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Author Topic: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace  (Read 25404 times)

evictedSaint

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #330 on: June 24, 2019, 03:46:42 pm »

Still mulling over T5 Tactics, but in the mean time, here's something else to mull over.

Quote
[OUR] (MRD) <Indolence> Gen A.1.0

Our Multi-Role Destroyer "Indolence", Generation A, Version 1.0.

The Indolence is not a direct combat vessel, but rather a dedicated support ship.  It is Destroyer-sized and builds off the success of our prior Deliverance-Class carrier vessels.  Similar to real-world Navy destroyers, the Indolence is capable of performing a number of support measures at the expense of combat capabilities.

The Indolence features two new pieces of technology integrated into the design.  The first is a Repair Bay, featuring drones, tools, and supplies needed to enact field repairs.  Ideally, this should prolong the ability of our Capitol Ships to remain afield before returning home for repairs and refits.  The Repair Bay makes use of Ichor in order to custom-manufacture parts, graft onto existing parts, and to recycle parts that are beyond repair.  The Repair Bay also allows us to enact limited scavenging missions post-combat, increasing the recovery rate of Relentless wings and bolstering our TOMES stores.

The second piece of new technology is a modification of our Tremor torpedoes.  These torpedoes have been converted into proximity-based anti-ship mines.  Upon passively detecting enemy signatures within range, the torpedo will activate, orient towards the target, and attempt to strike.

The Indolence also features an integrated Queen's Whisper module, allowing it to remain passively in systems with enemy fleet elements.  This allows the Indolence to perform passive surveillance.  Additionally, the Whisper can be extended to cover any anti-ship mines seeded within the system.

Repairs, mines, and surveillance.  The Indolence may not be terribly active, but its support will not go unnoticed.

Power: probably Avarice reactors, if we revise them out of the ship
Engines: may need to be custom, to prevent bore signatures.  Ion, perhaps? Doesnt need to be speedy.
Weapons: aside from the mine-laying, probably one or two Small. 
Bore: Queens Path, probably.  Maybe a Frigate-sized Path, since it shouldn't need to bore anyone other than itself.
All tentative.  Haven't really thought out the fine details, yet.

Madman198237

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #331 on: June 24, 2019, 03:55:30 pm »

I'm not sure we want to tie those capabilities together. We'd be sending relatively expensive ships meant for fleet support a long distance away from any friendly fleets, while also having stealth and recon capabilities raising the expense of a vessel spending all its time in the midst of a combat fleet.

Ideally we'd produce a subsize recon Frigate capable of actually being very hard to detect, and a service Destroyer capable of being very good at repairing vessels and salvaging things post-battle. Obviously we don't really design actions to spare, so I don't know if we'd want to do it that way or just accept having a jack of all trades that is kinda expensive.
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evictedSaint

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #332 on: June 24, 2019, 04:32:58 pm »

It's more expensive TOMES-wise, but far cheaper dice-wise.

Considering real-life destroyers perform multiple tasks, I don't think marrying together repairs and mine-laying to be that far outside the realm of possibility.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2019, 04:34:37 pm by evictedSaint »
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Madman198237

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #333 on: June 24, 2019, 06:35:03 pm »

Real life destroyers don't face the same problems we have, though you're not wrong.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #334 on: June 27, 2019, 08:18:12 am »

Right, I'm going to vote for Plan A. If anyone spots anything that should be changed, do tell. I feel reasonably confident that it should all work as written, but I have but one set of eyes; the more people look over the plan, the more like we are to iron out any issues and make it the best plan possible.

Plus, more importantly, it dilutes responsibility if something goes wrong.

