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Elves... we need tree hugging hippy forts!!!!!

16 (29.1%)

Goblin... Let the demons rule the land!!!!

4 (7.3%)

Necromancers... Build your own tower and fill it with your undead servants!!!

24 (43.6%)

Repair the Werebeasts... More savage beastie goodness!!!!  maybe even a fort mode!?!?

1 (1.8%)

Repair the Titans... so they will come and destroy your fortresses again!

6 (10.9%)

Repair the Night Creatures... we need more kidnapped children!

0 (0%)

Vampires... flesh out their game play so they drink more blood and even may have a fort mode!?!?

4 (7.3%)

Something different to replace one of these?  Let me know what you think would be cool?!?!

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 55

Voting closed: June 20, 2017, 09:37:53 am

[Devast]

It was an undead siege. My dwarfs killed them all with only one death.
I had to stop playing, however before I stopped I was still under siege and every 2 irl minutes another invader would show up

[Amostubal]

@Devast - no clue, I'll look at the cheese men raws later this next week, but other than that I couldn't tell you anything.
To everyone else! I'm a little late, but I got it uploaded version 1.24d.  It took bit but I had to makke several last minute changes and verify a few things.  but it should be all good now! As always if you're moving old save over, they may work, but it is not guaranteed; so its better to do a new folder, new world gen.  Have fun!

[sum1won]

I had a similar problem.  It appeared that chopping up certain creatures resulted in them reanimating as friendlies.  Very bizarre.

(Also, I'm not sure if you fixed this, but it appeared that the masterwork download you provided for .c had several changes from the default settings.  Is that still the case?)

[cerevox]

It is the *mancers mod. It adds a bunch of strange necromancer equivalents, and they summon strange things instead of undead like living cheese people or wine people or whatever. It also seems pretty buggy, since after you hack them apart the pieces come back as friendly. If you leave them alone they will overrun your FPS and murder your fort, so its a good idea to have a squad attack them all. It doesn't cause a cascade or anything, but you want them gone.

[Amostubal]

I had a similar problem.  It appeared that chopping up certain creatures resulted in them reanimating as friendlies.  Very bizarre.

(Also, I'm not sure if you fixed this, but it appeared that the masterwork download you provided for .c had several changes from the default settings.  Is that still the case?)

Oh? I apologize, I haven't been trying to maintain a particular set of default settings.  generally speaking I was running a test directory that I was making changes on, and then copying all the raws/scripts/ etc over into a fresh file.  Setting come from the read of the raws by the gui at startup.  so... if the last thing I tested had settings X then thats what will show up....  I'm moving it over to a github repository tonight to help maintain things better, since I can set it to ignore files I don't want to zip up by accident (like saves....), will show me what changes are between what I have here and in the repository(including those random "setting changes"). 

Just for the record what do you think is "default settings", I can check the settings for 1.23 and push those into the repository, but never really considered it that much.

additionally, it will provide a download source for those who don't want to use 7z, as you can have a zip of it downloaded from there.

also a place for people to make suggestions and post issues.

[-Nihil-]

Just for the record what do you think is "default settings", I can check the settings for 1.23 and push those into the repository, but never really considered it that much.

I know this wasn't directed at me but I figure I would state my opinion anyway.

Going to try and state my opinion in order of the settings on the launcher

General World:
- all on
- population caps maybe at vanilla? I usually change these depending on the fort I am planning

Save & Load:
- all on
- auto save seasonal

Announcements:
- should probably be on by default, can always turn them off if they get annoying

Graphics:
- as awesome as Meph's tileset is, it only works if you have enough RAM it seems so another tileset should probably be default?

TWBT:
- Meph or Gemset are the most readable in my opinion but this is super subject
- I think 15 z levels has been default in the past and that has always worked for me

FPS:
- FPS display on
- graphics: 30
- fps: 150
- sound has always been off, not sure i've ever turned it on

Embark:
- 3x3
- points 1274
- group 7
- warning on
- labors by skills

Misc:
- default/normal where available
- fullscreen mode
- Maybe intro movie should be on by default? Most will probably turn it off though
- hide dfhack

Standardization:
- by default I would only standardize blood

Balancing:
- aquifers, slower learning, slower farming are all on, rest should be off
- grazer coefficient should probably be 100 but I haven't looked in to it recently so maybe not

Additions:
- if they don't affect performance then food and toy types should be on, otherwise they should all be off

FPS:
- All off except decaying corpses maybe? I thought corpses decayed in vanilla though, at least down to the bones.

