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Author Topic: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!  (Read 27120 times)

Datgum

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #105 on: May 29, 2017, 01:22:01 am »

After I won my first-ever game as a MiFi I jump straight into caster world and tried to win with a DeFe. I had a few semi-deep runs but would ultimately run short on resources, get a little sloppy, and die to something like a pack of centaurs. I ended up not playing the game for a few years. Jumped back on a MiFi for this tournament and will likely win in my second attempt.

Casters are way harder than melee.
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FakerFangirl

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #106 on: May 29, 2017, 01:55:33 am »

Casters are way harder than melee.
Well you can't press auto-explore because of how unsafe it is to facecheck instead of whittling away at the fog of war before rounding corners. So casters take a lot longer to play safely. Once you hit level ~16 they gain a LOT more versatility than fighters. Of course, they also make lots of noise and can't teleport without mana. Healing potions drop a lot more than mana potions.
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Tegga21

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #107 on: May 29, 2017, 02:09:46 am »

Ugh. Really irked had a good ogre going 156hp, went downstairs, 7 gargoyle 1 war gargoyle all 3 turns away from stairs. 156>55 in one turn.  No possible escape.
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Tegga21

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #108 on: May 29, 2017, 02:20:38 am »

Wargargoyle 3d27, Gargoyle 3d12  x 7.   x2 (have to leave stairs).  Insane unavoidable d15 staircase vault.
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Tegga21

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #109 on: May 29, 2017, 02:23:26 am »

After I won my first-ever game as a MiFi I jump straight into caster world and tried to win with a DeFe. I had a few semi-deep runs but would ultimately run short on resources, get a little sloppy, and die to something like a pack of centaurs. I ended up not playing the game for a few years. Jumped back on a MiFi for this tournament and will likely win in my second attempt.

Casters are way harder than melee.

Early game melee are easier, late game a strong caster is nigh invincible.
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Graven

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #110 on: May 29, 2017, 03:41:57 am »

I'm pretty sure the only reason I'm doing so well is the lack of pressure. Last tourney I was in the champions, and I didn't get a single win, and didn't have much fun at all.

The guide said to blink out of constriction. So instead of drinking a healing potion and fighting I decided to blink away and kite because I could survive four hits at range and two hits in melee.

I got hit twice after my failed blink. T̶h̶e̶y̶ ̶w̶e̶r̶e̶n̶'̶t̶ ̶e̶v̶e̶n̶ ̶h̶a̶s̶t̶e̶d̶. Both nagas beat my 33 EV + 31 DEX + 15 SH + reflection + blink.


I had 6 potions of heal wounds. WHYYY!?!
This game is infuriating. I keep getting clearing the main Dungeon and Lair, and then just horribly dying on the first floor of whatever Lair branch I decide to do first :(
Ultrahigh spawn rates are dumb. I spent all day gathering resistances for each branch and had separate sets for rN+++ MR+++++ rF+ rCorr+ rPois+ rC+ rE+ and double mutation resistance.

But it was four lucky dicerolls that killed me this time.

Ok so I'm about to post a whole ton of somewhat basic stuff, so I'm really sorry if you already know all of this, I just haven't spectated you so I don't know what your level of play is.

Standard branch order right now is Lair -> Dungeon up to 15 -> Orc -> Lair branches (Swamp > Snake > Spider > Shoals) -> Vaults 1-4 -> Depths -> Vaults:5 -> Zot. You don't really get to deviate unless you have a very good idea what you're doing, for example Mummy or Kiku characters which like to peak around Tomb way earlier than standard, or Jiyva followers which beeline for Slime.

This gets said often, and earlier I was like "Wtf this is so not true", but you don't actually need resistances for any of those branches, except rP for Spider. Even that is doable without, but it's needlessly tedious. What you do need, is preparation for the major threats in each branch, backup plans, and always keep in mind running away and living is a lot more important than killing the thing, since thing most likely has friends nearby, while your corpse rarely does.

Also when I say "deals heavy XXX damage" I do mean heavy, as in potentially game-ending. Pay attention when fighting it, since combat in Crawl is swingy as heck.

Also also,  right now is a great chance to go spectate some people. I play on Xtahua, and there's a lot of good players here - Yermak, Charly, 4thArra - just pop in to your server of choice, see who's got a lot of spectators and go watch. Chances are they're playing a harder combo worth more points, so you're likely to see a lot of good habits.

