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[Sergarr]

A huge number of Americans, a large percentage of this group is low-income and/or minority) have no form of photo ID whatsoever. Nowhere in the US are you required to posess a photo ID in the first place. The only common form of such is a driver's license, which many inner-city people don't bother to get. You can also get a state ID if you choose to, this is only useful for purchasing age restricted products such as alcohol or tobacco, or entering age-restricted businesses such as a casino.

Oh okay, it makes sense in that case. We all have a mandatory passport / ID here.

Same here, and the thought of the #1 most wealthy state in the world not being able to afford such a simple thing for all of its citizens still boggles my mind.

[martinuzz]

Yeah. It's even considered a misdemeanor over here to not carry your passport/ID card on you at all times. I think the fine for it is 80 euros, but possibly more. It was 80 when they made carrying your passport mandatory nearly a decade ago.

[penguinofhonor]

.

[Lord Shonus]

A huge number of Americans, a large percentage of this group is low-income and/or minority) have no form of photo ID whatsoever. Nowhere in the US are you required to posess a photo ID in the first place. The only common form of such is a driver's license, which many inner-city people don't bother to get. You can also get a state ID if you choose to, this is only useful for purchasing age restricted products such as alcohol or tobacco, or entering age-restricted businesses such as a casino.

Oh okay, it makes sense in that case. We all have a mandatory passport / ID here.

Same here, and the thought of the #1 most wealthy state in the world not being able to afford such a simple thing for all of its citizens still boggles my mind.

We can afford it just fine - it's just that the entire idea instantly brings the image of jackbooted thugs screaming "WHERE ARE YOUR PAPERS" to mind, and no benefit to offset that has ever been found. Not to mention the extreme fear of "the Man" that is strongly present in a huge portion of the American (particularly minority-American) populace.

I had forgotten that a photo ID also is required when opening a bank account (as part of the post-9/11 paranoia laws), but lots of people don't bother with those either. We don't have mandatory ID laws for no reason other than because we don't want them.

[alway]

Most importantly, America is big. Like, really really big. Unlike Europe, where you cross a country border every time you go to the local coffee shop, you can go absurd distances and still be in the US. The distance from LA to New York City is almost exactly equal to the distance from the middle of Portugal to Moscow. All without crossing any national borders.

As mentioned, the most common form of ID in the US is a driver's license. Thing is, getting one of those requires: some form of Driver's Ed, driving tests you need to pass, and being a generally abled person; no blind folks, no narcoleptics, no people prone to seizures or other medical issues. On top of that, you may need a vehicle, which means money.

Passports are another one: those cost $500 or so and expire periodically.


Moreover though, when drafting these laws in some of the cases where they were struck down recently, the Republican legislatures first requested studies showing which voter demographics would have which forms of IDs. They then banned those forms of ID which would be used by non-white voters so as to maximize disenfranchisement of minority voters and minimize disenfranchisement of those who would likely vote for their party.

[NullForceOmega]

From a purely technical standpoint it could even be argued that requiring identification (at the federal level) is unconstitutional.  The language isn't the clearest on that point, but it appears to indicate that the federal government is not allowed to create a national level ID system (due to the need for such a system to obtain data from citizens that might be protected [the data, not the citizens]).  There appear to be several ongoing investigations as to what kind of data would be appropriate for the federal government to acquire in such a system.

[Starver]

Most importantly, America is big. Like, really really big. Unlike Europe, where you cross a country border every time you go to the local coffee shop,

Slight exageration, unless you're somewhere like Baarle-Hertog... 

(And I just checked, there's apparently no Starbucks within 300km of Rome, never mind the Vatican, so the Pope would probably not wander out of his province to get to that chain.)

More seriously, UK does not require photo-id in everyday life; excepting, on request and yet still you get a grace period to produce it, driving licences in direct relevence to driving offences. Passports for plane travel (even national?) are another.  You may be asked to give produce photo-id to reclaim bank cards lost and found, but that's corporate policy (or so it was said) and some submanagers agree that its overkill when the person asking about the card knows enough details about it (including the fact that a card of that description was even lost in the first place) that they allow you to shortcut the process of getting home and coming back with said id.

