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No
- 9 (37.5%)
Yes
- 15 (62.5%)

Total Members Voted: 23


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Author Topic: European Union thread  (Read 50498 times)

mainiac

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #30 on: October 04, 2015, 09:02:52 am »

SirQuiamus, actually its partly the case, when you look at sutff like state shelling hundreds of millions to try to bring spaceport within their border and so on.

I dont really play the "markets are efficient" card too much, but introducing market distortions so states can compete with each other like this is generally not ideal.  Subsidies can perhaps correct for problems with finance some of the times but competing to see who can mask market forces the most is not ideal.  In fact that's part of why the Joint Launch Alliance costs are so high compared to Russian or European (which is to say French) rockets.  They parcelled the work out to 45 different states for 45 different subsidies.
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« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
mainiac is always a little sarcastic, at least.

Sheb

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #31 on: October 04, 2015, 09:07:34 am »

SirQuiamus, actually its partly the case, when you look at sutff like state shelling hundreds of millions to try to bring spaceport within their border and so on.

Anyway, I was browsing the economist to avoid meaningful work, and I stumbled on this snippet about Sheffield signing some kind of deal with the Central government, agreeing to elect a mayor in exchange for some cash. It also mentioned that Manchester signed a deal giving the city control over health-care spending. What the hell is going on, is England turning into a confederation of city-state or what?

The bolded bit sounds rather corrupt to me. Unless theres something wierd about English politics that I'm missing.

Normally, English cities dont directly elect a mayor, but elect councilmen that then rule the city. There has been a push in recent years to directly elect mayors (Such a the B in London). In this case, I didnt mean "elect a specific guy", but "switch to direct elections of mayor".
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Europe consists only of small countries, some of which know it and some of which don’t yet.

Helgoland

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #32 on: October 04, 2015, 01:26:06 pm »

2) I'm pretty sure that USA still has more "social economical" innovation than most of the world's countries. Africa, South America, East Asia...
More than Europe, really. Most new trends regarding ideology, civil rights, economics, etc etc come to Europe from the US. All we have are intellectuals who don't really have an impact on society-wide dialogue. Hell, how many people here have even heard of Habermas?
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mainiac

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #33 on: October 04, 2015, 01:43:28 pm »

Habermas no but the German social welfare model is interesting and gets lots of discussion worldwide.  The German approach to immigration was setting an example even before the Syrian refugee crisis.  Serious philosophers just dont really get too much name recognition.  John Rawls is probably the most influential American philosopher of the 20th century and his name recognition would be nothing compared to Ayn Rand who barely qualifies as a philosopher.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #34 on: October 04, 2015, 01:51:52 pm »

The red haired ones strike again:
Quote
Flame-haired firebrand McKenzie, 47, also warned the museum that having a top and hat and cape hung on a peg in the room would "cause offence to every victim of sexual abuse".
"Not that they'd admit now, but all three were very generous about Jeremy Corbyn and were supporting him. Now he's come into the centre more, they are not so keen."
McKenzie and Nicholl are both members of Class War's Women's Death Brigade who will be leading today's protest.
Mr Walker added: "They wanted the Ripper's sitting room removed and replaced by an exhibition space promoting socialism, anti-capitalism and rallying against the banks.
"That was a daft idea frankly for a Jack the Ripper Museum and we said no."
You know at least when maoists destroyed their own culture they had the excuse of having nothing better to do. Plus, they looked much snazzier whilst doing so. I never did and never will understand why postmodernist cultural marxists are so fond of destroying any semblance of European heritage. I will defend London's kosher killer not in spite of his ugliness, but because of it. Also haha, east london again. From history till contemporary it's always been a bit dodgy. Alas, from my Jamaica roads to Olaf courts the marxists seem fond of making everything look the same. Then on the national level you have that thing where they teach nothing of their own nation's history if only to disparage it, and hilarious do stuff like rebuilding a Prussian palace as a postmodernist museum of African art. And the European Union spends billions of Euros bribing Yuros with their own money in their "regional development" funds to make millions of red haired architects, so many they blot out the sun and tear down all your historical buildings to make way for stone vaginas.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
RUN ORIENTAL MAN, IT HUNGERS FOR YOUR RICH HISTORY

Sergarr

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #35 on: October 04, 2015, 01:58:39 pm »

you know what's the most hilarious thing about this "cultural marxism" thingie

it's the fact that there's the mirror of this concept here in Russia, about some evil foreign invention designed to destroy the local culture through destruction of "family values" and shit

only it's supposed to be an invention of capitalists to bring down USSR

lel
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SirQuiamus

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #36 on: October 04, 2015, 02:07:08 pm »

*snip*
What's "European heritage" supposed to mean in this context? Jack the Ripper? Post citations to your assertions, m8.
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miljan

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #37 on: October 04, 2015, 02:45:37 pm »

Russia is bombing in syria on one side, on another they are opening one of Europe's largest mosques in moscow.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/one-of-europes-biggest-mosques-to-open-in-moscow/534609.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqQcZwf-i4A

I am actually surprised that there are that many muslim living in moscow (around 2 mil.).
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Loud Whispers

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #38 on: October 04, 2015, 03:33:15 pm »

Spoiler: spoilered for rant (click to show/hide)



Merkel: Iran’s stance on Israel ‘unacceptable’
In highly empathetic interview to Israeli paper to mark 50 years of ties, chancellor cites Germany’s ‘constant responsibility’ for Holocaust, ‘fundamental commitment’ to Israel’s well-being

David Cameron refuses to rule out Brexit, being forced by backbenchers to get an independence referendum by 2016

Euroskeptic propaganda from Deutschland, even more from Greece and more from Britain about Greece.