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Lair: usually safe, since only mambas and spiny frogs are faster than you, and they aren't really herd monsters. No resistances needed, Freezing weapons are best, but you can use Venom, or whatever you have on hand, really.

- Hydras: Wands of Scattershot tend to one-shoot hydras at about 4-5 Evo skill. Hoard them and use them. Alternatively use Conjure Flame, Flaming/blunt weapons and berserk, or just walk away
- Blink frogs: they hit REALLY hard and come in packs. Lure them away and fight them one at a time. Use freezing weapons if you have them, wands of Iceblast or summons.
- Death Yaks: you probably can't take them right now. Go away and return later
- Mambas: dodge a lot, poison a lot. You can't really run away from them, so burn any wands or buff potions to survive if necessary
- Basilisks: if you don't have MR+++ you will get petrified. Don't fight them if other monsters are nearby, kite away and fight one thing at a time.

Dungeon 10-15: Be prepared to run. Out of Depth monsters, uniques and heavy elemental damage exist here, and you're probably not prepared for all of them.

- Horrible things: deal massive elemental damage. Usually there aren't packs until D:15, but treat them with utmost respect
- Meliae: deal massive smite damage. Wands if evocation is high, berserk, or just tele away if they catch you in an open room.
- Ettin: will one-shoot you. No matter how much armour you think you have, and the god of your choice save you if you're using dodging. Use currare, allies, or self-buffs, and make damn sure there isn't anything else to keep it company
- Wizards: can banish you, and deal pretty heavy spell damage. Don't underestimate.
- Liches/Ogre Mages: can use crystal spear to nearly instagib you. Seriously, thing does up to 3d30 damage. Can also banish/paralyze you and beat you senseless in the meantime

Orc: Usually ok, since nothing's faster than you, but you can get overwhelmed by Knights/Warlords/Paralyze. MR is preferable to elemental resist, if you have to choose, but be mindful of Sorcerers draining you.

- Orc Sorcerer: can paralyze you, and summon annoying enemies that mutate you. Get MR+++, or take care to not be in position to get Warlorded to death if paralyzed
- Stone Giant/Ettin: will beat you up and take your lunch money in melee. Stone giants can even stuff you in a locker from range. Use summons, self-buffs, run away
- Orc Warlord: buffs other orcs, usually has really nice weapons and a group of other orcs
- Orc High Priest: Smites, summons more demons

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Swamp: In my opinion easiest of Lair branches, if you have rPois, watch out for Thorn Hunters and have a way of killing Hydras. There is heavy physical damage, but if you play carefully and kite, you should be fine. You may need to skip the rune floor, it's ok.

- Swamp dragons: if you don't have rPois, these guys get really annoying. Can get you poisoned for the majority of your HP in a few turns. Probably best to get rPois
- Thorn hunters: deal heavy physical damage, so either be prepared to burn them down quickly, or to deal with the damage, preferably by kiting the stupid eggplant to a corner and killing it alone
- Spriggan Druids: can buff animal monsters nearby, also make the trees angry at you and it's stressful seeing all those angry faces :(
- Shambling mangrove: can unflight you, and summon Hornets when it's at low HP
- Tentacle monstrosity/Very Ugly Thing: can beat you up in melee. Probably best to run

Snake: Usually ok if you're aware of Shock Serpents/Anacondas/Guardian Serpents. You may need to make kill-holes a lot, or kite to existing ones. Constriction is bad, and you'll want to physically get away before blinking if possible, since it can prevent blinks/tele. Usually you should start backing away as soon as you're constricted and there is another threat around except the one directly strangling you right now

- Shock serpents: their lightning damage is insane, even with rElec. Prioritize, kite, Polymorph, or self-buff. They are fast, so probably not that much kiting.
- Guardian serpents: teleport all other nagas around to surround you. Find a kill-hole or make one yourself, you really want to only be seeing 1-2 squares at most, unless you're comfortable with being constricted a ton by the greater nagas it dropped on your head
- Naga warriors: can constrict you for pretty heavy damage, and are rather tough to kill. Feel free to use allies/self-buffs
- Greater Nagas: can teleport you, also constrict. More allies/self buff use.
- Nagarajas(?) (naga snipers): can deal impressive physical damage despite your defenses, also use portal projectile to plink at you while hiding behind their meatshields.
- Naga ritualist: gives you -rPois so you can slowly poison to death

Spider: Everything is faster than you, so one of the harder branches. I prefer heavy armour here, since one tarantella is all it takes otherwise.