Quote from: Votebox
Plan A: (1) NUKE9.13
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Madman198237

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #335 on: June 27, 2019, 09:14:07 am »

Quote from: Votebox
Plan A: (2) NUKE9.13, Madman

Double-checking Plan A now.
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Strider03

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #336 on: June 27, 2019, 01:01:50 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
Plan A: (3) NUKE9.13, Madman, Strider03
When/where do names of the new ships get put in? Only once they've been successfully made?
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"But deceleration is for pansies. We're headed for the stars. Bye, Burnsie. Bye, Mission Control. Bye, Sol. See you at heat death" -Blindsight

NUKE9.13

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #337 on: June 27, 2019, 02:19:20 pm »

When/where do names of the new ships get put in? Only once they've been successfully made?
I mention the names of all named ships in the Fleet Orders section, including the newly built "Noblesse Oblige" and "Big Stick".
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Strider03

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #338 on: June 27, 2019, 02:30:07 pm »

Ah, got it. I was looking at the stuff at the bottom and not seeing anything.
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Within that world, she was God. But here, outside of it, her name was Yoake o-Shiri. That was unimportant. She was a Godslayer. That too was unimportant. But what was important, was that she had a motherfucking boat.
And by God, was she going to use it.

"But deceleration is for pansies. We're headed for the stars. Bye, Burnsie. Bye, Mission Control. Bye, Sol. See you at heat death" -Blindsight

evictedSaint

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #339 on: July 03, 2019, 12:38:13 am »

[WE]



HOLI Wars
Chapter 2

Quote
The shuttle favored function over comfort.  It was safe, and she felt appropriately secure in the harness, but it was designed primarily to haul resources to orbit.  Living creatures would survive just as well, but there was an unmistakable note of tension as the retro-thrusters fired.  She spent most of the landing sequence nervously plugged into the drone pilot’s consciousness, her eyes tracking the phantom images of indicators and gauges.  Altitude dropped and the rails came into view.  So gently she almost missed it, the shuttle touched down and locked into the orbital sled waiting for them.  The brakes hissed, and just like that she was home once more.
 
The Queen and her Princes disembarked quickly.  The Queen took a moment to enjoy the feeling of planet-bound deck plating under the soles of her vacuum suit.  The shuttle enjoyed no such rest; there was a scant few hours before the sun would creep up over the horizon.  Already drones were crawling all over it with tools in hand.  Some maintenance, refueling, reloading, and the shuttle would be prepped for launch within the day.  The Hiver War Machine chugged on.
 
The rest of the trip was uneventful.  A freight elevator took them down into the safety of the canyons, and from there she immediately requisitioned a tram to take her and her entourage to the [Council].  The Hiver population collectively sat at more than twelve billion living bodies, with the majority of those colonies clustered in the overcrowded canyons that spiderwebbed their world.  Indeed, as the tram carted her through Canyon C.4.A – also referred to as the [Nexus] – the Queen couldn’t make out a single patch of bare dirt through the window.  Everything was paved, braced, cemented, structured, and reinforced.  Roads and conveyors, rails and winches, smokestacks and air vents.  The only thing visible through the dense smog was industry.  Bustling.  Efficient.  Unceasing.  Here on the night-side of the planet, the only lights were the blazing industrial lamps that illuminated the churning mass of workers choking the landscape.  Blips popped up and faded on her psionic awareness as they zipped past Drones and their Prince overseers.  Even the rare Princess, somewhere deep in the canyon wall, would briefly brush past.  Each and every one of them working.
 
The [Nexus] was the center of Hiver civilization on Regalis – the closest thing to a city they had.  It was the largest canyon on the planet and with enough open space for a truly impressive industry.  The highest-ranked Queens made their colonies here, and the local bloc of the [Council] out-sized the next largest by a hefty margin.  There were perhaps forty thousand Queens and their respective colonies on Regalis, and though most linked into the psi-com network for [Council] business from the comfort of their colonies, it wasn’t uncommon for them to converge to a meeting point for more serious discussion.  That meant there were several “hot spots” around Regalis where the local Queens would meet, and from there they could loop into the [Council]’s psionic consciousness as a group.  Aside from common Lineages, this was one of the main way factions could form in the Hiver government.
 
The Queens of [Nexus] met in a [Vault] that pulled double-duty as an auditorium.  Like the [Nexus] itself, this was one of the largest [Vaults] on the planet.  Ironically, the auditorium was generally pretty empty unless current events dictated otherwise.  In a surprising coincidence, it seemed like current events dictated quite the commotion.  She could sense the psionic cloud of the [Council] well before the [Vault] came into view.  The sheer size of the psionic presence was like a magnetic field surrounding the area.  It was practically electrifying, dominating the local psionic communication field.  The Queen tapped into the outer fringes of the bubble as they approached, and the discussion became clearer as the distance shrunk.
 
