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[Sergarr]

Here goes all discussion about meditation, Dark Pact, and all sorta similar stuff to prevent derails in gender identity thread.

I guess I should also remind you that no NSFW stuff is allowed here, as well as anyone else on this forum, so duh

For starters, here's this out-of-context part:

Spoiler: contains Dark Part procedure, may cause descent into madness and loss of your immortal soul (click to show/hide)

1) imagine your inner world that's full of various good and pretty stuff that you secretly feel like you value the most and that you keep separated from yourself,
2) you also should imagine yourself in a comfortable "flight" position, with your arms out to the sides and everything, as if you were suspended in zero-gravity, then
3) imagine that there is some kind of mental barrier between you and your inner world that differentiates them apart - here you should tense your mind slightly, but not too hard, to simulate the pressure that your inner world puts on you,
4) and then just sort of, uh, imagine it stop stopping the inner world from invading and penetr permeating yourself, let yourself be submitted to the little wishes of your inner mind-world and let it control what's left of your sense of "you", let it go™ - here you should be still maintaining some of the mental tension from before to not let it just all dissipate, quite tricky to do.

if it works, you'll know it, the sensation of your sense of "self" being changed and/or partially replaced with someone else is nearly impossible to mistake for anything else.

then you just have to kind of work it out with your inner alter-ego so that they don't try to suddenly occupy your body at an inappropriate time, or overwhelm you with inexplicable happy/sad feelings, or other similar weird stuff, it depends on how good you are at agreeing with yourself though, so I can't say anything concrete about that, except for one thing - don't forget that your alter-ego is still you, and keep reminding them about it until they unconditionally agree

and then you'll just have to mentally ask that alter-ego (via direct thought transfer or through significantly slower mental verbalization, it's your choice) to do various, ahem, stuff in your mind that you feel like you want to happen, and voila - awake lucid dreaming! Warning: may cause critical loss of productivity (due to unparalleled sensation of stuff-related happiness).

and this, also out-of-context

Spoiler: some further explanations about Dark Pact (click to show/hide)

Y-yes... and then you make the membrane permeate your inner world stuff in... well, at least some of it at a time. To better get the idea, imagine yourself to be in a big living home with vaguely defined walls, the walls between rooms of this home to be these semi-permeable membranes and each room containing something that you keep separate from both yourself and everything else that's in other rooms...

...then, if you want to embrace a particular aspect of your inner self, you just... sort of concentrate and try to mentally roll through the various room configurations until the room containing something that you want is nearby yours, and then make that wall start to permeate it to you and you to it, the process finally finishing in a bigger room with the sort-of-fusion between you and whatever you decided to fuse together with...

A-also... it may not necessarily feel very s-separated... it just s-should be s-something w-which m-makes y-you d-do and imagine things as if reflexively, by themselves, almost out of conscious control... and w-with enough of those, you can s-sort of chain them together i-in order to do a-and imagine more c-complex t-things, which would still be as-if-they-were-happening-by-themselves...

...and among those ones, there are combinations that will automatically amplify certain combination-dependent kinds of feelings you have a-at the time, and which are, due to their reflexive and purely mental nature, quick and almost naturally repeatable...

I'll probably add more stuff here in the future. Probably.

discuss

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

Oh, thanks, I was getting a little worried about that.

Ehehe~ well yes, yes it is~ hey, do your "me's" like each other?

Lemme ask them

Hmmm. In a sense, they're all "me", just different expressions of myself. Since I don't hate myself, I can presume that none of the 'me's would hate any of the other 'me's. Switching between the main three doesn't result in any negative feelings toward any other 'me's, so I'd say "yes, they can tolerate each other."

There's some disapproval going on, but not any conflict. The only two sources of conflict I could imagine would be "I should be male. No, female," but with my mindhacking, I can perceive myself as whatever I want to be, so problem solved! The other source would be "no, this I should be in control," but my identity isn't quite like that - they're partially distinct identities, not separate consciousnesses. None of the 'me's directly controls Dozebom, there's a 'self' that's always present. The identities themselves wouldn't be able to compete for control, it's more that my choices are affected by these identities, and this "dark pact" is bringing one facet of myself into focus.