- Spark wasps: really rare, but man oh man. Heavy electrical damage, blinking attack, bleh
- Enthropy weavers: SATAN. Kite or self-buff even if you have rCorr and are doing pretty well so far
- Orb spider: throws orbs at you, runs away. Don't get hit by the orbs if you like your current character. You can use wands, needles, or any ranged attack really.
- Ghost wasps: drains your mana, so if you need your mana, try to get sInv
- Jumping spider: nets you, so your evasion drops to 0
- Tarantella: irresistible confusion, so you'll get hit a lot
- Emperor scorpion: really tough and hart-hitting melee monster. Standard anti-melee precautions

Shoals: Really the worst. You need MR since a lot of things fear/mezmerise you so you can't go in certain directions, everything pokes you from range or throws spears at you. I think nothing here sees invisible, so that's one option. Another is flight + heavy armour, or major ranged attack power, either spells or weapons.

- Merfolk impaler: heavy physical damage from your character being shish-kebabed with javelins
- Merfolk aquamancer: throws you around, throws steam, summons water elementals
- Merfolk avatar/siren: makes you walk up to them, loud noises break this so wands of lightning/scrolls of noise, unless this too got changed
- Kraken: really heavy physical damage. Basically just run away, it's not worth it.
- Alligator snapping turtle: even heavier physical damage, also reaching attack so you're not safe even behind a summon

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Vaults: Be careful of monsters that mark you, summon, lock doors or shoot you a lot. You may need to get creative with kiting, or just teleport as soon as you get marked/someone starts to recall.

- Convoker: mights other enemies, uses Word of Recall to drop a bunch of assholes on your face. Break LoS, Hex it, bonk it on the head when it starts
- Sentinel: marks you so every single asshole in the level runs at you. You need at least MR+++ to be somewhat safe, and you'll still get marked. If you see one of these, pause and prepare a fallback route
- Warden: closes doors, so you get locked with any number of assholes
- Boggart: Summons a ton of annoying assholes, including other boggarts which summon more assholes and suddently oh no

Depths: imagine EVERYTHING is Satan, but here are the Satan-est

- Caustic Shrike: just teleport. It's not worth it. There's so much more to live for. If you're serious about fighting it (and they usually come in packs) rCorr, summons, self-buffs, checking the scoreboard for what your next char will be
- Juggernaut: absolutely massive melee damage, and it rushes you. It takes a lot of time to wind up, so if you somehow survive the first hit (you probably won't), you can usually just run away screaming.
- Troll Earth Elementalist: breaks down walls to get at you
- Troll Shaman: hastes and mights other trolls to get at you
- Boggart: same as vaults
- Flayed ghost: irresistible kinda-torment, unless stoneform or Gargoyle. Prepare to run away, or kill it first, or fight whatever else is there with 1/3rd of your max HP.
- Titan/Spriggan Air Elementalist: can airstrike you, so you should probably not be flying here
- Spriggan Defender/Berserker: really tough melee monsters, also like to use distortion weapon to show you the wonders of the abyss

Zot: rF+++, rElec. You can't really do it without these. You can substitute potions of Resistance for rElec, but the fire thing remains. The orb floor, do a lot of shouting and kiting. There's a good chance of perma teletraps on the only ways into the orb chamber, so if this happens just stand besides them and yell a lot, then kill whatever gets teleported. Prepare to run/tele if something comes along while you're fighting an Orb of Fire.