Mods:
- Should probably overhaul the mods that are here, I feel like it's kind of a mess. I don't understand how most of these work or interact with everything so I usually keep them all off except "More Pets"

Civs:
- Active should have all the civs that we know are in a decent state and "complete" for AI civs. Everything from dwarves down to kobolds assuming they are all working currently.
- Fort could stick with only dwarves if we assume people don't know how to pick their civ on embark
- Adv can have all available
- Factions we know
- Caravans should be left as default if that respects the settings in the entity file
- Invasions should be the same, default if that works.
- All should have guards maybe? Not sure if this makes sense as a launcher option, should respect what is in the entity file
- AI, all should be siegers except elves, and kobolds I think.
- Skulk, just kobolds
- Materials, default
- Skills, 0
- Seasons, should have a default option to respect entity file, otherwise I guess you have to read them and set them as such

[Amostubal]

@-nihil- well as I develop the repository I switched to the same settings as was in 1.23 so here's the images of the 1.23 settings as it came out of the package...
http://imgur.com/a/JMbzS

tell me what you think is wrong with these I would like feed back from anyone.

anyways, now that I have the repository up on github, I'm going to start working on fixing the orc entity/reaction files then move onto human/reaction files. 

[Immortal-D]

Decided to check in and see how MW was doing these days.  Mad props for carrying the torch   As an aside; for anyone experiencing seemingly random crashing issues, the #1 cause I have found is simply having too much stuff enabled.  MW incorporates a tonne of nifty features, but if you try to use them all at the same time, you're asking for trouble.

[-Nihil-]

@-nihil- well as I develop the repository I switched to the same settings as was in 1.23 so here's the images of the 1.23 settings as it came out of the package...
http://imgur.com/a/JMbzS

tell me what you think is wrong with these I would like feed back from anyone.

As I mentioned I'm not sure if Meph's tileset would work for everyone, if they only have 2GB RAM it would probably not work. Also everyone on 32 bit maybe? I just am not sure and if the mod breaks on the default settings for someone that's not fun :/

As for the grazing coefficient I feel that reducing the land needed by such a large margin ruins any balance intended. And since masterwork generally strives to make the game more challenging I feel this should be the vanilla value. Just my opinion though.

Most of the other values on the settings page I would change as I described above. Nothing is really "wrong" though.

In the mods tab I would say most of that should be off by default. Let people consciously pick what they want to turn on. Sometimes things break due to other mods as well, not sure how stable they all are. We want default masterwork to be as stable as possible.

Civs look fine, not even really sure if all those settings actually change anything.

Invaders looks good to me.

Creatures tab, im just not sure about that frequency. I feel like normal animals should be more than just twice as common as giant or man variants of them. 25 is the highest I would probably put it as default. Really doesn't matter much though.

[Amostubal]

Agreed, on most everything you said... yes the civ  page settings are working they edit the entity file to make changes... tested them under 1.24 c.   

Yeah o think most mods should be off by default, so they can be tried out as they decide to. 


Agree those giant and men values are too high... should be around 10%.

The grazing thing always bothered me in vanilla a couple of sheep shouldn't be eating a 31x31 field to dirt in 1 month, lol.  I own 15 sheep and they don't demolish my 3 acres.

[Amostubal]

interesting thing discovered.... theres 3 sets of the same reactions across 3 races, that only have 1 change between them..

it seems that the kobold poison cookery reactions were duplicated to orcs and humans.  the 1 change is that what is remains in kobolds, becomes cobalt dust in orcs, and then is completely removed in humans for all the reactions..... personally I'd just combine them all as the Kobold version, making orcs need remains over cobalt dust, and humans would need remains.... but I thought I would pass it up to the community before I made the change.  I had already pulled the Kobold reactions out, because I thought they was the same as the orc reactions.

anyways, other changes in orcs (these all come from my revision of the orcfort mod, that I never included into masterwork):
1. added quick exchanges to the orc shops for trading coins up and down from bonemold all the way to platinums...  Its always annoyed me that they didn't have that ability.
2. orc factory now has its bricks in a category menu, and the ones that use plants returns their seeds so they don't end up running completely out of seeds when making bricks.
3. added part of my orc mod into the orc factory, instead of making say large copper daggers, instead you know have to shape a mold, then use that mold to make large daggers of whatever metal you choose.  the molds break at a rate of 1 in 20 runs, so you have to keep making molds to use the mass productions.  additionally the molds can be made from any clay or from bonemold (for locations without clay).  Its a balancer to push mass raiding away from the start of orcs.
4. ashland glassblower now has a magma option.
5. fixed a lot of reactions that didn't allow for the selection of materials. basically things call for boulders/blocks allow you to select the type of block.
6. fixed the strawberries from one of the raids that produced an unnamed plant item.

anyways almost done with orcs may make a few other minor changes, would like to hear what people think about the posion cookery thing above.

