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[Fedor]

This is my best fortress so far (which ain't saying a whole heck of a lot).  Critique requested.

Full-size map:
Fortress map

Reduced map:

Location:  Wilderness, heavily forested, all civilizations

Plan:  build between the river and the chasm.  Try, despite this, to set up a large-scale, efficient metalworking operation.

The briefing:

Population 75.  Four legendary miners, three legendary engravers, a legendary mason.  Good carpenter, metalworker, clothier, farmers, brewer.  Four nobles and the Dwarven economy active.  Two deaths, one crippled for life.  

Excellent food situation.  Abundant raw materials of most kinds, great trading.
Metalworking, clothes-making, bone-crafting, and leatherworking are all fully up and running.  Having problems training stone-cutters and jewelers, due to slow glass production.

Short on animals (only 2 dogs were brought, and they haven't bred much or gotten many immigrant reinforcements) but unless the breeding bug hits - which it may because I've got all the non-pet beasts in cages - good prospects for growth and eventual slaughtering.  Hopefully, the massive order for dogs I've placed will arrive safely next summer; it's going to be hard for the humans to ask more than I can and will pay!

Poor defence.  Still no wardogs.  4 swordsdwarves, 2 marksmen, none better than "competant".  Traps moderately abundant, but other static defences almost totally lacking and the entire fortress poorly suited to withstanding anything serious.

The story thus far:  
1.  Good luck with attacks; have had hardly any.  Am expecting some soon...

2.  Fairly bad luck with artifacts so far, with a couple of engravers (one previously crippled for life by a rampaging possessed dwarf) becoming legendary.  However, my starting mason also created an artifact, and has cranked out more superior and masterpiece doors, thrones, statues, tables, floodgates, and coffins than this fortress will likely ever use.  Have trained up more armoursmiths, jewelers, etc., hoping for a stroke of luck.

Problems:
Figure out how to keep dwarves from running all over the ever-growing fort now that I can't assign most of them a bed.  Prepare better for attacks.  Create objects of surpassing beauty!

[puke]

its awful! format your hard drive and start over! wait, why were we trashing it again?

anyway, those are some GIA-effing-GANTIC treefarms for such a heavily wooded area.  

the fort is very spread out.  this can create efficency problems.  you seem to have a section near the river, a section near the chasm, and another section by the magma. lots of walking.

also, whats that tiny little tight packed section way at the bottom?

i like the giant single-section gold bridge.  very extravagant.  i bet it generates many happy thoughts.  i think single section bridges say "i have balls." in a very loud voice.  and with only two deaths on a fort that size, i'd say you're backing up the claim.

personally i build in redundancy, let dwarfs tantrum, and just replace what they break.  but preventing the deaths and tantrums in the first place shows some care and skill.  kudos to you.

[Eagle of Fire]

I have a feeling the strangely paced space at the bottom is the living quarters... If this is right, then it's probably the only problem I find while looking at the picture. Why have living quarters so far from everything else?

[Arkan15]

quote:Originally posted by Eagle of Fire:
<STRONG>I have a feeling the strangely paced space at the bottom is the living quarters... If this is right, then it's probably the only problem I find while looking at the picture. Why have living quarters so far from everything else?</STRONG>

It's not, those are mining shafts looking for ore (iron probably)

[Solara]

quote:Originally posted by Fedor:
<STRONG>
Problems:
Figure out how to keep dwarves from running all over the ever-growing fort now that I can't assign most of them a bed.</STRONG>

I'm not too good at critiquing fortresses but at least I can answer this. Just build a weapon (or armor) rack and use it to create a barracks. Dwarves that don't have beds will automatically sleep there. Living quarters are usually one of the last things I have up and running so it's a strategy I use all the time to keep the little guys from falling asleep on the riverbank or outside or whatever.

[Shzar]

Have you considered moving your trade depot indoors? Even putting it on the outside of the cave river could shorten hauls during trade time. It is indeed very spread out; I see little living quarters all over the place. It's neat looking, but I, too, wonder if your efficiency suffers a bit from it.

[Eagle of Fire]

quote:It's not, those are mining shafts looking for ore (iron probably)

I know what mining shafts are... I'm not talking about that.  :p

I was talking about this part of the fort:

[Mlittle]

I'm with eagle. Why are living quarters in a separate part of the fortress?
Also, you haven't left yourself any space to expand the food industry and the dinning room.

[Savok]

That's a graveyard. Look at the DFMA map first before jumping to conclusions.

[Eagle of Fire]

I didn't jump to conclusion, I asked a simple question. And I don't use flash, so I just won't. I considered the option in another thread, but I just don't want to consider using Flash at all.

I can be stubborn too.  :p

[Dwarfu]

What is the benefit of using statues between two doors instead of just using three doors?