Whoa I just got a revelation. There are certain things that are always true about myself regardless of whichever 'me' I'm focusing on, such as a love of science and music. If you take all of these and put them together, they make up my "central self." (This isn't necessarily any more innate or true btw.) But the central self doesn't itself define a single person - there are different actions and choices and thoughts that would all mesh with that central self. The "identities" are cobbled together from stolen concepts and flavoured with the central self, and then I choose which ones I use. In doing this, I decide who I want to be; the identities are like models for my goals and actions.

Whoa, I just realized I'm a mind thinking about itself.

[Sergarr]

Well, it's good to know that I've helped at least one another person to realize more of their inner mental potential...

have fun with your newly found superpowers~

[Baffler]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

...PTW.

[Sergarr]

Might be following this closely with a ten-foot pole. Where'd this line of thinking come from, Sergarr?

I was very bored when I was young. Very bored. People start to do weird things when they get that bored.

Also, some highly impressive and vivid books about shape-shifters.

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

Hey, cool! I too like shapeshifting. But how did shapeshifting lead to meditation? (If I am reading your post right, you have used this meditation to... feel either the process of changing or the result of changing. How did you do that?)

[Max™]

I remember being so disappointed when I was unable to disprove my persistent feeling that the world was terribly mundane, trying a bunch of different astral projection crap, finally figuring out that the only interesting stuff was the meditation.

I remember talking the missus through it some and while I was having her explore the state she told me she had a pink pit, so I had her try to channel energy into it and up through the rest of her and she said it felt like her hair tickled which was pretty neat.

>tfw no pink pit

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

It's difficult not to interpret that in a lewd way.

*snicker guffaw*

I have decided that I need more detail for my perception-meddling stuff:

Disclaimer: I haven't tested it that much. It's easier to change a perception if you want it to change, or if the existing perception is unclear. I was able to use this to switch between perceiving myself as feminine and masculine, and to see a trans person as a woman despite the many signs that they were AMAB. This might work well because femininity and masculinity have... an associated feeling or sense? I think that might be necessary.

Description: This is a technique for altering a perception. It does not affect the actual visual stimulus, but the end result of the interpretation of that stimulus.

Steps:
1. Do something... sort of like meditation? Or like falling asleep? But only do it halfway. Reality should be wobbling or warping at the edges of your vision, and it should be kind of hard for your thoughts to focus.
2. Take one thing. For me it was either myself or a trans person in the room.
3. Imagine an alteration to a perceived quality of that thing. This is easier because you are partially asleep. For instance, for the "trans person in the room," it was kind of weird to have half the signals as "male" (voice, shoulders) and half as "female" (clothes, etc.), it was a bit unsettling. So I twisted the way I saw that person - not the signals themselves, but the resulting classification. There should be a sense of "that person is male" or "that person is female."
a. This will not work on direct observations, AFAICT. I haven't been able to convince myself that blue was red, but I was able to convince myself that a particular person (myself or somebody else appeared feminine, even though direct observation would contradict that.
b. This is somewhat hard to explain, but you need to be asleep/meditating because otherwise your mind will keep asserting reality onto your perceptions. If you're partially asleep or meditating, you can change perceptions in nonsensical ways.
4. This is the tricky part - while holding "this object is Y" in your mind (while it's really X), wake all the way up. This can take a few tries. I just experimented until I figured out how to hold the perception constant.
5. Don't think about the contradiction. Oh shit, this is basically doublethink. Just... ignore that you are wrong? It's easier for some people than others.

Thankfully, you only need to go through this the first time you twist a particular perception - the mental motion of twisting a perception is familiar, so you should be able to do it even if you're completely awake. You can lose it over time, though, but a quick meditation and re-do of the above should fix that.

It's harder to keep this up for extended periods of time. Normally, refreshing it every once in a while should be fine, but if that's not good enough for you, try practicing a constant, minor mental force toward a given perception.

Also, it's not hard to reverse if need be. If you've managed to convince yourself that the sky is made of flies or some shit, don't worry. Just focus on one observation that makes up that perception and... "pull" the illusion away?