[-Nihil-]

The grazing thing always bothered me in vanilla a couple of sheep shouldn't be eating a 31x31 field to dirt in 1 month, lol.  I own 15 sheep and they don't demolish my 3 acres.

Yeah, sometimes it can be a little off trying to figure out what makes sense within the abstraction of the game. I just don't like making things easier xD

As for the poison I haven't used it much but I think it would make sense for each race(that should) to have their own poison reactions but maybe they could be in the same workshop? Otherwise make it a "masterwork" reaction rather than a kobold one. That's my vote at least.

[Amostubal]

The grazing thing always bothered me in vanilla a couple of sheep shouldn't be eating a 31x31 field to dirt in 1 month, lol.  I own 15 sheep and they don't demolish my 3 acres.

Yeah, sometimes it can be a little off trying to figure out what makes sense within the abstraction of the game. I just don't like making things easier xD

As for the poison I haven't used it much but I think it would make sense for each race(that should) to have their own poison reactions but maybe they could be in the same workshop? Otherwise make it a "masterwork" reaction rather than a kobold one. That's my vote at least.

grazing - yeah the issue is that the map is very abstract, what is the size of a square?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

 well according to wiki its "approximately two meters long, two meters wide, and three meters high"... so ~ 6x6x9 feet. so a 31x31 (max area of a zone) is ~186x186 feet = 34,596 square feet. 43,560 square feet is an acre (generally is considered to be 660'x66' a furlong x chain.... knowing old english measurements, but forgetting my sisters birthday, whats up with my head, lol.).  So the largest zone you can designate is just over 3/4ths an acre (~0.79 almost 4/5ths).  So from the recommendations on an unimproved pasture (one where just trees have been cleared and area fenced.  that's just enough space for about 2 ewes and a ram with 2 lambs, max, and that would equate to a pasture that will grow back at a similar rate to the clearing by the animals.

Now all that said, one off the first successful "farms" I ever built had such a pasture on DF vanilla, I had to build a second pasture 6 months in the game, a third 6 months later.  After that I just split my ewes one to a field with a lamb, the extra acre was where I kept the extra lambs waiting to be adults, and the ram was moved from pasture to pasture as I noticed one field or the other looked dead.  really I called the map farmville, because I felt I did more work to raise animals then to deal with invaders.  So all that in consideration.. I may run some coefficient testing... maybe a point in between.  because i feel that with the size being so close to an acre we should just treat a max size pasture as an acre.   so it should be able to support 2 lambs, 2 ewes, and a ram for a year.

TLDR: maybe a point in between somewhere nearer to 500 would be better than the 1000 or 100 option.  The issue with the original value is that you need a huge embark to raise more than a pair of anything larger than lamb.

on the poisons: well they are currently in 3 different shops for the 3 different races, with 3 different reactions.... so I'm just going to push the poison cookery of Kobolds back into their race file and clean the reactions of the other race shop names. (they shouldn't be tied to them, or a kobold group could just take over an orc /human embark location and utilize their shops as if they were their own).

[heydude6]

Yeah I think most mods should be off by default, so they can be tried out as they decide to. 

Personally, I disagree with this sentiment. In the past, the way masterwork worked was that most mods were on. The only mods that were disabled were those that had bugs and would generally result in a less enjoyable experience if they were enabled. Thing is, masterwork reborn still has mods like that (the randomized creatures for example). If we leave newcomers to decide which mods they want, they'll do either of the two following: don't change anything at all because they assume that the default is the intended experience, or turn on everything causing all sorts of crashes and other unfun things. Few people are going to browse through the options, read the tooltips and decide which options are good for them.

I believe the mods page should stay mostly the same but have *mancers turned off since it seems that it's bugged. I'm not a fan of silk eggs either, but I can understand why some might want it default.

[Amostubal]

The silk eggs only affects really those who raise spiders... basically it's 1 reaction and 1 1x1 building.  The male spiders produce silk eggs if I remember correctly.   I still build old school silk harvesters every once in awhile.  Its not an option I use.

On the rest well it's an in between.  I think I'm going with 1.23 minus a few that seem problematic for some.