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Author Topic: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American: T+0  (Read 1419408 times)

martinuzz

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9540 on: November 04, 2016, 06:40:56 pm »

I dunno, Hillary's like 20 feet and Bernie put some soft stuff on the bottom, really, it's far from a worst-case scenario. Trump is a 101-foot cliff that happens to have a roaring volcanic flow underneath it.
Sounds like the true dwarven thing would be to vote Trump then. Magma for the masses!
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http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=73719.msg1830479#msg1830479

Sergarr

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9541 on: November 04, 2016, 06:45:19 pm »

Yeah it's easy to say that you're "unable to do anything" about the upcoming election when you throw your vote away!

Both of the main candidates are cliffs. One might be 100 ft tall and the other 101 ft tall, but it's doom either way. Everyone is voting for the cliff. I"m voting for something other than cliff, but people can't stop focusing on that 1ft as being key.

It's funny in a dark sort of way that this year, when you have two candidates who are probably the two most disliked candidates generally for many years, you're still unlikely to see any significant third party gains, because people are so scared of 'throwing their vote away'.

Makes me wonder if their vote was really worth much in the first place, if they couldn't cast it where they wanted.
Yeah that's because those third-parties are a joke.

In a two-party system like USA, real third-parties join one of the two big parties and subvert them from within. Like fucking Bernie Sanders. He's a classic third-party candidate, having only put himself as a Democrat to be able to run with actual chances to win!
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sluissa

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9542 on: November 04, 2016, 06:50:03 pm »

Yeah it's easy to say that you're "unable to do anything" about the upcoming election when you throw your vote away!

Both of the main candidates are cliffs. One might be 100 ft tall and the other 101 ft tall, but it's doom either way. Everyone is voting for the cliff. I"m voting for something other than cliff, but people can't stop focusing on that 1ft as being key.
Okay, tell me in a short sentence, what will Hillary do to ruin USA with certain doom. I'm listening.

She ruined the middle east and antagonizes Putin and China.

Not voting is saying 'I don't care.' It is literally the least helpful thing you could possibly do for your country and is your biggest and best chance to enact change.

Do not waste your vote.


I'm voting, just not for Trump or Clinton. I'm pushing for Johnson at the moment. I know he won't win, but if we're still around in 4 years, maybe we'll have a sane option with some notability. It's partially a protest vote, but I also respect him more than any other candidate at the moment even if I don't really agree with all of his positions.


EDIT: And honestly at this point if pushed to pick a main party I might just vote Trump because all of y'all are being jerks about it.

Double Edit: Scratch that, I wrote that and felt sick, so nevermind.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2016, 06:58:54 pm by sluissa »
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Frumple

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9543 on: November 04, 2016, 07:30:44 pm »

It's funny in a dark sort of way that this year, when you have two candidates who are probably the two most disliked candidates generally for many years, you're still unlikely to see any significant third party gains, because people are so scared of 'throwing their vote away'.

Makes me wonder if their vote was really worth much in the first place, if they couldn't cast it where they wanted.
Nah, most of the reason the third parties haven't been getting much gains is that they've been going sodding insane. If someone that did decent by the party's general spirit and wasn't johnson or stein was running, they may have done better. Though yeah, probably would have done better if it was someone besides trump running, too. Iirc from what I've seen of the early voting so far there's a fair number of independents et al (folks that would be more likely to go 3rd) that are voting clinton, almost certainly to a large extent because holy hell is trump a terrible candidate. For all some folks try to equivocate the two there's really no sane grounds for doing so, and the folks more likely to vote 3rd party tend to be more sensitive to that sort of thing than our more partisan voters.

That said, one of the more amusing things about this whole shitflinging mess is that clinton's got decent odds of being one of the better liked presidents in recent-ish history. She's got this strange and fairly consistent pattern going on where she's actually pretty damn liked/approved off... when she's not running for a higher office than she previously had. Probably all sorts of reasons, but I do rather imagine having the airways drowned in manufactured scandal 24/7 doesn't help much. That cuts back a bit (or at least gets ignored more) during off years.
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PTTG??

