Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[TheBiggerFish]

Looked it up:
If I use it on the evil role, they're eliminated and I win.
Otherwise I can't win.

[TheBiggerFish]

Someone in particular or just someone?

[TheBiggerFish]

Is it a one-shot?

Do you know who 'someone' is?

[hector13]

Looked it up:
If I use it on the evil role, they're eliminated and I win.
Otherwise I can't win.

Does it say anything about the rest of the town..?

My wincon is to protect someone else. My action is to protect them.

Are you told who needs to be protected? (you don't have to - nor should you, probably - tell us who)

[TheBiggerFish]

@hector:It does not.  I'm a Neutral.  Again.  *sigh*

@TMS:Is it role based or name based?

[TheBiggerFish]

I'm figuring role-based, but I figured I'd ask.

[TheBiggerFish]

Okay then.

[Tomasque]

Would you tell us if this were the case, Tomasque?

I would, unless the entire point point of the round was to not tell you about it.

[Starver]

Starver, when you get on, what do you have to say for yourself? Given we seem to be revealing wincons, what's yours?

If I give it explicitly, people can and will try to spoil my day, and chances are that this will spoil the opportunity of a Town success, in the process.

Yes, that sounds suitably scummy, but I'm giving you as much of the truth as I dare (as will be discovered at whatever point my personal reveal appears, whether sooner or later - so mark this point, and please consider crediting me with it, at least (if I succumb this time) in future rounds!).

It's not for lack of imagination.  If I was scum, I feel I could have so easily make something up:

Spoiler: Something mostly made up... (click to show/hide)

I could have said (were I trying to hide my nature) is something easily concocted like "I am the Framed Man, I must ensure the bringing to justice of the person who framed me."  (Thus I could suggest an assumed Neutral or Evil target).  That would be a decent claim.  If we have a "secret protector" in TMS, then a "secret justice-giver" would easily work.  I'd be slightly clashing with TBF's claim (who claims neutral - for a not-unknown second time in a role; meanwhile it'd be my second time as Weak, or Investigator), so maybe that's the conflict I'd want to set up.  Hey, it would even give cover for me by suggesting a Miller situation.

And I know I can't be a member of the winning side today, regardless of if I live through it.  Maybe I have to get through a day unvoted-upon.  (Although I wouldn't put it past there being someone with a Hammer specifically attuned to work upon me.)

...and I think I could easily have swung that, even if I was just making an 'honest white lie' to help Town¹ while protecting myself.  But I'm not going to foist that upon you.  For one thing, it gives false hope that I'm some specialist Town-aligned Vig, that others could perhaps rely on to save their skins, and it won't be like that (so far as I know!).  Secondly, I've got nothing (yet!) against anyone, let alone TBF.  My real role is more complex than any fake one I could have presumed to fob you off with, but I'd prefer not to deceive you even for good reasons.  (And, of course, it doesn't help if I have to bring you my real tale when I know enough to eventually go public in any grand "j'accuse!" moment.)


The way I see it, the actual Scum would be happy with any lynching, except themselves.  Fallacy (regardless of alignment) naturally would like the same, and I think we'd have sympathy with that position.  But the pattern of the games, so far, has been that randomly-attempted lynches have never actually worked (at least by my assessment).  Hypocritical as it may be, of me, to ask for more details... but I would like to hear more discussion first.

Jaw-jaw, not trapdoor-trapdoor, that's all I ask for the time-being.


(Oh, hello Tomasque, handily posting just before I do...  Not that I expect you to back me up, or even provide any reply at all, but you know how (possibly foolishly) truthful I'm being, and what I'm risking.)


¹ I actually think I know how to kill the scum member(s?) and deliver another town-win, but it can't work if the scum has as complete a knowledge as what ideally I'd like the town to have.  Leave me work on this one, if you trust me.  And if you don't, just let what happens happen and let's see what the consequences are.  I'll earn your trust for future rounds, if nothing else.

[Starver]

(Oh, what bad editing and grammar snuck into that.  Maybe that's my Town Weakness!  Bad Grammar Man!)

[Tomasque]

Starver, when you get on, what do you have to say for yourself? Given we seem to be revealing wincons, what's yours?

If I give it explicitly, people can and will try to spoil my day, and chances are that this will spoil the opportunity of a Town success, in the process.

Yes, that sounds suitably scummy, but I'm giving you as much of the truth as I dare (as will be discovered at whatever point my personal reveal appears, whether sooner or later - so mark this point, and please consider crediting me with it, at least (if I succumb this time) in future rounds!).