[Sergarr]

Hey, cool! I too like shapeshifting. But how did shapeshifting lead to meditation? (If I am reading your post right, you have used this meditation to... feel either the process of changing or the result of changing. How did you do that?)

Well, those were not just books about physical shape-shifting. They were also mental one. For example, in one of them, there's a place with the beings ("el-in", as they're called there) who've gone too far with their shape-shifting and stopped being... conventionally sentient.

One of them was a living water fountain that radiated so much happiness that it almost enticed the main heroine (yes, heroine, she's also one of the "el-in") to do the same thing, too.

I think there were also some more fiction books about more conventional variants of meditation that I've read (in fact, it seems like most of them that I liked to read contained something like that), but they didn't leave such a lasting impression as this one.

[Max™]

It's difficult not to interpret that in a lewd way.

*snicker guffaw*

Well, it was a bit higher, more centered around her womb, and she later linked the sense of her childhood self to there as a tether to "little me" but yeah, it was definitely one of those things that struck me as "ok this is girl stuff" right away.

[Sergarr]

I can't believe that I have to do it so soon, but:

I guess I should also remind you that no NSFW stuff is allowed here, as well as anyone else on this forum, so duh

While, yeah, it technically isn't like that... it's skirting pretty close. I'd like less explicit-posting and more vague-posting.

[Max™]

Well, like I said, it wasn't a sexual thing, I just had her do some breathing and relax, get her zoned in nicely, and then had her try to look down into herself and she told me about it, was actually curious if other girls had a similar sort of inner image while meditating or whatnot.

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

Hey, cool! I too like shapeshifting. But how did shapeshifting lead to meditation? (If I am reading your post right, you have used this meditation to... feel either the process of changing or the result of changing. How did you do that?)

Well, those were not just books about physical shape-shifting. They were also mental one.

I don't think I mentioned physical changes specifically? Also, mental shape-shifting is cool but difficult, I agree.

For example, in one of them, there's a place with the beings ("el-in", as they're called there) who've gone too far with their shape-shifting and stopped being... conventionally sentient.

One of them was a living water fountain that radiated so much happiness that it almost enticed the main heroine (yes, heroine, she's also one of the "el-in") to do the same thing, too.

I think there were also some more fiction books about more conventional variants of meditation that I've read (in fact, it seems like most of them that I liked to read contained something like that), but they didn't leave such a lasting impression as this one.

Oh, I see. Which series or book is this?

I can't believe that I have to do it so soon, but:

I guess I should also remind you that no NSFW stuff is allowed here, as well as anyone else on this forum, so duh

While, yeah, it technically isn't like that... it's skirting pretty close. I'd like less explicit-posting and more vague-posting.

But I am a literal robot who does not understand vagueness!

[Sergarr]

I don't think I mentioned physical changes specifically? Also, mental shape-shifting is cool but difficult, I agree.

Well, it's what is usually meant by the word "shape-shifting" - change of physical shape. And I dunno, it was somewhat difficult before, but now~

Oh, I see. Which series or book is this?

Dancing with Aute, a trilogy from author Anastasiya Parfenova. It's a Russian series, so I have no idea if there's any good English translations.

But I am a literal robot who does not understand vagueness!

You don't have to understand it, just mimicry the required behaviour~

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

I don't think I mentioned physical changes specifically? Also, mental shape-shifting is cool but difficult, I agree.

Well, it's what is usually meant by the word "shape-shifting" - change of physical shape. And I dunno, it was somewhat difficult before, but now~

I used the term "changing" to be more general, yes; shape-shifting usually refers to the shifting of shape.
Difficult in the sense of difficult to learn, not necessarily to do.

Oh, I see. Which series or book is this?

Dancing with Aute, a trilogy from author Anastasiya Parfenova. It's a Russian series, so I have no idea if there's any good English translations.

Do you think it's worth a few bucks? It's a moot point, though, I don't actually have any money.

But I am a literal robot who does not understand vagueness!

You don't have to understand it, just mimicry the required behaviour~

What does a tilde at the end of a sentence mean?~