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[Tiruin]

PFW

roo: I gather that you've played before from BigFish and Tir, and I gather that it didn't go well or you dropped out or something. What happened in those games? What did you learn, and what can you do to make this go-around better?

I don't remember the games in question that Tiruin was talking about, but I am grateful that someome took an interest in my gameplay for whatever reason. And I am sure Tiruin was telling the truth. All I can imagine is that the game simply wasn't progressing so I stopped posting. As for the latter questions like I said I hardly remember, but I do not care enough to go back and read.

Hapah super duper serious vote btw.

Context on this was your post history I was more concerned that it may happen again--and did not want that [I would like the game to finish with you posting until the end, too :3]

Also I'm forwarding webadict's post there--the spiel is important for everyone. Play to have fun, dudes. Play to also improve your textual communication and how-to-work-with-people-who-poke-your-statements.

EDIT: Also as a total aside--when people seem to be multiposting, it may be because they're on mobile. It is suggested though, to put all the ideas you've got in one post (and double posting is OKAY, but to 'edit' your earlier post by clarification. Or "EBWOP", edit by way of post)

[TheBiggerFish]

@Hapah: Wait, what?

I think there's something fishy, pardon the inadvertent pun, going on - roo was, as far as I can tell, referring to the question I asked you.  As you have not yet answered, I'd prefer to not explain the rationale behind it till I get an answer.

[doll]

Whats more Doll are you saying that TBF is most likely town by calling him anti-town?

What I mean by 'anti-town' is approximately 'has a weak day-game'.
I'm saying that he isn't helping the town with what he is posting in the thread. It's alignment neutral, but it also makes you unreadable as well as not helping to gather reads on other players. In essence, I'm saying that I don't have any particular reason to call TBF scum and they aren't any more or less likely to be scum than any other player, but if nothing changes in that regard than I still want to lynch them; you can think of it like "TBF effectively hasn't posted all game, so we should lynch them for lurking and not contributing in lieu of having scum to kill" but instead of lurking it's being useless.

That being said, Doll do you have anything to offer on the posts so far? Why continue rvs if there is plenty to talk about now is what I feel.

There isn't plenty to talk about.
The case on TBF has nothing to do with scumhunting and is purely based on their being the weakest town (that is, unclear) player here and so the easiest losss.
Gentlefish hasn't asked questions of anyone who wasn't highly active before him.
Doubloon-Seven hasn't posted yet.
Hapah hasn't done anything besides answer questions.
Johiah hasn't done anything.
4mask and Webadict are playing standard early RVS games.
We're still in RVS.

Any reads on the players that have posted?

Yes - doll is town.
Actually, I suspect that you are town as well. This is a cosmetic suspicion caused by your having appeared to be worse than you are (i.e. you are glowing from having my dismiss an earlier position against you since you are coming out the better from TBF's shitflinging), so don't rely on it being too strong.

It's far too early to say if people are avoiding activity or simply haven't had the opportunity to be active yet.
I haven't had my RVS questions answered, and I haven't yet picked up on any strong slips in either direction.
We'll see what arises as the day matures.

[TheBiggerFish]

@doll: *reads post* ...Hey!

@doll re:RVS: Has anyone else claimed?  Do I have a power role?  But generally, unless someone else claims...No, I wouldn't.

doll:Note that my original post in this thread contained a question to Hapah.  I have been interacting with players other than roo, specifically Gentlefish and Hapah (and some tangential explaining to Johiah).  So why do you say I'm only interacting with roo?

I'm still waiting on Hapah's answer to my question, by the way, and I really don't want to explain why I'm asking it until after I have the answer.  This isn't going to change, so please stop pestering me about it until I've got an answer.

@doll again: I'll make a case as soon as I feel like there's a reasonable case to be made.  That's kind of hard to do in RVS.  If you think lynching me for wanting to have some actual suspicion of scumminess before trying to lynch someone is a valid move, go for it, but I don't think that makes much sense.

[TheBiggerFish]

roo: Okay, normally I wouldn't mind if someone said I'm town, but seriously, quote those posts and explain why.

[Hapah]

Disclaimer: I've had a few drinks.

TBF: What question are you looking for me to answer? This one?

....
roo: Are you going to continue being incomprehensible?

Hapah: I've seen you around but never been in a game of Mafia with you.  What are some examples of your town and scum play?