 
{…preliminary reports regarding contact in Echo and Oscar…}
 
#...disgusting display of opportunistic colony-grabbing.  The space was promised to…#

<…to arrive and answer shortly.  The Queen of ‘Free Trade’, however…>

-=…justified, entirely, in the skirmish.  Private, non-essential, and well within rights.  Your assertion…=-
 
\…analyzed and available for dissemination, imminently.  For [Council] purview…/

(…development of Ichor should maintain priority, if for no other reason…)

#...threats will not be tolerated.  Your last Princess was met with the same reaction, if you attempt…#

<…understand, she is not available to deliver her account first-hand, but the Princess-Captains have…>


The Queen disembarked the tram, her focus lost entirely within this hub of Hiver consciousness.  She moved on autopilot.  Her Prince guard maintained their perimeter around her in lock-step, and maintenance drones scurried to the side as they escorted her to the main chamber.  Unlike the rest of the Hiver homeworld, the [Vault] was one place where aesthetics were given consideration.  The floor was of precision-cut metamorphic rock, polished to a high sheen and inlaid with geometric spirals of burnished metal.  The walls rose on pillars of stone, curving into curious archways and curls that simultaneously provided both support and beauty.  Recessed lights cut beams of light through the air, and hidden machinery clicked and whirred within the walls. 

It was a place where the world matched the mind.

The auditorium was towards the center of the building.  The grand archway opened into massive hall, in which hundreds of Queens sat.  She had never seen so many Queens in one place her entire life.  To an outside observer the hall would seem unsettlingly quiet; no louder than your local library save for the creak of chitin and the tap of feet on stone floors.  To a sapient creature (at least by Hiver standards) the room was nearly deafening.  Dozens of psionic conversations, each with hundreds of active participants all speaking at once, overlapped one another.  Each Queen participated in at least three or four discussions at once, and she could even spot one Queen looped into no fewer than twenty-one bubbles simultaneously. 

And that was all just those in the room with her.  The Queen found an open cell in which she could settle her physical body and get comfortable.  The cell was fitted with nutrient dispensers, egg cradles, waste disposal units, and everything an active Queen might need for an extended stay in the [Council] chambers.  A bump in the psionic bubble rippled past.  It was a murmur of congratulations for a Queen a few cells down from where she’d settled who had just laid an egg for a Princess.  Princesses were relatively rare – most Queens didn’t have more than sixty at any given time.  Unlike a Prince, the gestation of a Princess wasn’t something a Queen could voluntarily influence while expanding her colony.

The Queen of the No Fair Fight maintained a smaller colony than average by necessity.  There simply was room or need to keep 300,000 Drones aboard a Wrath-class cruiser; for many Queens, this was a deterrent from joining the Fleet.  Considering how she was a member of the [Sky Breakers], a maintaining a smaller colony size came naturally to her.  In fact, her Lineage was disproportionately represented amongst the Fleet.  This had led to some concern among the other Queens that her Lineage Bloc might attempt a coup of some sort, but the idea was laughable.  Any attempt at a coup would result in the easy extermination of any [Sky Breakers] still residing on Regalis, and without a friendly port a traitorous Fleet wouldn’t last very long. 

Now that she was settled into her cell and hooked into the [Council]-wide psi-com network, the Queen focused on throwing up flags for a discussion of her report.  Topics of discussion went through a quasi-vote system in the [Council].  A Queen would build a series of psionic flags regarding what she wanted to discuss and affix it to the bubble.  Interested Queens would stake their tag to the flag, and once the initiator felt there was enough of an audience she could launch into her discussion.  It was a bit of an artform, really.  You could flag individual Queens to get their attention, flag the topic by importance, and even stake your ranking on the topic.

She was by no means a professional at topic flagging, but thankfully her topic was interesting enough by itself that as soon as she staked it a number of other interested Queens immediately tagged themselves to it.  Considering how quickly interested parties were flocking to her flags, she decided to wait a bit longer for a more sizable audience before beginning.  In the meantime, the Queen tagged herself to a few other ongoing discussions and listened in.