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9544 on: November 04, 2016, 07:31:06 pm »

The whole "Hillary will displease Putin" thing is the most bizarre argument I've yet heard of. It amounts to stoking hate for 'foreigners' while simultaneously saying that we should do everything malicious foreign leaders ask.

Even if Trump's blatant sycophanthy to Putin didn't exist, Hillary is more of a diplomat than the average candidate, which makes the fact that the gung-ho jingnostic Trump is criticizing her on that front all the more bizarre.
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Sergarr

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9545 on: November 04, 2016, 07:50:42 pm »

Yeah it's easy to say that you're "unable to do anything" about the upcoming election when you throw your vote away!

Both of the main candidates are cliffs. One might be 100 ft tall and the other 101 ft tall, but it's doom either way. Everyone is voting for the cliff. I"m voting for something other than cliff, but people can't stop focusing on that 1ft as being key.
Okay, tell me in a short sentence, what will Hillary do to ruin USA with certain doom. I'm listening.

She ruined the middle east and antagonizes Putin and China.
Yeah okay.

In more serious news: Electoral college voter says he will not vote for Clinton.
Quote
Robert Satiacum, a member of Washington's Puyallup Tribe, supported Bernie Sanders in the Democratic primary. He said he believes Clinton is a "criminal" who doesn't care enough about American Indians and "she's done nothing but flip back and forth."
Bernie Bros strike back! You thought they were already dead, but in fact, they've been planning their master stroke all along!
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LoSboccacc

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9546 on: November 04, 2016, 07:54:01 pm »

Is'nt Johnson an anti-vaxxer tho?
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9547 on: November 04, 2016, 07:59:30 pm »

In more serious news: Electoral college voter says he will not vote for Clinton.
Quote
Robert Satiacum, a member of Washington's Puyallup Tribe, supported Bernie Sanders in the Democratic primary. He said he believes Clinton is a "criminal" who doesn't care enough about American Indians and "she's done nothing but flip back and forth."
Bernie Bros strike back! You thought they were already dead, but in fact, they've been planning their master stroke all along!

Quote
Satiacum faces a $1,000 fine in Washington if he doesn't vote for Clinton, but he said he doesn't care.
OH SHIT TITANIUM GRADE BALLS
DOESN'T GIVE A FUCK

Now pardon me if I'm wrong, one guy not voting for Hillary isn't that big of a deal right? More just the fear that more will follow his lead that is most significant?

Sergarr

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9548 on: November 04, 2016, 08:06:54 pm »

In more serious news: Electoral college voter says he will not vote for Clinton.
Quote
Robert Satiacum, a member of Washington's Puyallup Tribe, supported Bernie Sanders in the Democratic primary. He said he believes Clinton is a "criminal" who doesn't care enough about American Indians and "she's done nothing but flip back and forth."
Bernie Bros strike back! You thought they were already dead, but in fact, they've been planning their master stroke all along!

Quote
Satiacum faces a $1,000 fine in Washington if he doesn't vote for Clinton, but he said he doesn't care.
OH SHIT TITANIUM GRADE BALLS
DOESN'T GIVE A FUCK

Now pardon me if I'm wrong, one guy not voting for Hillary isn't that big of a deal right? More just the fear that more will follow his lead that is most significant?
There are scenarios which come down to a wire (with either a tie or a difference in like one or two electoral votes), so... even a single defector could mean the difference between victory or defeat.

And that's just one person who have openly admitted that. There definitely could be more. Imagine the ungodly shit-storm if they actually change the election results. In addition to Trump calling for revolution. Combined with FBI dropping new and new smoke grenades on Clinton.

