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Author Topic: AmeriPol thread  (Read 4237378 times)

MetalSlimeHunt

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On political news, if you aren't tired of reading about the administration's internal issues, there appears to be a war developing between the establishment and Trumpists, with Trumpists increasingly losing.
I just need to point something out here.

Quote
"We're pissed off. We're angry," this person said. "There are people who can't even look us in the eye because they know they’re [screwing] us."

Check out that LCS-style [patriotic reinterpretation], truly this is the darkest timeline.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
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Max™

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On political news, if you aren't tired of reading about the administration's internal issues, there appears to be a war developing between the establishment and Trumpists, with Trumpists increasingly losing.
Ahem... *takes a sip of water* fee-fee-faa-faa-mii-maa-mii-mii-miiiiii....

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
...heh, hah... seriously, fuck those guys.
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Baffler

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Carson's independent audit of the HUD's finances for 2015 and 2016 came back earlier, and found that compliance with financial regulation and basic accounting practice had been lacking. The corrections are pretty significant when you consider that HUD has an operating budget of ~$35bn. I wonder if similar audits of other departments would turn up similar results?

https://www.hudoig.gov/reports-publications/audit-reports/hud%E2%80%99s-fiscal-years-2016-and-2015-restated-consolidated-financial

-snip-

How very constructive of you.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2017, 03:49:54 pm by Baffler »
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Starver

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It's almost like a group of friends, who just about know one end of a paintball gun from the other, decided they'd like to try their hand at competing with veteran military types.

(And it seems the same amateur team is going to try their luck against the Chinese professional team, too.)
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Max™

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Well Baffler, one could argue that the image people had of it being President Bannon and his puppet Trump played a role in Trump pulling him out of the NSC, so yes, openly mocking and laughing at them is in fact constructive.

Trump is a simpleton concerned only with how he appears, mocking him for doing dumb hateful shit until it possibly gets through to him is better than arguing about which voters fucked up more.
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Frumple

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Carson's independent audit of the HUD's finances for 2015 and 2016 came back earlier, and found that compliance with financial regulation and basic accounting practice had been lacking. The corrections are pretty significant when you consider that HUD has an operating budget of ~$35bn. I wonder if similar audits of other departments would turn up similar results?

https://www.hudoig.gov/reports-publications/audit-reports/hud%E2%80%99s-fiscal-years-2016-and-2015-restated-consolidated-financial
Interesting bit to me is the auditee reply in the report, tbh. Especially considering the plausibility of it, which for those with no accounting exposure isn't exactly a difficult situation to encounter, particularly when migrating systems. Probably going to hold out a major opinion until someone with better training than me can go over it, though, and lay out exactly how the report's numbers were reached and whether the statement regarding the actual impact of those mistakes are accurate or not.

'Cause you're either looking at a half-trillion dollar funds misplacement and what's likely fairly serious fraud of one sort or another -- that somehow managed to go at least two years under multiple audits and who knows how much third+ party scrutiny without being noticed -- or you're looking at a three million dollar one and someone blowing the importance of mid-migration and legacy accounting integration errors up about a hundred and sixty-ish thousand times what it warrants, when the department head just happens to be part of an administration that's got something of a questionable relationship to things like honesty, accuracy, or truth.

Be really neat if the actual audit work was squirreled away somewhere accessible, though. Something more detailed about methodology and finds and whatnot could be an interesting read, from an accounting perspective.
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Max™

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Hrrm, note that while I think panic over an essential part of life on earth is absurd... it has nothing to do with my stance on fossil fuels and the like, which are also absurd, oil should be used for plastics and the like where recycling isn't sufficient... and the occasional supercar.

This though...
I hate coal.
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nenjin

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Yes, prepare for the era of government websites looking like professional marketing slicks for the industries they're in the tank for.

https://www.hudoig.gov/reports-publications/audit-reports/hud%E2%80%99s-fiscal-years-2016-and-2015-restated-consolidated-financial

I exist on the fringe edge of accounting issues at work but some do come to me so stuff like General Ledger, GAAP, etc are not necessarily foreign terms to me. So in skimming the document I can say the auditor's general opinion is: everything is fucked up, and has been fucked up for a while. The language is pretty severe but also fairly vague (it says a lot about failure to comply with Federal GAAP for grant money, but in my skim of it I didn't see it actually speak to those failures directly. Maybe that's in a sub-report or somewhere in the document.)