#...would have expected a [Queen Slayer] to make such a brazen display of aggression.  This expansion was a blatant, open-faced attempt for a proper staging on [Forge Tender] colonies further north.  You will repay the material lost, return the territory, and - if what you claim is true - you will also terminate your Rogue Princess.#

-=Paranoia.  [Deep Ones] are prey Lineages.  She has proven herself capable, and a skilled warrior, and the colony will be hers.  Whatever trade deals you had with your [Deep Ones] you may maintain with her.  I’ll not terminate a healthy Princess – especially when she is no longer a Princess.=-

~You’d prefer war, then? In the midst of invasions from the stars, of more [Silent], of the peak of our civilization, you’d threaten war?~

-=The only ones threatening war are you and your ilk, [Forge Tender].  While the other Lineages expand, you judge us by our blood and keep us contained.  If you will judge by blood then so shall we; [Deep Ones] are not worth the blood of Queens, as my dear Princess-Queen has proven.=-

~Slaughter is not proof.  Your expansion is dictated by the [Council].  This was not sanctioned.  If you are unable or unwilling to control your daughters then the Eastern [Forge Tender:Nexus] Bloc will.~

-=She is [Annointed].  By right she’s proven herself and will join the [Council], maintain and grow her colony, and be equal.  Are you so threatened by a new colony of [Queen Slayers] that you would send your children to our nutrient vats?=-

#Brazen.  Know that [Forge Tenders] will not be threatened.  Even without the support of the [Sun Drinkers], we could drive you to the brink of extinction through numbers alone.  Remember that.#

-=Ah, so easy would be our destruction…one might be believe you don’t really fear this lone Princess-Queen who has so bravely carved her home in the skulls of those beneath us…=-


Though she didn’t actively participate in the territory dispute, the Queen of the No Fair Fight kept an ear on the conversation.  Her old colony – the one maintained by her [Annointed] daughter – was high up the canyon wall above the Eastern [Forge Tender:Nexus] Bloc.  A war there would undoubtedly affect her.  She did a quick scan and was disappointed to find her daughter wasn’t here.  That was to be expected.  The LEC tower her daughter managed could leave little time for local politics, as she well knew.  The Queen split her attention easily and looped herself in on another discussion; this time, one with significantly more active participants.  Queens from all over Regalis were looped in on this discussion, and the psionic storm took a moment before she could make sense of it.

{…failure. Conflict at Oscar was lost.  The [Silent] have installed their Drones on the planet and driven [Our] fleet from the system.  The Fleet Commander – Queen Q.1.2.1.2.2.3.1 – has been terminated.}

!Unfortunate! *Shame* /Loss is inevitable\ <Sacrifice>

{Significantly out-numbered, by secondary reports.  Three [Silent] Cruisers, fourteen Small Craft, numerous Fighter Craft.  Fleet losses number at 1 Wrath, 3 Deliverance, 375 Relentless.  [Silent] casualties estimated at 9 Small Craft, less than 400 Fighter Craft.}


The psionic equivalent of a hiss rippled across the comms as thousands of Queens simultaneously expressed their displeasure.  It was a severe blow to the Hiver war machine.  It wasn’t quite crippling, but they’d lost one of their precious few Wrath’s…and without anything to show for it.

\Foolish Queen, to stand against such odds.  Conserve is the wiser action.  Did she think herself noble?/

<Brave.  [Silent] are unknown, it was a gamble to try and force them from the system.  They bleed, it may have been possible?>

&Is the [Silent] Fleet inexhaustible?  Three Cruiser-class ships? &

+Desperate, perhaps.+

#Discussion flag raised: increase in War Spending to bolster Fleet Materiel# (Joined) $Joined$ ~Joined~

{This tale is not complete.  Patience.}


The discussion chittered into a dull psionic roar as the Queen running the discussion called for calm.  A moment passed by and the impatience in the [Council] chambers became nearly tangible.

{The [Silent] employ Small Craft which collide with our ships.  Heavily armored, impossible to stop.  These craft erupt after collision.  Self-sacrifice – termination to cause casualties.}

‘Their shipyards must be inexhaustible, to afford self-termination as a means of conflict.’

