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[Sheb]

I'm confused are we all going to gang up on the Empire or should i start saving up to pay the taxes?

As loyal Imperial subject, the Bannerstock Guild encourage all nations to accept that the Empire, while not as powerful as it once was, remains the best hope for peace and harmony on this planet, and we urge all to pay the taxes the Imperial Treasury needs to keep our planet safe.

[Tiruin]

I'm confused are we all going to gang up on the Empire or should i start saving up to pay the taxes?

I'm going to gang up on them I'm just playing with them till I get my moneys.

You see me saying 'hey dudes pay taxes', because that is pretty much legally true--if you pay, no worries. They don't even extort you anyway, and that is pretty much my belief; if we can work with the Empire, why not?
But some people disagree and probably killed their tax collector. I don't know :v They got creative. I wish I was that creative. :I
Hence me also mentioning my 'ulterior' motive, of siding with the rebellion because I want to--it doesn't stop people from actually siding with the Empire and gobbling up players though. But we will grump about it!

At least I will. ._. But not too grumpy though to make grudges or enmity! Just an 'aurgh, whyyy' sort of grump. It'll be much less if you provide a nice quality level of flavor, but I'm veering off the point.

You can choose to pay taxes, if it's not that much of a harm to your economy (probably gain trust, too?), or you can choose to outright go against them. I've made it public that the Alliance will HELP people going against them by saying 'nah leave it to us, we know their language better than you. Trust us [also give us money, thanks! ]'

I think we're rushing the rebellion bits though, I doubt the Empire will mobilize everyone by Turn 11, we've got 3 turns at least before they even move anything at this rate. More, if they believe me.

[Kashyyk]

Spoiler: Imperial Response to the Brimstone Republic (click to show/hide)

Before we can even talk about the matter of vassalhood, I think you need to understand something about the Republic.
 We are not some single unified totalitarian government, but a collection of great houses, that each look out for their own interests and the interests of their lands and work in concert and respect for one another. As such, over time houses rise, and houses fall, they shrink and grow, and power shifts between hands. The idea of asking those in power now to pay taxes money you think was earned by other people years ago is completely unworkable. Even if what you asked did not far exceed anything reasonable, it would still be absurd to try to shackle the present with the past when there is a lack of continuance between the two. Therefor, even if it was possible to wrangle the great houses together into some type of system where they send a cut of their profits to the empire, paying your backtaxes is frankly impossible. I do not believe that discussion with the houses will be possible so long as that is on the table. If you wish us to convene and discuss the future with you, I am afraid that you must first discard the past.

//ooc: Paying back taxes, at least anything more then a symbolical tiny amount (something that Bartio can pay out of pocket like 200-300), isn't going to be possible. If that's something that can't be taken off the table, then there's no diplomacy to be had. If they can agree to that, the brimestone republic would be willing to go forward in negotiations to see what the ongoing tax situation would be, and what benefits the empire would be willing to provide to this poor backwater nation. Primarily the republic would be interested in trade and investment into the business of the great houses, you know, if negotiations somehow reach that point.

I see. My associates will endeavour to seek out each of the noble houses that still exist, and ensure the tax they owe to the Empire is thus paid. We are after all obliged to consider the actions of ones self and one's house in the past when negotiating with them in the present after all. To not do so would be to wilfully refuse the lessons the past has to offer.

OOC: You've pretty much already done so, but at this point we can continue IC negotiation until you decide what terms you wish to to push for. Things like a reduced back tax, reduced current tax, presence (or absence) of an imperial garrison, Imperial trade, etc are all possible items. Once you have decided, I'll throw some dice and present you with a few options. These represent the absolute best terms you were able to negotiate, and you will need to either pick one, or reject them all.

Also question for Kashyyk... Is it allowed to research... Something on the chain of research before you have the thing you need if you're researching that thing in your turn? Hah.... Like, for this turn if I wanted to spend some money on infrastructure II, could I also put money towards infrastructure III, hoping that infrastructure II is completed with the money I gave it? (and I guess if the first research fails to be researched the money I put into the secondary research gets... Uh. Just sits there? Or maybe gets deleted or used up to research the first one or something?)

