That's the thing though -- most of my civvies hate violence or try to avoid violence, and most of them still have the "haven't trained a martial art" negative thought for most of the year (starts a month or two after training finishes), but they also maintain "improved a skill recently" at x4 or x5, due entirely to their militia training (I watched a few closely, they did not always improve other skills).

I do not know if the skill gains will slow down appreciably, but my training squad leaders have all their weapon/armor/dodge/fighter/shield/discipline/teacher/student/a few others at L+5 (and likely way higher than +5, in reality, 18 years of non-stop military training will do that). This makes training pretty quick.

[Bumber]

Do the squad leaders have their "martial art" / "improved skill" needs fulfilled?

[taleden]

Does anyone know what specific event satisfies the need to BeWithFriends or BeWithFamily?

I'm working on a dfhack script to induce dwarves to seek out activities to satisfy their needs. I've got it working now for praying and reading a book, but I can't seem to figure out what it is a dwarf needs to do to satisfy their friends/family needs.

I assumed at first they would be covered by a "Socialize" (activity_event_socializest) event involving the dwarf and an appropriate companion (a Friend or a Mother/Father/Spouse/Child, respectively). But even when I can get two dwarves to go to the same tavern room, engage in the same social activity (unit.social_activities[0]) and participate in the same Socialize event (activity.events[0].participants), even as they cycle through branching events like "Recite Poetry", "Tell a Story" etc, their need focus level is not refreshed.

Then I thought maybe Socialize was too general, maybe they needed to engage in a more direct interaction. So I tried to assign them to converse with eachother (activity_event_conversationst), but they seemed to reject that as invalid and wouldn't even path to the tavern room to do it, or if combined with a Socialize event then they'd go, but by the time they got there they would have canceled their activity_event_conversationst so the result was the same as above.

So I made a repeat-every-tick monitoring script to detect when those needs were refreshing naturally, and noticed that it didn't seem to be happening in the context of any idle social activity, it seemed to just be when the friends/family happened to be in adjacent tiles while pathing somewhere. So I tried creating "Clean" jobs for the two dwarves targeting the same coordinate in the tavern room, just to get them to stand next to eachother for a bit, but that didn't seem to do it either; whichever one got there first would just loiter for a moment and leave, I guess because they noticed there was nothing to clean.

Can anyone think of any other kind of activity I could programmatically force two dwarves to engage in that will actually trigger their BeWithFriends/Family need?

[PatrikLundell]

When I lock a married couple into their bed room with no zone painted, I've noted "I spoke with the spouse" thoughts (and the female was pregnant as well, which was my primary objective). I know I've seen thoughts about speaking with family members other than spouses, but that was only in retrospect, with me not knowing what had happened earlier.

If I were to try it out, I'd lock friends into a room, paint a tavern zone, and let it go for a bit. Then I'd for check need satisfaction. If that doesn't work, I'd remove the zone and wait a bit further. I expect either of the two would do it, but I have no evidence for that assumption.

[taleden]

Yes, I think you're right that manually locking doors or assigning burrows will probably do the trick eventually. But that sounds pretty tedious, so my goal is to find a way to automate that process by using dfhack to detect dwarves with urgent BeWithFriends/Family needs and specifically induce them to seek eachother out, I just can't figure out what exactly to make them do that will satisfy those specific needs, since "Socialize" doesn't seem to be it.

[PatrikLundell]

That's why I suggested performing some locking up experiments to see what it takes. I've seen locking two compatible dorfs in a room painted with a tavern zone will get them hitched, but I haven't tried without it (socializing works sufficiently well). I've also gotten the impression socializing gets in the way of procreation, so I don't use a zone for that case (again, I haven't tested it rigorously).

I previously had the impression at least one of the candidates needed to recognize the other, but I've since managed to go from stranger to married (although I tend to have to let them out once in a while, as booze and/or food tends to run out).

[Immortal-D]

Based on what I have observed, 'Friends / Family' is taken literally.  The act of socializing is separate from being near (and socializing with) loved ones.  Being in a Tavern with others will develop relationships and fulfill 'need to party, away from people (Dwarves) in general', but the friend/family need actually requires a Dwarf designated in the relationships as friend or family.

Dwarves can have preferences for shapes and colors -- what does this apply to, if not decorations?

That's a very good question.

[taleden]

Based on what I have observed, 'Friends / Family' is taken literally.  The act of socializing is separate from being near (and socializing with) loved ones.  Being in a Tavern with others will develop relationships and fulfill 'need to party, away from people (Dwarves) in general', but the friend/family need actually requires a Dwarf designated in the relationships as friend or family.

Yes, but my point is that even partaking in the same social activity (identified by unit.social_activities[] and activity.events[].participants) with a friend (not mere acquaintance) or immediate family member (parent/spouse/child, not mere grandparent/uncle/niece/etc) as designated in the "relationships" screen does not seem to actually fulfill the need to "be with friends" or "family", respectively. So I agree that it require some kind of activity with a friend or family member, but it's not clear exactly what kind of activity qualifies.

[DG]

Maybe being/sleeping in the same owned room/bed at the same time? Just spit-balling. The idea of being with family by spending time with them at "home".

[fortunawhisk]

What if you added a pause and recenter to your script, see what they're doing when the need gets reset? If it turns out to be purely a proximity thing, maybe operating a pumpstack? If it turns out to require idle (or social activity) plus immediate proximity, maybe programmatically assign them to a burrow until the need is met?