[Mzbundifund]

quote:Originally posted by Dwarfu:
<STRONG>What is the benefit of using statues between two doors instead of just using three doors?</STRONG>

None really, but some people feel building a door in an area you wouldn't be able to without (f)orbidding another door is kind of cheating.  I sure do it, though.

[Fedor]

Thanks for the critiques, all!

quote:Originally posted by puke:
<STRONG>anyway, those are some GIA-effing-GANTIC treefarms for such a heavily wooded area.  </STRONG>

True.  They trained miners on cheap stone, provide lots of rocks for training siege operators, and will give me lots of wood, positioned closer to my workers than the remaining outside forests.  Gotta hate that 200 tower-cap limit, though.

quote:Originally posted by puke:<STRONG>the fort is very spread out.  this can create efficency problems.  you seem to have a section near the river, a section near the chasm, and another section by the magma. lots of walking.</STRONG>

quote:Originally posted by Shzar:
<STRONG>It is indeed very spread out; I see little living quarters all over the place. It's neat looking, but I, too, wonder if your efficiency suffers a bit from it.</STRONG>

This is the most important issue with my fort.

Puke's got it exactly right:  Before the Dwarven Economy, I planned to set up three economic zones:  1) A wood/silk/etc. region near the river.  2) A food/leather/animal region in the approximate center of the fort (with prepared food and drink distribution to outlining areas).  3) A metalworking/glassworking/jeweling area at the magma.  Each of these regions include individually assigned rooms for the craftsdwarves (the haulers live mostly near the fort center), a kitchen with its own stocks of food and drink, and sufficient space for goods stockpiles.  The craftsmen spent most of their time in a relatively small area, which meant more real work got done.

Now that the Dwarven Economy is active, this plan falls apart. I can't assign rooms to any non-legendary working dwarf. I don't have any Legendary craftsmen (except my mason, who operates workshop all over the place), and I also don't have very many legendary engravers/miners who can be made into craftsmen (I'm working on this problem hard, mind you).

My biggest critique of most designs (from an efficiency standpoint, which isn't relevant to a fortress designed as a work of beauty) is that people force their short-legged dwarves to run all over creation by building far, far bigger than needed.  Their stockpiles are gargantuan.  Their bedrooms, dining rooms, and statue gardens, all absurdly outsized, and mostly far away from the place of work.  But I DO now at least understand why people don't "regionalize" their fortresses:  The game doesn't cooperate once the Dwarven Economy begins.

quote:Originally posted by Shzar:
<STRONG>Have you considered moving your trade depot indoors? Even putting it on the outside of the cave river could shorten hauls during trade time. </STRONG>

Yeah, I keep meaning to do that, but I haven't gotten around to unmudding the corridor and finishing a legal path to a indoors depot.  I also haven't decided what I want the region between the front gate and the river to look like when it grows up.  Happily, my delays cost little; what I trade's in bins anyway.

quote:<STRONG>i like the giant single-section gold bridge.  very extravagant.  i bet it generates many happy thoughts.  i think single section bridges say "i have balls." in a very loud voice.  and with only two deaths on a fort that size, i'd say you're backing up the claim.  personally i build in redundancy, let dwarfs tantrum, and just replace what they break.  but preventing the deaths and tantrums in the first place shows some care and skill.  kudos to you.</STRONG>

I'd love to grin and accept your kind words, but I actually DO have a backup.  I'd be kind of forgetful not to, because I actually did get a bridge smashed by a dwarf once, and that bridge really was the only link.  Took me most of a season to rebuild...
That little gray bridge under the gold span is actually crossable by itself, in addition to being a safety net.  I've put a forbidden door just right of it to encourage my dwarves not to walk on the edge.  If the main bridge gets smashed, that door will be unlocked.

quote:Originally posted by Mlittle:
<STRONG>(snip, answered)  Also, you haven't left yourself any space to expand the food industry and the dinning room.</STRONG>

Very true, and I wish I had.  I'd like to get another still and kitchen in, but don't have space near the existing ones.  Well, I can always use floodgates to rewall the farming chamber at need and shift it north a tad.  There's already more than enough space to grow more Plump Helmets than my dwarves can eat.

quote:Originally posted by Dwarfu:
<STRONG>What is the benefit of using statues between two doors instead of just using three doors?</STRONG>

It's for pretty.  I'm not very good at beautiful design, but I do try.  Also, the statues occasionally give happy thoughts.

[Dwarfu]

Here's my defense of that mode of thought - the main entryway has to be at least 3 tiles wide to let the human wagons in (if you build your trade depot inside, which it should be for all intents and purposes), and I can't imagine living in a gaping hole in the mountain, so I assume the entry would need 3 doors.  A statue wouldn't let the wagons pass...

quote:Originally posted by Mzbundifund:
<STRONG>
None really, but some people feel building a door in an area you wouldn't be able to without (f)orbidding another door is kind of cheating.  I sure do it, though.</STRONG>

[Dryn]

Just curious, what is the name of the fortress and its founding civilisation?