- Orbs of fire: rF+++, summons, self-buffs. Don't even try otherwise, unless you have a safe way out. And you won't.
- Ancient lich: like a normal lich but with more summoning and crystal spears
- Electric golem: rElec, or new char.
- Orb guardian: don't let it get berzerked or it WILL bash your face in
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Not good with names

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #111 on: May 29, 2017, 04:48:50 am »

So bummed, not only did I end up staying up half the night, but I splatted my VpSu in the Abyss after running out of heals and blood.  Especially frustrating as the run had started off awesome with 2 pots of experience and I had somehow survived having berserkitis from D:7 on.  On the bright side, I was able to grab the abyssal rune before I died, but still, shame I couldn't have brought that win home.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Also, can you even max out piety with Sif?  I think I got jobbed on this one.
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AlStar

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #112 on: May 29, 2017, 10:09:14 am »

Let's hear it for Vault: 5 with Chei - slouch x3 and the entire ring of vault guards just keels over dead.

In other news, I've just found out about the mutation "You are occasionally teleported next to monsters." I've decided that I do not like it. Not one bit. Might have to start eating ugly things to see if I can get rid of it (as it appears that cure mutation potions no longer exist?)

Edit: Bah, damn you constrict. I guess I should've started a teleport as soon as the upstairs got locked - I assumed I could just slouch everything to death, but it turns out that tentacle monstrosities don't slouch well.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2017, 12:36:48 pm by AlStar »
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FakerFangirl

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #113 on: May 29, 2017, 11:25:52 am »

Thanks Graven. I'll finish lair before getting a rune and try to prepare for the bosses you listed.
Might have to start eating ugly things to see if I can get rid of it (as it appears that cure mutation potions no longer exist?)
Potion of mutation removes three mutations now I think. Read the description if you have one.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2017, 11:33:14 am by FakerFangirl »
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quinnr

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #114 on: May 29, 2017, 12:39:53 pm »

Thanks Graven. I'll finish lair before getting a rune and try to prepare for the bosses you listed.
Might have to start eating ugly things to see if I can get rid of it (as it appears that cure mutation potions no longer exist?)
Potion of mutation removes three mutations now I think. Read the description if you have one.

Cure Mutation potions don't exist, but Mutation potions were changed. They always do the following three things, in this order:
Remove 2-6 mutations, Add 1-3 random mutations, Add 1 good mutation.

If you don't already, the Knowledgebots are crazy helpful! They can give you full stats and spellbooks of monsters you meet, as well as information on basically everything that is more up to date than the wiki. You can access them in your browser now, too, here: http://crawl.develz.org/wordpress/bots
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escy

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #115 on: May 29, 2017, 12:58:06 pm »

Almost got killed on the ascent - 2 orbs of fire and a few other things show up out of nowhere and take me down to 4hp, and then I notice the storm dragon standing by the stairs.

Also, not finding a single item with MR+ until after D:15, snake pit and shoals, half the vaults, most of elf:3, and 2 trips to the abyss (thanks elves) was really rough.
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FakerFangirl

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #116 on: May 29, 2017, 01:29:14 pm »

Also, not finding a single item with MR+ until after D:15, snake pit and shoals, half the vaults, most of elf:3, and 2 trips to the abyss (thanks elves) was really rough.
Right before tournament I had a DrFi game where I maxed-out my Chei piety and then found boots of swiftness and jewelry of berserking :D
Grats on clearing so much with no magic resist.

... When you're trying to finish off a unique, but accidentally banish them with your staff of chaos.

... Forgot vine stalkers can't heal. Died to a pig a turn before teleporting. Laaaaame.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2017, 02:18:23 pm by FakerFangirl »
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Tegga21

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #117 on: May 29, 2017, 01:49:12 pm »

Xthathua named dragon now has paralyze, they snuck that change in.  Rip Mino
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Graven

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #118 on: May 29, 2017, 02:07:40 pm »

Oh man, I've had a DgSu started ever since my gargoyle, and I'm so damn hesitant to actually play it. It's worth a ton of points, but it's also a friggin Demigod Summoner, two things I've never, ever played. And since it's worth so many points, I'll be sad when I die before getting to lair.
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What a strange and beautiful world I beheld, but dangerous too, I was certain. And I was friendless and homeless. And so I prayed.
"Hear me, exalted spirits. Hear me be you gods or devils, ye who hold dominion here. I am a wizard without a home. I am a wanderer seeking refuge."

Dozebôm Lolumzalìs

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Re: Dungeon Crawl 0.20 tournament: get on a Bay12 team!
« Reply #119 on: May 29, 2017, 03:23:14 pm »

I am a bit confused. I guess I will go on Masters if there is no room in the Blacksmiths.
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