*Can we compete?  To spend so easily.  Their stores must be a wealth to behold.*

(Such a wasteful weapon.  The Queen’s death is understandable.) <Agreed> &Agreed&

{The Queen did not die at the hands of this weapon.  The damage inflicted was crippling.  Her ship was left at the cusp of death.  Unable to fight or flee, she ordered the remaining fleet to retreat.}

<Then how did she die?>


There was an uneasy calm as thousands of Queens simultaneously processed this information and came to the logical conclusion.

{The [Silent] executed her.  From afar.}

The sudden withdrawal in the discussion was like when the water in the underground sea receded.  A pause, while the wave of fury gathered strength.

<executed.>

*A defeated Queen, unable to fight or flee.*

EXECUTED.

(She was defeated, surely they understood.)

#EXECUTED.#

^Monstrous, disgusting, vile, Queen-killing parasites.^

\Why? But why?  They had checkmate.  Why?/

$Queen Killers.$

[To slaughter a Queen at your mercy…perhaps they wish to ensure the nature of our conflict is not misunderstood.]

%Perhaps they’d mistaken her ship as combat-capable?%

{Their action was deliberate.  Reports indicate no attempt to capture or communicate.  Her ship indicated no signs of combat capability; the [Silent] were aware of what they were doing.}


The pitch-black fury of tens of thousands of Queens was so strong it nearly choked the discussion.  Queens died in combat from time to time.  Whether through accident, or because they wouldn’t surrender – it happened.  This…this was different.  The Queen of the No Fair Fight scanned the reports herself in an attempt to forestall her own growing disbelief. 

The Free Trade had been crippled - by all accounts - and left dead in the water.  The [Silent], without a word, had observed her vulnerable position.  They’d calculated her threat level.  They’d determined that she was unable to fight or flee.  They had her 100% cornered and at their mercy.

And they’d fucking killed her anyways.

{Emotions. Check. Maintain discussion purity.  Kindly curtail bleed-through.  Discussion will move into preventative measures for future conflicts.  See tangential discussion regarding War Spending and Increasing Fleet Materiel.  Now…}

The black, choking fury abated, fading instead into a dull, stormy background noise.  The Queen who’d headed the discussion was unsurprisingly one of the older Queens.  More experienced, high-ranking, and used to curtailing the frizzy tangents that a large discussion could sprout.  Predictably, she was a [Primordial].  Stuffy, political, and conservative.

The lull in the discussion had helped out the Queen of the No Fair Fight.  Queens who had been focused on the [Primordials] discussion now turned their attentions to the rest of the [Council], and her flags were interesting enough to draw quite the crowd.  As a matter of fact, she’d just broken a thousand tagged Queens.  It was a bit unsettling; it was far more of an audience than she’d ever had before. 

No time like the present.  The Queen steeled herself, prepared her psionic message, and opened up her flags to discussion.

[Queens of the [Council].  We have encountered another species.]

[Another species, capable of psionics.]



« Last Edit: July 13, 2019, 08:37:55 pm by evictedSaint »
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NUKE9.13

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #340 on: July 17, 2019, 06:37:49 am »

People wanted some lore from a drone's perspective. Bloody boring though such a perspective may be, I wrote some.
Seeking approval to post it in the core thread. Not that I feel it's interesting enough to share on its own merits, but it should put an end to the requests.
Obviously, if anyone has any suggestions for changes or whatever, I'm all ears.

Quote
Here we have a drone. It is holding a laser drill, and standing perfectly still, in an unlit tunnel far beneath the surface. It has been standing here for half a Regalian day, although it does not know this. It is aware that it is hungry, but it was strictly ordered to stand here, and has not received new orders.
drones do not have names. Most drones do not even have individual designations. It is an ongoing debate amongst Hiver philosophers whether a drone even thinks of itself as an individual. Not a particularly lively debate, because nobody really cares that much- so long as they do their work effectively and efficiently, what goes on inside their heads is irrelevant.
So this drone was known to its superiors only by its batch number, d.1207.1.3.4.2.1. There were seventeen other drones with the same designation; there had been twenty-two initially, but two were defective and had been recycled, and three had died in mining accidents. We will call the drone d.1207, for convenience's sake.

