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Glorious Arstotzka

17 (16%)

Glorious Moskurg

13 (12.3%)

Ingloriously Didn't Play

76 (71.7%)

Total Members Voted: 106

[Light forger]

This was able to shock the discord into silence so behold!

UFS-UHB-19XX-X 'Calamity'
A super heavy bomber power by four V-16 supercharged engines the Calamity is a monster to behold. With a wing span of nearly 50 meters and armed with five guns pods armed with two 20mm autocannons each(one top, one on each side, one front and one rear). Able to carry nearly eight metric tons of bombs it uses a form of all or nothing armor with only the engines and cabin being armored. Fuel is carried in a number of small cells stopping the plane from bleeding all it's fuel if hit. The interior minus the bomb bay is fully sealed and pressurized with oxygen masks should the crew need to enter the bomb bay mid-air. It's manned by ten airmen in a number of roles.

[evictedSaint]

UFS-BFG-19XX-X 'Death Star'
Forenia's first satellite.  160 kilometers in length.  Able to fire blasts from its main cannon that can destroy entire planets.  Resembles a small moon.
Estimated Difficulty: Very Hard (Probably just Hard if we've already discovered Radar)

[RAM]

The Yamato was sunk by a fleet of carriers, a very large fleet of carriers, and had a tiny fleet with it. That is more an example of uneven forces than mismatched forces. Carriers are not invulnerable, even when fighting from outside of enemy range, they require aircraft to do so, aircraft can be damaged or destroyed. A depleted carrier may be cheaper to restore than a damaged-or-destroyed battleship, but it is a cost none-the-less and the ship is still out-of-action... Add to that the higher running costs(I am assuming here) and battleships start to look more favourable, provided that they do not sink.

It seems to me that there is still a role for a battleship, just not one of dominance. A ship with, say, 4 three-hundred-and-sixty millimetre guns, spread over two turrets, could still discourage smaller ships from approaching even though it would not be suited to defeating a battleship in a duel, while hosting far more antiaircraft fire(or facilities to increase its agility...), including shrapnel rounds from its main guns that could outrange anything the aircraft could do, although would likely do little more than disrupt formations and flight-paths... Meanwhile it could wear the same armour that takes dozens of direct hits from aircraft to overcome while mounted on the least-desirable location for aircraft to approach. a particularly ambitious designer might even try to add some sort of docking facilities for extremely light craft that could sortie with sonar against submarines while this 'escort battleship' provides resupply and poor-weather protection that would normally render such light vessels impractical in open seas...

Note also that our carriers are light, only, what, 20 aircraft? I would not expect them to defeat an unescorted battleship one-on-one, and the sort of fleets that were being hurled around the pacific could probably withstand a dozen of them with negligible losses. Which exposes another flaw of the carrier. If a carrier is overwhelmed, it is pretty much useless. While the sip itself is almost defenceless, its aircraft are prone to being overwhelmed too. If five fighters and five torpedo-planes encounter 10 fighters, then they are very unlikely to so much as scratch an enemy ship. The great carrier victories tend to rely upon enough forces to effectively keep their opponent busy, at least temporarily. If the enemy can field twice as many fighters in defence as you can when attacking, than you are basically irrelevant, while a battleship can still pose a threat and force a response if it advances on something sensitive.

Carriers are definitely good, no mistake, but it seems foolish to ignore a combined-arms approach, and a battleship carriers a lot of stopping-power and hard-point that carriers are largely bereft of.

[Taricus]

There's one thing though: Our carriers are cheaper than their battleships. Sure, 20-30 aircraft on their own don't seem that powerful, but 80-120 aircraft is not a threat to be taken lightly.

[andrea]

the fact that we will outnumber them on the sea 5 to 1 should not be forgotten. We may need a fleet of carriers ( and destroyers) to kill one of their battleships... but we HAVE a fleet of CV/DD for each of their battleships.