I'm afraid not. Any money put towards research has to be on a technology you have the prerequisites for at the start of the turn.

[Criptfeind]

So, to clear up any confusion. No. Fuck the empire. To those of you that want to be an imperial pet, the empire is saying you'll have to bring us in line if you work for them? I'll take that as a sign of enmity from those that agree to do so. At least, if it's not some sorta plot to fuck the empire further. Honestly, there is gray area. But you'd better belive we're going to be on the watch out for any traitors in our midst when it comes time to take down the empire...

[Taricus]

I'm confused are we all going to gang up on the Empire or should i start saving up to pay the taxes?

We're gonna gang up on those fucking purple lardasses and give them a dead hard smack for the incredulous demands placed on us when they have given us NOTHING. So long as it stands, there can be NO peace!

[Tiruin]

I'm confused are we all going to gang up on the Empire or should i start saving up to pay the taxes?

We're gonna gang up on those fucking purple lardasses and give them a dead hard smack for the incredulous demands placed on us when they have given us NOTHING. So long as it stands, there can be NO peace!

FINALLY someone feels my earliest pain :V
And nobody helped me with that hmph
Although seriously. The only reason I'm saying 'yeah sure let's be buddies' is because I would pull a Brutus if ever they station armies at my lands.

I mean surely if I build walls, they'll just camp outside anyway (we pay upkeep but :v) and then our longbowmen will 'defend' against their attacks in our lands if ever they'll pretty much do anything.

But yeah. I sorely need the money
And Kashyyk has good integrity anyway c:

[PaPaj]

Well it was fun playing becuse now i probably will get my ass raped by the empire

[Taricus]

The empire has to get there first, and that's a few turns.

[Tiruin]

The empire has to get there first, and that's a few turns.

If you can help me secure Owldale for myself, it'll pretty much ensure that you're under my protection :3

Meaning I'll stall for time for, around ~3 turns at least? And yeah, the Empire still has to get to you.

Also trade with me

[Kashyyk]

Alrighty, as this is turn requires a bit of GM interaction, I'm going to be poking people earlier so as not to delay the actual turn resolution beyond the weekend.

Still expecting turns from Ghazkull, Iituem, snow dwarf and micelus. Although Ghaz and Iituem have actually made an appearance, so they're presumably still deliberating.

I'll do some mid turn dice rolling in a bit for those who need it. Stand by.

[Criptfeind]

I'm not sure how worthwhile Tiruins protection is, but don't despair yet PaPaj. You're about to enter the world trade network now that you have a connection to Iituem. Though him you can enter trade with a whole bunch of other people, you're going to get a pretty huge amount of money for entering this network, which you can use to beef up your army, maybe take a few provinces, and then kill the empire and all their little dogies too.

[Tiruin]

I'm not sure how worthwhile Tiruins protection is, but don't despair yet PaPaj. You're about to enter the world trade network now that you have a connection to Iituem. Though him you can enter trade with a whole bunch of other people, you're going to get a pretty huge amount of money for entering this network, which you can use to beef up your army, maybe take a few provinces, and then kill the empire and all their little dogies too.

I'd honestly rather him help me kick Owldale into my side so that he can connect with me, to the trade network that way, instead of through Iiteum but whichever helps more.

...Err, and because of details I don't wish to speak about.

Alrighty, as this is turn requires a bit of GM interaction, I'm going to be poking people earlier so as not to delay the actual turn resolution beyond the weekend.

Still expecting turns from Ghazkull, Iituem, snow dwarf and micelus. Although Ghaz and Iituem have actually made an appearance, so they're presumably still deliberating.

I'll do some mid turn dice rolling in a bit for those who need it. Stand by.

GM interaction such as debating the discussion? Because I feel by the veracity of some responses, they killed your messenger or creatively did so.
The fun it would be to send in a spy in the envoy's stead to the Empire and have it work, though! :v

[Kashyyk]

Spoiler: Imperial Response to Pollock (click to show/hide)

Empire Edit 1: Push for trade, no imperial garrisons, and maintenance for Pollock troops being tax-deductable. (I expect the latter two to together be fairly neutral, diplomatic-capital-wise, particularly with my law knowledge.)
Feel them out for tax-deductions for direct economic investments and buildings that run a net local profit.