d.1207 is going to die. This is unfortunate, as their body will not be recovered before lesser life forms find and consume it, thereby wasting perfectly good nutrients. The tunnel that d.1207 is standing in is in fine condition, but a tunnel above collapsed due to an unpredicted earthquake damaging a section that was being repaired. The collapse was not instantaneous- the damage was noticed, and an evacuation ordered. However, P.59.1.3.4.2.1, who was the overseer responsible for d.1207, was behind the damaged tunnel section, and decided not to risk delving into the depths just to order d.1207 (and a handful of other drones) to the surface. For this he will be reprimanded, but not excessively, as the value of the drones lost is relatively insignificant compared to an experienced mine-overseer like P.59. It will take several Regalian days for the tunnel to be repaired. d.1207's equipment will be recovered, and the work it was engaged in will be taken over by another drone.

d.1207 is not aware of this. If someone explained to it the situation it was in, what would it do? Most likely nothing, as its previous orders would still apply. If there were enough drones in the tunnel with it, it is possible that they would together come to the conclusion that their deaths would be a burden on the colony that would best be avoided. To actually act on this conclusion would require an incredibly unlikely spark of inspiration, but it could happen. In which case they would collectively retrace their steps, attempting to return to the surface. Upon encountering the blocked tunnel, they would stop. Incorrect handling of a damaged tunnel could cause further damage, and the cost to the colony would be greater than the cost of a dozen drones. As mining drones, they have had this basic fact hammered into their chitinous skulls, and so they would not make any further attempts to save themselves, but would simply accept death.

Fundamentally, d.1207 knows that it has no intrinsic worth as an individual. Considering how often it is reminded of this, it would be hard to forget, and its limited intelligence is insufficient to attempt to question something that has been made so abundantly clear. It has, of course, a set of basic animalistic survival instincts, but it has been taught to suppress them if obeying them would harm the colony (so, for instance, a drone will not touch a hot stove, will avoid falling rubble, will drink when thirsty... unless doing so would countermand their orders).

What more can be said? drones just aren't that interesting.
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mightymushroom

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #341 on: July 17, 2019, 03:52:37 pm »

((I hope I don't get in too much trouble for posting as a longtime observer rather than a player -- but so long as I stick to literary criticism...))

May I suggest writing at least one draft in the perspective limited third person voice (even if not the final draft), similar to the stories of the princesses and queens? Show me the hapless drone struggling between hunger and self-preservation vs. obeying orders. I think doing so could provide the reader with a more visceral sense of the drone's unimportance. Among the higher castes self actualization is tolerated (and perhaps expected as one of several considerations for promotion?) so long as the achievement of this one individual contributes to the success of the colony and even of [We]. Drones never expect that they know better or understand what others like/above them do not: that's the big, alien difference you want to emphasize. But at the same time as you repeat the axiom that Drones Die, still I – as a human reader rather than an alien drone – would expect that most drones at least prefer to keep working as long as their bodies are productive. My big question, then, is "Why isn't this one acting?" (They might, as this one will, die without quite realizing it regardless of intent, but that, too, is an alien difference you can play with.)

Does this nameless drone have any inkling why it was commanded to stand still in the first place? (Perhaps when the first report of the earthquake and instability came through, hint hint?) By what reasoning does it conclude that awaiting new orders is a better course of action than attending to its own hunger? Or scouting the damage from the cave in (possibly making a psychic report if contact is reestablished)? What obedience and/or trust does it have in its overseer that it believes being in this place, totally unmoving, is more valuable to its brood than leaving and working again some other time? Right now the treatment is a bit heavy on the intellectual explanation in proportion to the feelings it feels and thoughts it thinks (or doesn't think, as the case may be). Your 'drone story' is in there, but the current version lacks conflict and resolution except where that hypothetical group tries to act, then concludes that they are likely to make things worse without proper guidance. Can't the same apply to this one drone, with smaller weights on the scales?


