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[Rolepgeek]

I'd like to note something for Lord lemonpie primarily; for people who make their sexuality a keypoint of their identity/existence, in my experience it's often or usually a result of being attacked for it. When other people make it the centerpiece of their perception of you, especially if it's one's parents, it can be both a defense mechanism and one of the only avenues left in which to feel like you belong. The principle seems fairly similar to how people get defensive and believe more strongly in their position if challenged on it. That being said, this goes for moderate-high amounts of centerpiecing, rather than internet troll/Poe's law levels.

I'm primarily aware of this due to being adjacent to it; I never really had significant problems about being bi (never having had a boyfriend and appearing straight for just about all metrics helps with that, I suspect) beyond like, freshman year in high school (oddly enough, after coming within about half a second of smashing a chair into a guy's face after he clotheslined me for refusing to let him pull some 'don't sit near me freak' shit, no one wanted to mess with me. Weird how that works.(actually more disturbing was people congratulating me or praising me for it especially considering how lucky I was to be tackled before I actually hit the guy)), and when I went to drop-in stuff for the semi-local lgbt center, I never really felt like I fit in. Identify more as a geek than as lgbt, and nobody there seemed all too interested in the stuff I was. They all were much more interested in lgbt stuff than me, had their friend groups and usually had either home lives that kinda sucked or a significant amount of abuse from peers.

[TempAcc]

For example, the whole "manspreading" thing. There was a big campaign about it based on tumblr stuff. Then because of that, the NY Metro (and other transit systems), instituted public awareness campaigns about it. Yet, they also said they'd never received a single complaint about it. In fact, they said the most common complaint was about people taking up excessive seating space with bags. And notably, it's mostly women shown doing that in images.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manspreading

That's actually something that's pretty annoying in a car if your trying to fit 3 people in the back seat on a long trip. On a bus or train it pisses me off, but you just can tilt so your legs are in the aisle. Possibly you don't hear about it in real life because it's annoying but not worth bitching about? Where as on the net you can bitch anonymously about every little thing?

The problem with the whole thing isn't that "manspreading" (infinicringe) isn't annoying, its that stuff like the tumblr buzz about it and its resulting effects blew up something that was essentialy a non issue to ridiculous proportions.
Doesn't mean it didn't happen, but it didn't happen nearly enough to become a real issue or be worthy of regulation or awareness campaigns. A non issue was artifically made into an issue because there were people interested in making an issue out of it, and not because it ever was a real, significant issue. In the end the campaign benefitted none of the supposed affected parties, and only served to bring money and attention to media outlets and people that rode on the popularity wave it generated.

[wobbly]

The problem with the whole thing isn't that "manspreading" (infinicringe) isn't annoying, its that stuff like the tumblr buzz about it and its resulting effects blew up something that was essentialy a non issue to ridiculous proportions.

Did it though? I never saw the tumbler buzz about it, & I didn't see it ever become an issue outside of tumbler either. It often seems that the people who complain about tumbler being out of touch with reality are spending too much time watching what goes on on tumbler.

[tonnot98]

I've a question.

So gender dysphoria is a thing, or at least it is debatably a thing. Could someone have dysphoria over being a person? Could someone just dislike being a person, or being human so much that it develops into a mental disorder? I haven't been able to actually look up any examples, but there's that whole "otherkin" thing that has been going on in tumblr and such for a while. I kind of want to disclude them but that'd be a horrible bias, even if they do just want to be snowflakes.

[TempAcc]

The problem with the whole thing isn't that "manspreading" (infinicringe) isn't annoying, its that stuff like the tumblr buzz about it and its resulting effects blew up something that was essentialy a non issue to ridiculous proportions.

Did it though? I never saw the tumbler buzz about it, & I didn't see it ever become an issue outside of tumbler either. It often seems that the people who complain about tumbler being out of touch with reality are spending too much time watching what goes on on tumbler.

Me thinks you didn't quite understand. It was blown out of proportion within tumblr itself, and never did it have any real consequence IRL, because it was never an actual issue IRL, except I guess for the NY subway but lel, NY.

If you didn't see it, good job living under an internet rock, as pretty much everyone made fun of the posts and videos that got posted about it by people that actualy took it seriously.