Yeah, great peaceful election you've got going there, USA. Really showing off your 200+ years of experience in the field.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9549 on: November 04, 2016, 08:09:52 pm »

Sergarr careful there, you might have a Fun overdose
First you got to enjoy Western Europe tear at its throat over Season 1: Brexit, now you get to watch the USA implode over the Election finale with your 1337 russian puppetmaster friends

MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9550 on: November 04, 2016, 08:19:44 pm »

If this dumb fuck actually hands the election to Donald Trump/McMuffin by giving an EV to Sanders...
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smjjames

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9551 on: November 04, 2016, 08:24:40 pm »

Is'nt Johnson an anti-vaxxer tho?

You're probably thinking of Stein. Not sure what Johnsons position is.

In more serious news: Electoral college voter says he will not vote for Clinton.
Quote
Robert Satiacum, a member of Washington's Puyallup Tribe, supported Bernie Sanders in the Democratic primary. He said he believes Clinton is a "criminal" who doesn't care enough about American Indians and "she's done nothing but flip back and forth."
Bernie Bros strike back! You thought they were already dead, but in fact, they've been planning their master stroke all along!

Quote
Satiacum faces a $1,000 fine in Washington if he doesn't vote for Clinton, but he said he doesn't care.
OH SHIT TITANIUM GRADE BALLS
DOESN'T GIVE A FUCK

Now pardon me if I'm wrong, one guy not voting for Hillary isn't that big of a deal right? More just the fear that more will follow his lead that is most significant?
There are scenarios which come down to a wire (with either a tie or a difference in like one or two electoral votes), so... even a single defector could mean the difference between victory or defeat.

And that's just one person who have openly admitted that. There definitely could be more. Imagine the ungodly shit-storm if they actually change the election results. In addition to Trump calling for revolution. Combined with FBI dropping new and new smoke grenades on Clinton.

Yeah, great peaceful election you've got going there, USA. Really showing off your 200+ years of experience in the field.

To be fair, it isn't the first rocky period that we've ever had. Obviously each rocky period is unique to it's time and situation, but I'm not sure which rocky period (like MSH gave examples of earlier) this is most like, or worse/not-worse than.

The optimistic scenario is that after the election, all the pent up pressure is released in one, long, blast of steam.

We might get a tie.



Holy shit we might actually get a tie.

The chance is there, yes, there's ALWAYS going to be a non-zero chance of getting a tie.

Gonna be a hell of a scenario if we do because the SCOTUS is in no position to decide like in 2000 and it'll get thrown to the House. I saw somewhere a description of the whole procedure if it happens, not sure if it was 538, this thread, or elsewhere.
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Sergarr

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9552 on: November 04, 2016, 08:25:11 pm »

If this dumb fuck actually hands the election to Donald Trump/McMuffin by giving an EV to Sanders...
Can he even do that? I mean, there must be at least some check on those electoral voters, a list of candidates, so that they wouldn't vote in a house cat for POTUS, right?

We might get a tie.



Holy shit we might actually get a tie.
Well, yeah, that has been a possibility for a long time AFAIK. The new factor is that said tie can now be broken by anomalous factors, such as a butthurt Bernie Bro voting "his conscience" in the inner workings of the election system.
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smjjames

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9553 on: November 04, 2016, 08:30:53 pm »

If this dumb fuck actually hands the election to Donald Trump/McMuffin by giving an EV to Sanders...
Can he even do that? I mean, there must be at least some check on those electoral voters, a list of candidates, so that they wouldn't vote in a house cat for POTUS, right?

There is a system, yes, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faithless_elector, but the caveat here is that faithless electors have yet to actually change the outcome of an election. Well, with the exception of the 1836 election, which was an extremely unusual election in itself since the whigs tried running four candidates at once. Also, Faithless Electors were rare in the 20th century and the modern period.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2016, 08:35:02 pm by smjjames »
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Folly

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Re: Doc Helgoland's Asylum for the Politically American (\{mainiac})
« Reply #9554 on: November 04, 2016, 09:04:03 pm »

Don't worry, Beyonce and Jay Z will save Hilary!

Not voting is saying 'I don't care.' It is literally the least helpful thing you could possibly do for your country and is your biggest and best chance to enact change.

I get what you're saying, but your sentence structure needs work.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2016, 09:08:02 pm by Folly »
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