[doll]

TBF
We've been over this in multiple games.
Quote posts and respond in a way which is actually helpful and conveys meaning.
Stop expecting everyone else to do everything for you. We have better things to do than to spend our time trying to reconstruct what you might have meant from the fragments that you give us.

but seriously, quote those posts and explain why.

Oh hey, you even recognize  that this is the useful way to play.
So do it.

doll:Note that my original post in this thread contained a question to Hapah.  I have been interacting with players other than roo, specifically Gentlefish and Hapah (and some tangential explaining to Johiah).  So why do you say I'm only interacting with roo?

Because you are only interacting with roo.
You don't ask any question to Hapah. You say "I'm too lazy to do my research, do it for me" even though he's the player you're supposedly trying to do research on. And look at that: you haven't done any research on him.
You're barely even giving empty answers to Gentlefish. You aren't pushing on him at all.
You are only interacting with roo, and only along meta lines which aren't even valid within the game at hand and in terms of which you are infinitely more guilty.
The only reason there isn't a bandwagon purely on you from every experienced player (and most others besides) is because then we'd lose Day 1 for hunting amongst the people who actually want to play.

I'm still waiting on Hapah's answer to my question, by the way, and I really don't want to explain why I'm asking it until after I have the answer.  This isn't going to change, so please stop pestering me about it until I've got an answer.

@doll again: I'll make a case as soon as I feel like there's a reasonable case to be made.  That's kind of hard to do in RVS.  If you think lynching me for wanting to have some actual suspicion of scumminess before trying to lynch someone is a valid move, go for it, but I don't think that makes much sense.

"It's everyone else's fault that I'm not contributing, even though I'm supposedly waiting on an empty question to one player which I'm refusing to clarify and I'm not never ever never going to interact with anyone else ever".

Why haven't you asked me a question, since you know I'm here?

PPE:
Ninja'd by Hapah, not that it matters

[TheBiggerFish]

Disclaimer: I've had a few drinks.

TBF: What question are you looking for me to answer? This one?

....
roo: Are you going to continue being incomprehensible?

Hapah: I've seen you around but never been in a game of Mafia with you.  What are some examples of your town and scum play?

Yes, that one.

@doll: I do believe I asked you a question, along with everybody else.  So here, have a followup: Why do you think my asking people which RVS questions they dislike is a bad thing?

[roo]

roo: Okay, normally I wouldn't mind if someone said I'm town, but seriously, quote those posts and explain why.

Not really much to quote in terms of actual content saying hey this is obviously TBF town posting. It mostly gut read from your behavior which I attribute to town early game. But if Doll is saying this is always your behavior then it has little merit and makes me rethink. I keep forgetting that you are not in fact a new player, but apparently someone with a few games played.

Tbf why do you think it helps town to hide your opinions and thoughts? You can't emotionally or intellectually handle posts yet demand I do it? That's not very fair methinks.

[Gentlefish]

Contrived in that his posts felt forcefull. They felt off. It felt like Hapah wanted to say something but didn't know what to say and jumped at the opportunity presented by TBF. Although this isn't alignment indicative. It could just be nerves. But my gut says scum lean. Of course it could be a false positive that he posted from work and didn't want to get caught. But I'll stick with my gut for now. As 1 hapah has not done anything particularly towny and 2 is going for the proverbial low hanging fruit.

I'll accept that; it's better than anything you've said yet. If you keep this up I'll be more likely to believe you're not scum later. Unvote.

I am curious what Gentle has to say. I am even more curious about the quick vote hop. I don't see why he couldn't pursue both avenues of questioning. If anything doesn't make sense from a townie perspective to me is why gentle switched from TBF who wasn't explaining his actions to roo. Although that could just be my bias. From his responses I seemed to have made some sort of sin in not answering how he wanted me to answer. Damned if I do damned if I don't. Is that considered woe is me? I hope I'm not lynched for that.

In truth nothing has actually happened apart from the people with the highest post count being questioned the most go figure.

Also gentlefish how did TBF go from "harshing the mellow" to "a little curious"? igmeoy

As for tbf I'm leaning town on him. Inb4 quote posts and explain why.

I'll let the read go. This time as for what I was meaning when I said a little curious was that I still find his actions un-townie. He started needling hard and fast though that may be due to metagame knowledge. I do not like his actions and find them scummy that he was so quick to jump on someone this early in the game.