[Lord_lemonpie]

I'd like to note something for Lord lemonpie primarily; for people who make their sexuality a keypoint of their identity/existence, in my experience it's often or usually a result of being attacked for it. When other people make it the centerpiece of their perception of you, especially if it's one's parents, it can be both a defense mechanism and one of the only avenues left in which to feel like you belong. The principle seems fairly similar to how people get defensive and believe more strongly in their position if challenged on it. That being said, this goes for moderate-high amounts of centerpiecing, rather than internet troll/Poe's law levels.

Yeah, I understand why they'd do it. I just hate those that are incredibly toxic about it, and I hate the fact that everyone assumes that because they're so gigantically vocal about it that has to mean I'm automatically like them too.

[wobbly]

If you didn't see it, good job living under an internet rock, as pretty much everyone made fun of the posts and videos that got posted about it by people that actualy took it seriously.

Fair call. To a large extent I do "live under an internet rock" but as you say, it wasn't worth paying attention to in the 1st place & never would of been an issue if people didn't pay too much attention to things that weren't worth paying attention.

[TempAcc]

I'd like to note something for Lord lemonpie primarily; for people who make their sexuality a keypoint of their identity/existence, in my experience it's often or usually a result of being attacked for it. When other people make it the centerpiece of their perception of you, especially if it's one's parents, it can be both a defense mechanism and one of the only avenues left in which to feel like you belong. The principle seems fairly similar to how people get defensive and believe more strongly in their position if challenged on it. That being said, this goes for moderate-high amounts of centerpiecing, rather than internet troll/Poe's law levels.

Yeah, I understand why they'd do it. I just hate those that are incredibly toxic about it, and I hate the fact that everyone assumes that because they're so gigantically vocal about it that has to mean I'm automatically like them too.

That attitude is also specially deleterious not only because it makes them a target for terrible people, but also warps society's view of the group they belong to. If you belong to group A and you make sure to be loud, toxic and flamboyant about your sexuality because you feel it is somehow a good defense mechanism against social rejection, and people end up getting a negative view of you, through generalization people will start thinking all members of said group are similar or the same.

Given that society in general, both western and eastern, still has a very generalized view of non heterosexual people (mostly thanks to the LGBT movements trying to make sure anything non heterosexual gets appropriated under their representation umbrella), its gets very easy to warp society's view of a huge number of people.

[Starver]

(Many new posts whilst composing...)

How much is sexual dimorphism relevent in the sitting geometry of the hip and thigh areas?

Wider hips allow more upper thigh to comfortably lie close together without spread at the knees, the 'thigh gap' seems to be a sought-after phenomenon (at least recently) meaning it's the traditionally leaner knees that dictate the spread (or, in this case convergence) angle. Men have narrower hip-joints and may well have thicker thighs (fat and/or muscle, depending on lifestyle) already pressing together.

Depending on how I'm sat, it isn't always possible to get my knees to touch, I have discovered whilst consciously thinking about this issue as I'm sat at a window seat and the rapidly filling bus puts someone else on the aisle side. (Strangely, though, I can do this right this moment. It might depend upon things including the actual trousers I'm wearing at the time - perhaps the feeling of straining certain seams or creasing other bits of fabric into my flesh without the easy ability to fidget those tensions in the material away round the curve of the joints.)

The male variety of equipment between those thighs tends to find a place to be, in my experience, so it's not so much part of the topological problem except maybe with badly fitting underwear, but I can't personally compare and contrast with those who have to manage with the alternative (and possibly their choice of monthly products being an issue. Ditto there are two different forms of potentially being hot and sticky.

Also, socially (and sartorially) girls are not encouraged (actively discouraged) to spread their legs whilst sitting, so maybe us men have never quite had the imperative to try to reduce our natural divergence of thighs (and the monotubular nature of skirting likewise a restriction, if pleating or slitting¹ isn't a major feature to allow movement...), even when we aren't trying to display our 'manliness' on whatever conscious level.


¹ In the last few minutes I have learnt more new things about skirts and dresses than I previously already knew, as I tried to qualify my existing ideas by looking at everything from hobble skirts to Empire silhouettes in a bit of crash research on the subject.

[Reelya]

The problem with the whole thing isn't that "manspreading" (infinicringe) isn't annoying, its that stuff like the tumblr buzz about it and its resulting effects blew up something that was essentialy a non issue to ridiculous proportions.