-----
Related to my dissatisfaction, here are some lore questions that might come up despite your effort to end drone inquiries:

Quote
It is aware that it is hungry, but it was strictly ordered to stand here, and has not received new orders.
When you say "strictly ordered" to stay in place, are there grades of orders or are they always so overwhelming?

Quote
Fundamentally, d.1207 knows that it has no intrinsic worth as an individual. Considering how often it is reminded of this, it would be hard to forget, . . .
How often is "often"? What form(s) does the reminder take?

Quote
. . . and its limited intelligence is insufficient . . .
I was under the impression that some fraction of the intellect of higher castes is a result of borrowing (no permission asked, of course) "spare" thought cycles from their underlings. In that case, might a drone left alone actually be smarter (to a surprisingly small degree, but still) than one in the middle of the group think? Note that smarter in this case need not lead directly to being less obedient. If you know intrinsically that your life is of small value, then being smarter only increases the possibilities against which that small value might be compared.

Quote
If there were enough drones in the tunnel with it, it is possible that they would together come to the conclusion that their deaths would be a burden on the colony that would best be avoided. To actually act on this conclusion would require an incredibly unlikely spark of inspiration, but it could happen.
This bit almost suggests a level of collective thought above the capability of an individual drone. Is such group thinking part of the lore that I missed picking up somewhere, perhaps related to the amount of "spare" thoughts mentioned above? Or is it merely because even drones of very small worth start to add up to something valuable when massed together? I'm a bit unclear.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #342 on: July 17, 2019, 04:20:47 pm »

Oh, hey, thanks for the feedback! I'm pretty sure that it's fine, so long as you don't come close to giving mechanical advice. Lore is fun, but in most cases not mechanically relevant.

You've provided a lot to think about. This especially struck me as interesting:
I was under the impression that some fraction of the intellect of higher castes is a result of borrowing (no permission asked, of course) "spare" thought cycles from their underlings. In that case, might a drone left alone actually be smarter (to a surprisingly small degree, but still) than one in the middle of the group think? Note that smarter in this case need not lead directly to being less obedient. If you know intrinsically that your life is of small value, then being smarter only increases the possibilities against which that small value might be compared.
I hadn't considered this angle- that a group of drones left alone for long enough would start to use their spare mental capacity (that is otherwise used by their superiors, or dedicated to their work). That presents an opportunity to actually have the drone do something interesting, as it slowly starts to question things- providing a means to illuminate aspects of a drone's life-, before finally 'unlocking' some measure of independence... and then getting shot when the tunnel is repaired, since its superiors know full well what happens if drones are isolated for long enough, and rather than try to deal with the now annoyingly independent drone, they just forcibly recycle it.
I think I might start writing a lore piece based on this idea.

---

Anyway, to answer (some of) your other questions:

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My big question, then, is "Why isn't this one acting?"
I mention that drones are trained to ignore their survival instincts if ordered to.

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By what reasoning does it conclude that awaiting new orders is a better course of action than attending to its own hunger?
It doesn't. It doesn't even think about it. As mentioned, it would require several drones cooperating to even process the thought.

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What obedience and/or trust does it have in its overseer that it believes being in this place, totally unmoving, is more valuable to its brood than leaving and working again some other time?
Absolute and total obedience and trust. Like, to a degree that is completely alien to humans. At best, drones are like robots- the concept of questioning orders is simply not a thing.

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When you say "strictly ordered" to stay in place, are there grades of orders or are they always so overwhelming?
There are grades of orders, yes. It isn't always necessary to micromanage a drone, so less strict orders that leave more to the drone's interpretation are sometimes acceptable. In this case, the overseer didn't want the drones wandering off, and- unnecessarily- gave them very strict orders to stay still.

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How often is "often"? What form(s) does the reminder take?
I'd say about once a year drones visit a [temple] for [education]- in which they are reminded about the divinity of Queens, the value of obedience, and the lack of a drone's individual worth. In addition, princes and princesses will sometimes just mention in passing that drones have no individual worth- like, the relevant tags are just added to an order.