Please pick one and add it to your turn post.

Option 1: Trade with the Empire. No Garrison. Tax will be fixed at 10% of Gross income. Empire will provide a £20 tax deduction for the first garrison unit in each Pollock Territory.

Option 2: Trade with the Empire. Minor Imperial Garrison in Pollock capital and one other territory of choice.
Tax will be fixed at 15% of Gross income. For each £50 invested into a territory, the empire will invest £10.

Option 3: Trade with the Empire. Tax will be fixed at 15% of Gross income. Token Imperial Garrison that will heed all defensive orders issued by Pollock officials.

Option X: Reject all.

Spoiler: Imperial Response to the Alliance (click to show/hide)

Talarys made it noted that:
> She was asking money for compensation, with the best social skills she could at the time.
> She overtly made it a point to open up trade. (Having in the back of her mind to make a diplomat hero to oversee this)
> She wanted the absence of an imperial garrison in our lands, but probably one (their choice, we're ok with none) for the trade routes connecting us and other imperial-buddy people.
> She promised she would handle helping out with diplomacying taxes from her neighbors or others that they haven't specified but she assumes may have not paid.
> She mentions the uncivilized folks in areas of Empire domain, and mentions that her organization will also be in charge of uniting them too. {Them neutrals nearby}, and uses this point to help her earlier point of military money aid.
> However, if need be, imperial garrisons can station themselves in our lands free of toll and other maintenance tax. They are to keep to themselves and we shall provide upkeep only if they are on the warpath. [basically deny any additional info other than them placing armies on our lands; we provide upkeep, but no additional info {Note: Does not stop them from sending spy heroes that I've no tech-idea about with them so yeah :V}]
> But seriously emphasize our need of money if ever we're going to militarily help them. In all honesty, we are better off diplomacying with those organizations--and we'll promise that by getting a diplomat ready.
> Really try to be convincing that I can diplomacy them (like fluff it with 'more blood needs not be spilled, as *pointing to our name of Alliance*, we can understand their culture and why they're unruffled, and then convince them over time') :3 but time will take a while.

Please pick one and add it to your turn post

Option 1: Trade with the Empire. Alliance territory may be used as a Staging Area for Imperial Forces. Imperial Forces in Alliance territory will take Alliance suggestions under advisement.

Option 2: Trade with the Empire. Alliance territory may be used as a Staging Area for Imperial Forces. Any Alliance units attached to an Imperial Army as auxiliaries will have upkeep paid for by the Empire. Such Auxiliaries will follow all orders given by Imperial command structure.

Option 3: Trade with the Empire. Alliance territory may be used as a Staging Area for Imperial Forces. Minor Imperial Garrison across Alliance territories. Empire will subsidise military training by 10%.

Option X: Reject all.

Spoiler: Imperial Response to the Brimstone Republic (click to show/hide)

Diplomacy with the Empire: Things we seek from the empire in about this order: Reduced or wavered back taxes. Profitable trade. They can fuck off with their imperial garrison. Reduced taxes. Investment into our lands

Please pick one and add it to your turn post.

Option 1: Trade with the Empire. Tax back payment reduced to £1200. No Garrison. Imperial tax fixed at 15% of Gross income.

Option 2: Trade with the Empire. Tax back payment reduce to £800. Minor Imperial garrison in Republic capitol. Imperial tax fixed at 15% of Gross income.

Option 3: Tax back payment reduced to £800. No Garrison. Imperial tax fixed at 20% of Gross income.

Option X: Reject all

GM interaction such as debating the discussion? Because I feel by the veracity of some responses, they killed your messenger or creatively did so.

I'll let you work that one out yourself.

The fun it would be to send in a spy in the envoy's stead to the Empire and have it work, though! :v

If only someone has espionage research...

[RulerOfNothing]

Kashyyk, is it possible to research scrying and/or magical flying eyeballs that can scout provinces? If so, what school of magic would they fall under, and roughly how difficult would that research be?

[Criptfeind]

Spoiler: About the empire (click to show/hide)

Can the envoy give any hint as to how profitable trade with empire would be?

Also frankly I might need a bit to think about this, I'll try to get a decision in if the turn starts waiting on me.