Basically it's the kind of thing that if you were building a case for an entire Federal grant program to go away and for painting the last administration and their initiatives as corrupt, this would be a good starting place. The auditor's spiel and the fact they're independent should probably mean they're above political pressure. But these days I'm a lot less willing to believe that.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2017, 05:52:36 pm by nenjin »
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EnigmaticHat

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On political news, if you aren't tired of reading about the administration's internal issues, there appears to be a war developing between the establishment and Trumpists, with Trumpists increasingly losing.
I just need to point something out here.

Quote
"We're pissed off. We're angry," this person said. "There are people who can't even look us in the eye because they know they’re [screwing] us."

Check out that LCS-style [patriotic reinterpretation], truly this is the darkest timeline.
Quote
Tensions are also rising at the Department of Agriculture, where some Trump backers said they were shocked to learn recently they were being reassigned to other parts of the government. The decision affects 13 people on the department's beachhead team, who began working at the agency on Jan. 20 as Trump’s presidency got underway. The group was assigned to oversee the department as its new leadership took shape.

While the staffers, like those on beachhead teams at other agencies, were never guaranteed employment past the first 90 or 120 days of the administration, many assumed they would be hired on full time.
Run the country like a business indeed.
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Frumple

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... actually, as I skim over that report more and eyeball around a bit, I think I'm starting to develop a burning urge to strangle whoever wrote that report summary. Whoever decided to add up the results of compounding account errors -- which, from what I can tell from the HUD response and what the auditor(s) are actually saying, looks to be the primary problem with the total -- and present them without qualification or clarification is someone I would perhaps be willing to give a solid kick to the nethers on behalf of all accountants in the USA.

What seems to have actually happened of material note we could rely on, instead of possibly unreliable financial data and whatever the fuck was going through that auditing group's head, is that the HUD had a (probably not terribly major in any substantiative sense) problem with sloppy accounting, which when combined with system migration and the process of integrating legacy accounts into the system led to data entry errors, probably mostly of the misplaced decimal or typo sort, that when corrected caused compounding errors to propagate through the financial reports. The 500 billion value -- most of the discrepancies period, really -- appears to be almost entirely comprised of that, from what I can parse* of what the report actually says.

Basically, the numbers were wrong, but there doesn't appear to be substantial money or material actually missing, and what caused it, while there and needing redress, wasn't actually major and has mitigating circumstances besides. That huge amount was a data error, not a financial or management one (though there's issue with the latter overseeing the errors happening to begin with). If there's money actually missing, misused, or defrauded, it's probably a much, much smaller number -- the HUD itself says around three million (somewhere in the very rough range of about .006% of their budget over those two years) -- than what the report is intimating (and the news bits that are starting to kick up) even if it's being fairly careful to not actually say it.

... also, it's probably worth noting (both to myself, who was suspicious of the connection, and to those holding it as an achievement), that carson (and by extension trump's administration) had precisely fuck all to do with the audit, which was procedural, has been going on annually since somewhere in the 90s, was done under obama's presidency, and published the day before carson assumed the position. So for all those worried about either flawless accounting practice or possible fraud, say it with me: "Thanks, Obama."

*Though, to be fair, I've only got fairly low level accounting training, little field experience, and only basic introduction to auditing principles -- basically, there's definitely nuances and whatnot I could be misinterpreting or missing. Enough exposure to go, "Yo', hold up." without being entirely confidant they actually need to hold up, or in what manner or to what degree. That said, that report is very "Yo', hold up."
« Last Edit: April 06, 2017, 06:01:31 pm by Frumple »
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Baffler

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... also, it's probably worth noting (both to myself, who was suspicious of the connection, and to those holding it as an achievement), that carson (and by extension trump's administration) had precisely fuck all to do with the audit, which was procedural, has been going on annually since somewhere in the 90s, was done under obama's presidency, and published the day before carson assumed the position. So for all those worried about either flawless accounting practice or possible fraud, say it with me: "Thanks, Obama."

Note the language at the top:

Quote
In accordance with the Chief Financial Officers Act of 1990, as amended, we are required to annually audit the consolidated financial statements of the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD). HUD reissued its fiscal year 2016 and 2015 (Restated) consolidated financial statements due to pervasive material errors that were identified by us. Our objective was to express an opinion on the fairness of HUD’s consolidated financial statements in accordance with U.S. generally accepted accounting principles applicable to the Federal Government.