Iain Duncan Smith claims Germany is ‘petrified’ of a British exit from the EU. The crises of mass migration and Greek debt have hit the European Union like an “an out-of-control bulldozer”, forcing its leaders to rethink David Cameron’s call for fundamental reform, the cabinet’s leading Eurosceptic has said.
Tbh looks like to me the Germans don't really care either way, at least in regards to Britain and not say, France or Greece

In 2015, however, Angela Merkel has already imposed her will upon a continent twice: first by keeping Greece in the eurozone on punishing terms, and second by unilaterally suspending EU protocols to offer haven to hundreds of thousands of refugees. Berlin’s leadership is reluctant no more. The void into which it has stepped reflects many things, from France’s mismanagement of EU expansion to the turn of domestic politics in the UK, which has consigned Britain to the European fringes. As much as anything, though, German pre-eminence reflects the largely successful achievement of 25 years ago. The east remains poorer, and some talk of “the wall in the head”, but the real wall is gone. There is one Germany, and one pre-eminent state in Europe.
I think this article is actually pro-EU, though of a grim disposition

Half of Europe opts out of new GM crop scheme. Bid for exclusion by 14 countries and three regions would make two-thirds of Europe’s population and arable land GM-free. Half of the European Union’s 28 countries and three of its regions have opted out of a new GM crop scheme, in a blow to biotech industry hopes.
Under new EU rules agreed in March, 15 countries have now told Brussels they will send territorial exclusion requests to the big agricultural multinationals including Monsanto, Dow, Syngenta and Pioneer.

Where does everyone here stand on GM crops?

miauw62

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #39 on: October 04, 2015, 03:46:33 pm »

GM problems are mainly one of Monsanto being almost cartoon-evil, or so I've heard.
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they wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the raving confessions of a mass murdering cannibal from a recipe to bake a pie.
Knowing Belgium, everyone will vote for themselves out of mistrust for anyone else, and some kind of weird direct democracy coalition will need to be formed from 11 million or so individuals.

Loud Whispers

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #40 on: October 04, 2015, 03:54:04 pm »

I think that the distinction between GM and GM-free crops is completely frivolous, and that people will eventually get over it. They got over dehydrated food, after all. Preservatives are a bit more of a stickler (it is actual ingestion of questionable chemicals into the body which aren't 100% studied, but we've gotten really good at making sure that it's all safe at this point), but that one's dying down too.
Is it ironic that GM-free foods can frequently wind up being less safe than GM foods because of the pesticides used in GM-free foods versus foods that can be genetically modified to simply resist the pest? Not sure if any company has actually done that though; if not, they should.
GM crops are not genetically engineered to be resistant to pests, they are genetically engineered to be resistant to stronger pesticides that they shouldn't have to spray too much of since it's a strong one and the plants don't mind it

GM problems are mainly one of Monsanto being almost cartoon-evil, or so I've heard.
They're a bit Disney evil from time to time

Loud Whispers

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #41 on: October 04, 2015, 04:11:57 pm »

I think that the distinction between GM and GM-free crops is completely frivolous, and that people will eventually get over it. They got over dehydrated food, after all. Preservatives are a bit more of a stickler (it is actual ingestion of questionable chemicals into the body which aren't 100% studied, but we've gotten really good at making sure that it's all safe at this point), but that one's dying down too.
Is it ironic that GM-free foods can frequently wind up being less safe than GM foods because of the pesticides used in GM-free foods versus foods that can be genetically modified to simply resist the pest? Not sure if any company has actually done that though; if not, they should.
GM crops are not genetically engineered to be resistant to pests, they are genetically engineered to be resistant to stronger pesticides that they shouldn't have to spray too much of since it's a strong one and the plants don't mind it

Well, I know that generally that is the case. I'm saying that they could genetically engineer a resistance to pest. They just prefer to make money selling both the crop and the pesticide.
No I just don't think you can engineer a crop to be resistant to pests without rendering it inconsumable
If you create a crop that is resistant to pests and requires no pesticide it wipes the floor with its competitors

Also just looked it up, I forgot we live in the future
Pest resistant plants are a thing
Moreover, pest resistant crops are a thing
Moreover, pests resistant to pest resistant crops are also a thing
I'm in favour of bringing it into the European Union, slowly of course, just to make sure that something bad happens that we've missed. All in all things will probably go smoothly, but you don't want to end up with an irreversible effect like herbicide resistant vines.

Arx

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #42 on: October 04, 2015, 04:13:27 pm »

Pest-resistant GM crops definitely exist; I think they're usually Bt-(crop).

Have a hugely biased source: http://www.genewatch.org/sub-568238
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Arx

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #43 on: October 04, 2015, 04:13:53 pm »

Pest-resistant GM crops definitely exist; I think they're usually Bt-(crop).

Have a hugely biased source: http://www.genewatch.org/sub-568238
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SirQuiamus

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Re: European Union thread
« Reply #44 on: October 04, 2015, 04:38:33 pm »

Jack the Ripper is knife deep in East London history m8,
You mean he's some kind of folk hero around there? Gr8!

By the way, did you know that there's some evidence suggesting he might have been a Polish Jew? No wonder the readers of BBC History voted him the Worst Briton in History – he was one of the first Polish Plumbers and a prototypical Cultural Marxist!

*architecture rant* [LW confirmed Prince Charles.]
That's very enlightened of you, but how is that a Cultural Marxist thing if people of every possible political orientation have been eager to demolish old buildings at some point of time? The biggest architectural atrocities in Finland were committed during the 60s and 70s, and they absolutely, positively had nothing to do with culture, Marxism, or indeed any ideology besides cold, hard cash.
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