It's not for lack of imagination.  If I was scum, I feel I could have so easily make something up:

Spoiler: Something mostly made up... (click to show/hide)

I could have said (were I trying to hide my nature) is something easily concocted like "I am the Framed Man, I must ensure the bringing to justice of the person who framed me."  (Thus I could suggest an assumed Neutral or Evil target).  That would be a decent claim.  If we have a "secret protector" in TMS, then a "secret justice-giver" would easily work.  I'd be slightly clashing with TBF's claim (who claims neutral - for a not-unknown second time in a role; meanwhile it'd be my second time as Weak, or Investigator), so maybe that's the conflict I'd want to set up.  Hey, it would even give cover for me by suggesting a Miller situation.

And I know I can't be a member of the winning side today, regardless of if I live through it.  Maybe I have to get through a day unvoted-upon.  (Although I wouldn't put it past there being someone with a Hammer specifically attuned to work upon me.)

...and I think I could easily have swung that, even if I was just making an 'honest white lie' to help Town¹ while protecting myself.  But I'm not going to foist that upon you.  For one thing, it gives false hope that I'm some specialist Town-aligned Vig, that others could perhaps rely on to save their skins, and it won't be like that (so far as I know!).  Secondly, I've got nothing (yet!) against anyone, let alone TBF.  My real role is more complex than any fake one I could have presumed to fob you off with, but I'd prefer not to deceive you even for good reasons.  (And, of course, it doesn't help if I have to bring you my real tale when I know enough to eventually go public in any grand "j'accuse!" moment.)


The way I see it, the actual Scum would be happy with any lynching, except themselves.  Fallacy (regardless of alignment) naturally would like the same, and I think we'd have sympathy with that position.  But the pattern of the games, so far, has been that randomly-attempted lynches have never actually worked (at least by my assessment).  Hypocritical as it may be, of me, to ask for more details... but I would like to hear more discussion first.

Jaw-jaw, not trapdoor-trapdoor, that's all I ask for the time-being.


(Oh, hello Tomasque, handily posting just before I do...  Not that I expect you to back me up, or even provide any reply at all, but you know how (possibly foolishly) truthful I'm being, and what I'm risking.)


¹ I actually think I know how to kill the scum member(s?) and deliver another town-win, but it can't work if the scum has as complete a knowledge as what ideally I'd like the town to have.  Leave me work on this one, if you trust me.  And if you don't, just let what happens happen and let's see what the consequences are.  I'll earn your trust for future rounds, if nothing else.

*reply*

[FallacyofUrist]

I win when I use an action on the evil role.

It's a 1-shot.

If I use it on the evil role, they're eliminated and I win.
Otherwise I can't win.

Eliminate t' Evil role is [my] wincon.

Starver, when you get on, what do you have to say for yourself? Given we seem to be revealing wincons, what's yours?

If I give it explicitly, people can and will try to spoil my day, and chances are that this will spoil the opportunity of a Town success, in the process.

I will win when the Evil role is eliminated.

My wincon is to protect someone else. My action is to protect them.

~~~
And that's everybody, folks!
Now I'm going to reveal exactly what I inspect for. When I inspect somebody, I learn who they need in order to win, even if my target doesn't know.
Pause...
Yep. That's right.
So, you ask. My result on hector13? He requires no one in order to win. That's what I got for a result. It could mean he's a townie with an unchanged win condition, it could also mean he's scum.
hector13: what say you?
~~~
Note this: I wonder what would happen if I inspected TBF... maybe I would learn the identity of the Evil role?
~~~~

But it wouldn't have worked if the role-list, as revealed by TMS, had made its way outside the rest of the group.

This from previous round. I got the role-list- if there was another one that explained what the roles could do, however, I didn't get it.

[hector13]

See the problem with that is that I'm a redirector. The bigger problem with that is I'm a random redirector, so I can't choose who to redirect to.

The biggest problem? I can be self-targeting! Which is what I did, 'cause I know I'm town and don't want any badness happening. The only issue I foresaw was if the investigator happ- oh.

If it makes you feel any better, had I not been self-targeting, you would probably not be marked

So you investigated one of the other three, since I also know that the random player chosen to be redirected to can't be the person that targeted me. Which means you're (probably) not lying. Bonus.

Town Special, if you're interested.

I'm not sure if investigating TBF would reveal the Evil role, since technically it isn't "needed" for a TBF/neutral win. I could also argue that an Evil role is required for a town victory, since that's who needs to be eliminated.

[Starver]

But it wouldn't have worked if the role-list, as revealed by TMS, had made its way outside the rest of the group.

This from previous round. I got the role-list- if there was another one that explained what the roles could do, however, I didn't get it.

Revealed to me, then.  If I remember correctly.  Apologies for any misattribution, however.

And I find your power interesting, FoU.  If we're also accepting Hector's claim, I'm not sure if this specific information helps anyone (except maybe the target, if they think they recognise themselves and needed reassurance that they haven't got a secret buddy they don't know about), but I could see it being useful for building bridges (or demolishing them) in other cases.

[FallacyofUrist]

hector13: Le huh. So... you target a player, then all players targeting that player are randomized? Is that what it is? Or did I read your claim wrong?