So there is a regular audit, yeah, and the report and summary both mention that it happens. That's not what this report was commissioned for. This audit was called because actual scrutiny showed the original audits were, as nenjin says, in pretty bad shape. You also seem to be parsing 3.4 billion as 3.4 million, which is... a pretty substantial difference, either that or I'm just missing where you're getting that number from.
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Even if you found a suitable opening, I doubt it would prove all too satisfying. And it might leave some nasty wounds, depending on the moral high ground's geology.
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Zanzetkuken The Great

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I cannot recall when it was I had heard the United States was seemingly taking a path similar to the decline of the Roman Empire, but upon recalling that, a question had come to mind.  Who would be the closest Roman approximations of our last few presidents?
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Max™

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*Though, to be fair, I've only got fairly low level accounting training, little field experience, and only basic introduction to auditing principles -- basically, there's definitely nuances and whatnot I could be misinterpreting or missing. Enough exposure to go, "Yo', hold up." without being entirely confidant they actually need to hold up, or in what manner or to what degree. That said, that report is very "Yo', hold up."
I totally know what you mean about the "yo, hold up" part of your brain, I call it the Jeopardy organ and it's the only way I get anything in a literature category outside of randomly guessing names. 'Uh... Who is Chaucer? ... rats! uhhh... wait, why do I wanna say Who is McCarthy*? ... Yay! I got one!'

Also got done reading this: http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/04/how-congress-used-to-work-214981

It's starting to seem like the worst outcome of Donnyshitpants being a 4D chessmaster is not coming to pass, he's not just hiding competency for some Xanatos shit, he really thought he'd just get in office and start telling people what to do and rewarding/firing them as he saw fit.

If Congress wasn't stuck in "NOPE" mode they might get a lot of awful shit pushed through with a puppet president willing to rubberstamp anything, but instead when one part starts to suggest something the other heads turn and start biting it. Well done folks!


*Full admission, I only got the Carman McArthur one today because of Mike Tyson Adventures.
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Frumple

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So there is a regular audit, yeah, and the report and summary both mention that it happens. That's not what this report was commissioned for. This audit was called because actual scrutiny showed the original audits were, as nenjin says, in pretty bad shape.
Actually missed nenjin's bit (was it edited in, or did I just miss it?), but yeah, I'm aware of why the report was commissioned -- I was making the note because I noticed a lot of people (off b12, obviously enough) in passing attributing this to carson, when not even the stuff related to the restatement had sod all to do with him. As noted, I made the mistake of thinking there could be a connection as well.

That said, the thing that's standing out to me is that from what I can tell it looks like more or less the exact same thing happened previously -- the 2015-2016 report wasn't the first with restated numbers, i.e. another go was called in 'cause the first was pretty shit. Looks like years before had similar problems, checking a little. And in those? It doesn't appear like the cumulative total of the data errors were reported on, despite the identified issues being nearly identical.

On one hand, I can understand why that might have happened, particularly considering this is clearly a multi-year issue (though for what that's worth, I can also understand why it would take many years to fix, particularly in a federal program where workers cling to their positions like someone on a ship mast in the middle of the ocean). Someone could have totally wanted to give the folks apparently dragging ass around a kick in the rear. On the other the change happening to be in this report, released just before carson came in, with an opinion that (as lots of the initial reporting seem to be seizing on) can easily be construed as saying there's a half-trillion dollar fraud case sitting under the HUD's financial work and making both no apparent effort to clarify the actual import of what they're saying and a fair go at pointedly not... I'm not saying there's foul play going on, exactly. Just that it's sketchy.

There's definitely a problem going on, mind you. It's just the problem doesn't appear to be of the magnitude or nature that people (including yourself, as per your comment related to their actual budget size) seem to be seizing on.

Quote
You also seem to be parsing 3.4 billion as 3.4 million, which is... a pretty substantial difference, either that or I'm just missing where you're getting that number from.
Appendix A, the very first thing in the appendix.

E: Though it did just occur to me there's something morbidly hilarious about people attributing this to trump's lot, when the guy's basically promised to kneecap accounting standards for corporations at the least and had little to nothing to do with the report to begin with. Sudden and inevitable betrayal in X minutes and counting :V
« Last Edit: April 06, 2017, 06:56:30 pm by Frumple »
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hector13

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Twitter suing US government, apparently. There's an anonymous account criticizing Trump's immigration policy, the government want to know who it is (it is claimed to be run by current or former employees of the US Customs and Immigration Service) and Twitter say they won't do shit if it can't be proven (proved?) the account is doing/has performed a criminal or civil offense.

My thoughts on this are mainly that it is glorious.

Also the government apparently demanded they receive various identifying data (phone numbers, IP addresses, mailing addresses etc.) by March 13th. Twitter received the demands on the 14th.
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