[Strongpoint]

Lets not forget that our enemy has no battleships. What they call "a battleship" is a light cruiser by WW2 standards. This makes our live easier.

One thing I am worried about is land based artillery. What do you think about this? Feel free to improve

UFS-MRS-19XX-X Tanyusha
A simple and rugged artillery system that can be mounted on the Tiger truck and similar vehicles. Tanyusha consists of 16 launch tubes  capable to launch 125mm unguided rockets. Rockets weight around 50kg and can have various types of warheads ranging from simple HE to complex separating warheads similar to Firecracker bombs

[andrea]

I would love some rocket artillery.
But if we win the research assistance ( far from assured, mind you), we probably should try to get something very hard such a radar, on the turn after the next.

[Strongpoint]

Hmmm.... Very hard things that come to my mind

1) Submarine (I think a good one is very hard. )
2) Jet aircraft (can ensure our airforce advantage but we will likely need to keep investing in it.)
3) Radar (very versatile tech)
4) Pulse jet gyroscope guided flying bomb aka V-1 clone (can be a great first step to both turbojets and ballistic missiles)
5) Huge coastal artillery (big guns that outrange their battleships light cruiser can be useful and can be a base for our future large vessels)
6) Wire guided torpedo (ambitious but this can wreck them)
7) Helicopter (Is that even useful?)

[andrea]

Jet aircraft might be at the impossible level right now, after we pointed out that they are more difficult than radar.
Of course, that doesn't stop us from trying. Impossible doesn't really mean impossible and this would be at the lower level of impossible.

[Taricus]

All of those are good, but we need to be able to collect the resources from the eastern islands, which means next turn is likely transport designing time.

[evictedSaint]

1) Good idea, but it'll be mostly for harrassing their cargo ships and reducing their resources, I think.
2) Later, much later. And only when theybstart threatening our air superiority.
3) Yes.  Sometime in the next three turns we should attempt this (with the research credit)
4)  Less critical. Definitely an optional late-game tech.
5)  Increasingly less important as we move to carriers-based fleets.
6)  Maybe a decent revision.
7)  Helicopters didn't play a major role in combat until Vietnam and Korea.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

All of those are good, but we need to be able to collect the resources from the eastern islands, which means next turn is likely transport designing time.

Yeah, as listed earlier:

Zanzetkuken - Today at 10:23 PM
The full reason of why to get a transport to get the ore:
It will make the B2 Destroyer, the MAT26, the HF-23, the HF-32, and the Wasp Nest all Cheap rather than Expensive, the HAFB and the AS-T33 merely Expensive rather than Very Expensive, and the Death Ball will reduce in cost from National Effort to Very Expensive.

In case anyone was wondering why that extra TC is so important.

Getting a Transport aircraft does us miles more good than any other design we could possibly make.  Since Sensei has confirmed we can save the Research Credit for later, there is no pressure to use it immediately next turn.

[RAM]

OR you could fill a giant hamster with helium and produce a sea-worthy death-ball!

Transport vehicle should probably be based on future research intentions, as they all have good qualities...
Flying: Rapid response, relatively safe, requires airfields or air-drop: Heavy bombers, propeller-craft.
Floating: Large capacity, cheap, Can take heavy losses if the enemy gets a bead on them: Cheap sea vessels, heavy machinery.
Fishes: Moderate capacity, very good at bypassing blockades, vulnerable when unloading and expensive: Submarines, Heavy sea-vessels.
Ground-effect: Super-special-awesome!, sort-of cheap, sort-of fast, high-tech, high-tech: jets, wings...
unmanned Rockets: Difficult to aim, tend to be rough on the merchandise: missiles, other rocketry, such as V.T.O.L. pods...

[Taricus]

Hrmmm.... The more I think about it the more I like the transport aircraft. Especially since it also offers a combat advantage by being able to drop that many more paratroopers on the enemy.

[stabbymcstabstab]

Who needs to do a beachlanding, If we can simply build a transport large enough to airdrop everything inside their defenses.