Did it though? I never saw the tumbler buzz about it, & I didn't see it ever become an issue outside of tumbler either. It often seems that the people who complain about tumbler being out of touch with reality are spending too much time watching what goes on on tumbler.

It leaked into the real-world with big posters about it everywhere on several cities metro services. That's certainly "outside of tumblr". And it was a distortion: if you read the relevant articles, the subway operators mentioned they'd never had a complaint about that specific thing yet it was the thing mentioned in bold letters at the top of the community service signs (above a number of other things written in small writing, which were the things people on the metro did actually complain about).

[Lord_lemonpie]

The problem with the whole thing isn't that "manspreading" (infinicringe) isn't annoying, its that stuff like the tumblr buzz about it and its resulting effects blew up something that was essentialy a non issue to ridiculous proportions.

Did it though? I never saw the tumbler buzz about it, & I didn't see it ever become an issue outside of tumbler either. It often seems that the people who complain about tumbler being out of touch with reality are spending too much time watching what goes on on tumbler.

It leaked into the real-world with big posters about it everywhere on several cities metro services. That's certainly "outside of tumblr". And it was a distortion: if you read the relevant articles, the subway operators mentioned they'd never had a complaint about that specific thing yet it was the thing mentioned in bold letters at the top of the community service signs (above a number of other things written in small writing, which were the things people on the metro did actually complain about).

A source, for those who (understandably) refuse to believe this absolute nonsense. I refused to believe it when I first heard about it.

[Grek]

So gender dysphoria is a thing, or at least it is debatably a thing. Could someone have dysphoria over being a person? Could someone just dislike being a person, or being human so much that it develops into a mental disorder? I haven't been able to actually look up any examples, but there's that whole "otherkin" thing that has been going on in tumblr and such for a while. I kind of want to disclude them but that'd be a horrible bias, even if they do just want to be snowflakes.

Theoretically, yes. But there's no useful treatment to recommend, so there's no point diagnosing someone with species dysphoria or whatever the technical term would be, and no research done into that sort of thing.

Honestly, I find the whole "otherkin are cringey special snowflakes" meme kinda terrible. Maybe they really would be happier as an tiger or anthromorphic manseal or whatever. If we had the technology to make that happen, there'd be no reason not to let them make use of it in their pursuit of self-actualization. We don't, which is vaguely sad in the same way that our ongoing lack of flying cars and robot maids is sad, but that's no reason to mock someone for wishing it was possible.

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

I mean, we do, and there are a few cases where such procedures actually happened. Thing is, it is a recognized mental disorder, and it has a name- schizotypal personality disorder.

...that's social anxiety and paranoia. That has nothing to do with otherkin AFAIK.

Edit: that's STPD in a nutshell. Not everybody who has social anxiety is schizotypal, obviously.

[Shadowlord]

It generally ties into the "unconventional beliefs" part. To quote Wikipedia quoting the DSM-5:

At least five of the following symptoms must be present: ideas of reference, strange beliefs or magical thinking, abnormal perceptual experiences, strange thinking and speech, paranoia, inappropriate or constricted affect, strange behavior or appearance, lack of close friends, and excessive social anxiety that does not abate and stems from paranoia rather than negative judgments about self. These symptoms must not occur only during the course of a disorder with similar symptoms (such as schizophrenia or autism spectrum disorder).

That does not sound particularly useful as as diagnostic tool to me. There are a lot of people in the USA which appear to fit five of these at the same time. For example:
Strange beliefs or magical thinking (god created the world ~4000 years ago, Jesus rode dinosaurs, I will live forever), abnormal perceptual experiences (two-way mental conversations with Jesus etc), strange thinking and speech (I certainly cannot make sense of their thinking), paranoia (communist muslim obama is going to take our guns and put us all in fema camps), strange behavior or appearance (lots of strange behaviors! Like having guns and supporting the death penalty when Jesus said to turn the other cheek!).

But maybe it's more rigorous than it sounds? I hope?

[Dozebôm Lolumzalìs]

"I cannot understand it therefore it is strange." Very objective, good sir.

Remember, you should always diagnose your enemies as mentally ill. Especially if you aren't a doctor, especially if you're conversing over the internet and you really have no way of knowing their mental health.

(I'm just poking fun, I'm aware that you're not really trying to diagnose fundies.)