We don't use it for voting at all. NI excepted.

[smirk]

From a purely technical standpoint it could even be argued that requiring identification (at the federal level) is unconstitutional.  The language isn't the clearest on that point, but it appears to indicate that the federal government is not allowed to create a national level ID system (due to the need for such a system to obtain data from citizens that might be protected [the data, not the citizens]).  There appear to be several ongoing investigations as to what kind of data would be appropriate for the federal government to acquire in such a system.

That said, I can see where a national ID system would be useful. Look at Social Security Numbers: they were supposed to be just for, well, a person's social security file, but they've pretty much morphed into a generic ID number. Stick a photo on there and start issuing 'em at the DMV, require people to update the photo every 6 years or so, and there ya go. And far more people have an SSN than driver's license, because it's nigh impossible to function without one. Unless you're really hard-line Amish or somesuch.

Not that I want a national ID, but there's a place for one that's currently being filled haphazardly.

[Reelya]

A victory for democracy.

The voter ID law in NC was struck down by the the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals following a similar occurrence in WI yesterday.

I don't see the problem with having to show photo ID for voting. Over here in the Netherlands you have to bring your official passport / EU ID card. WHich has photo and fingerprint.

It's good for democracy to force the use of a document that's very hard to forge. It's bad for democracy if you can just come vote with a document without photo. Too easy to fraud.

You have no idea how hard they make it to get voter ID in the affected areas of the USA.

For example, in one area, the office to get the ID is only open on the 5th Wednesday of every month. But a normal month only has 4 weeks, meaning that the only office in the area you can legally get the ID is only only 4 days a year, and that's a workday.

This video explains some details. It's John Oliver, so it's entertaining, informative and some freaking scary shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHFOwlMCdto

[TempAcc]

Ye, its actualy pretty common around the world to have to present your ID with photo when you go vote, or an equivalent document (also with photo).

[Reelya]

To give an idea of the scale of voter ID laws, here are stats cited by USA's Attorney General Eric Holder:
http://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2012/jul/11/eric-holder/eric-holder-says-recent-studies-show-25-percent-af/

25% of Black Americans don't have ID
8% of White Americans don't have ID

Basically, by passing Voter ID laws, it's like free votes for Trump & Co.

And seriously, watch the John Oliver video I linked. Basically, if you don't drive you need to get a Voter ID from a special office, they hardly have any of those offices, and little public transport, so you need to get someone to drive you, and they have bizarro world opening hours.

I'm guessing it's a lot different in Europe, and in Australia where I live. The situation is just not comparable.

[Erkki]

Two pictures and about 60 US $ for a passport, any working day from 8 AM to 4 PM. Eligible for 5 years. They'll also mail it home.

I don't remember how much the drivers license was but it was more, just the tests are closer to 150 USD if one passes at first try. Then again, drivers license isn't an official ID the same way that a passport is.

Yeah, sounds easier than being able to get an ID on just 4 days in a year and only if you happen to have loads of cash and a car.

edit: also theres no need to register as a voter, they'll mail the notification on an approaching vote to one. I believe it is possible to vote without an ID too, somehow.

[misko27]

In any case, Voter Fraud is rare in the US.

[Elephant Parade]

Two pictures and about 60 US $ for a passport, any working day from 8 AM to 4 PM. Eligible for 5 years. They'll also mail it home.

I don't remember how much the drivers license was but it was more, just the tests are closer to 150 USD if one passes at first try. Then again, drivers license isn't an official ID the same way that a passport is.

Yeah, sounds easier than being able to get an ID on just 4 days in a year and only if you happen to have loads of cash and a car.

edit: also theres no need to register as a voter, they'll mail the notification on an approaching vote to one. I believe it is possible to vote without an ID too, somehow.

60$ might be a pretty big deal, if you're poor enough.

And besides: It doesn't matter how difficult getting the ID actually is; what matters is that the requirements are totally pointless—voter fraud is a nonissue—and were, according to a federal judge, imposed specifically to reduce the turnout of majority-Democrat minorities.

[miauw62]

Yeah, it's pretty easy to get ID in Europe, and afaik it's legally required in most places. In Belgium, it's even legally required to vote. You're literally fined if you don't vote.