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This bit almost suggests a level of collective thought above the capability of an individual drone. Is such group thinking part of the lore that I missed picking up somewhere, perhaps related to the amount of "spare" thoughts mentioned above? Or is it merely because even drones of very small worth start to add up to something valuable when massed together? I'm a bit unclear.
Yeah, I've mentioned before that drones share the burden of thought amongst themselves- in fact, a totally isolated drone, with no contact with any other Hivers, will be notably less competent.
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evictedSaint

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #343 on: July 17, 2019, 05:32:02 pm »

Weighing in with my two cents here:

I know it's been floated a couple times, and I've already expressed my opinion on the matter, but I am fundamentally opposed to religion (organized or otherwise) in Hiver society.  What's more, I think I've finally figured out why the concept bothers me so much.

Organized Religion has historically been a method in which a small subset of humans can influence the actions of a larger subset of humans, either for good, ill, or otherwise.  It imposes restrictions on how to think, how to believe, and how to behave.  I think the reason I'm very much against religion for [We] is because I think this concept is redundant with regards to how Hiver society works.  There already is a mechanism with which to control large subsections of the population.  The Drones don't need to think of the Queen as God, she already is God.  Furthermore, they shouldn't even have the spare time to consider that possibility, since their brains are tapped for thought cycles.  And even if they did consider the possibility, their society is 100% geared towards this caste system.  They don't have a reason to oppose their place in society because it's wired into their very DNA.  An enlightened Drone would have no way to affect change, nor should he have a reason to oppose his position. He simply is.  He is cog, fundamentally inferior to Princes, who are fundamentally inferior to those above them.

My point (if I've failed to get it across) is that we are applying human ideals and methods of thinking to an alien species.  If we reach the points where Drones can obtain enough independence to effectively vote (under the right circumstances), then I feel we've strayed too far from what makes the Hivers an alien species.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2019, 06:21:14 pm by evictedSaint »
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mightymushroom

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Re: [We] Empire Thread | Hivers | GalactiRace
« Reply #344 on: July 17, 2019, 09:23:22 pm »

If we reach the points where Drones can obtain enough independence to effectively vote (under the right circumstances), then I feel we've strayed too far from what makes the Hivers an alien species.

I want to say, to you both, that independence is not really what I meant to get at with all my questions about what drones are thinking and how much. (Although I see that my ramblings could be mistaken that way.) I tried to say that I think the lore piece would (possibly, not certainly) be more interesting to read were the drone's thoughts dramatized instead of the lecture-y tone presented. The questions were supposed to highlight where human expectations might point and thus where the contrast of the alien nature might be uncovered.

I hadn't considered this angle- that a group of drones left alone for long enough would start to use their spare mental capacity (that is otherwise used by their superiors, or dedicated to their work). That presents an opportunity to actually have the drone do something interesting, as it slowly starts to question things- providing a means to illuminate aspects of a drone's life-, before finally 'unlocking' some measure of independence... and then getting shot when the tunnel is repaired, since its superiors know full well what happens if drones are isolated for long enough, and rather than try to deal with the now annoyingly independent drone, they just forcibly recycle it.
I think I might start writing a lore piece based on this idea.

I can wholly accept as a point of lore that a drone will obey an order to stand motionless until it starves to death. (Whether that still applies to a group that, as you say, might be able to "pool their resources" is a different matter and up to the team to argue.) But for the purpose of d.1207's singular story, the idea I've synthesized from the draft presentation plus past lore on thought capacity (plus my own wishful thinking probably) is that as time passes without contact* it might, dimly, be able to recognize that the situation is changing. It's more and more hungry / thirsty / tired if nothing else, and it's not getting new permissions to attend to those needs nor fresh reassurance that this all part of a plan. So, desperate for affirmation that it is still doing the "right" thing, it starts to wonder (a term used very advisedly) what directions it ought to pursue in the current context. Yet, limited by its own drone-ness it imagines only the identical orders it last received. If it must be recycled at the end of this, it would be because it has locked itself into this cycle and is too catatonic to understand new commands rather than because of human-style rebelliousness.


*Which brings to mind another question that I, as a test audience, might like to see answered: I know that increasing ranks have increasing psionic range. In this scenario is the trapped drone truly alone, or "merely" cut off from the chain of command while still able to sense the (remote and far too busy to interrupt with trifles like starving to death) presence of its ultimate Purpose?
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