And it's easy to dig into people who have posted. They've posted stuff to dig into! This game hinges on activity. There's no way to win as town without activity! The more the better, especially if things are being actually discussed and material is created for the town to pour over as the days and nights go on.

I went from voting TBF to voting you because I gave you a warning to elaborate more on your feelings. Since you have now done so, I no longer feel the need to keep the vote on you. Hence, why I've removed my vote. This early in the game it's only harmful to stick to your voting guns. It's much better to use as a pressure.

TBF: I want to believe you. Please, if you get the chance this weekend, can you sit down and clarify your questions if you get the chance?

Doll: It's a silly thing to do, vote yourself. Why'd you do that? It doesn't add anything to the game, and is in fact a thing often told to avoid.

[Hapah]

TBF: Man, it's literally been 3 or 4 years since I played. There's no way I'm gonna remember individual games at this point unless they were nuts, and even then I'm only gonna remember snippets.

I remember tunneling the everloving shit out of Shake in a King of the Mafia. I remember reasoning out that Tolyk (I think it was Tolyk) was scum in one game (a BYOR I think) when he changed his claim just a bit. I remember dinging Book with a fakeclaim in my first very game, and I remember lynching myself in a Beginner's Mafia game long ago (don't do that). I remember being a Snowman in a Cybrid Mafia game, and I vaguely remember some Mafia game that was about CCGs? I think people have Yu-Gi-Oh and Magic The Gathering and all that good stuff. But if you're asking me for specific details of how I played in games long past, I can't really help you.

[roo]

@Doll I can certainly agree with your assessment of TBF being not very useful or tbf being a good lynch worthy candidate. I still think or have been thinking it would be a waste and have been trying to get away from interacting with him, but I just have to respond :/

As for being nothing to talk about I disagree to some extent. You can choose to wait for everyone to post as it would be troublesome to develop reads but I like to be running out of the gate. Furthermore you don't think it odd Gentlefish vote switching? And Rvs just as much a state of mind as it is a necessary phase of the game. You can drag people forward or let them drag on behind you while you wait for them to catch up. I would rather not see an rvs vote on the 5th page. Maybe I was wrong not hopping on TBF wagon and should have gotten a it going to move us out of rvs. I guess that's my b.

[roo]

@Gentlefish why do you want to believe him? Should we consider your vote is on tbf in spirit? or did his soaring rhetoric win you over?

 

TBF: We just started and you're kind of harshing the mellow with all of this antagonizing of Roo. And now this 'nah' business with Hapah? This is Mafia, please explain your actions and clear up what you meant with your question. Then I will consider removing my vote.

So you vote me supposedly for violating your warning but now you back off of tbf? Why? Where is this pressure of yours that you spoke of?

@Gentlefish do you think you deserve a vote because of your inconsistency?

[webadict]

Well, starting this on a Friday night sucks.

I'm going to vote TBF.

Now, for you at home watching this game, you may be wondering why. The biggest reason is that I dislike TBF's style of playing the game, which is probably best described as doing the exact opposite of that. I'm also trying to apply additional pressure, to ensure that he follows through on playing normally or helpfully. This is a personal choice, and it's best to wonder why someone would do either of these things (Vote for TBF, is it an easy target, or do I believe they are doing what's best?)

Anyway, I'm tired. See ya.

[doll]

Furthermore you don't think it odd Gentlefish vote switching?

Changing your vote around is a towntell, if anything.
It means you don't know who is scum, and are unsure if you are lynching the right person. Scum don't care who is lynched, or even if anyone is lynched, so long as they survive. This is why votes left sitting from RVS often draw unfounded suspicion, even though they are perfectly legitimate.
Bandwagoning TBF doesn't get us out of RVS.
The problem is that TBF plays the entire game like it's RVS, to give him more credit than he is due. If we leave a wagon on him until we get something useful out of him, it means that scum are most likely going to be able to just fly under the radar while town is unable to pressure any of them.
That said, he is just as likely to be scum as anyone else, and if he is town than scum aren't going to kill him because it's counter to their interests to kill a town player who is fucking useless.
Basically, he is our default lynch, until somebody lets slip that they are scum. And since TBF probably isn't scum that means we need everyone to be able to be read, which means we need people to post, so anybody who remains inactive or only cosmetically active is going to look like scum.
Gentlefish
There isn't a hammer system. Vote somebody. Address my question.

Gentelfish
It's Day1. I claim Jailkeeper out of the blue. You are the Jailkeeper. Do you say anything?