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[Neonivek]

Now THAT is a very good idea Nullbolt

[BlackFlyme]

Spellcasters get crazy. People who know nothing about how to use spellcasters, or are really good at them, are unpredictably crazy.

I think I mentioned this before, but there was a campaign I did not take part of where the party rarely got any loot because the sorcerer's response to everything was "blow it up".

Yes, even locked chests.

[Neonivek]

I also learned my lesson on why you sometimes fudge things so that one person doesn't mess things up for the party.

A character peed on an important tapestry and ruined the writing (because he was roleplaying drunk... Ok... so MAYBE I should have taken this as a warning sign...)

And then everyone got REALLY pissed at that player.

---

In all fairness sometimes a player does want to roleplay messing up...

Heck one of the most rewarding times as a player was when I was caught sneaking around and immediately surrendered.

[nullBolt]

Now THAT is a very good idea Nullbolt

Thank you. :p

Spellcasters get crazy. People who know nothing about how to use spellcasters, or are really good at them, are unpredictably crazy.

I think I mentioned this before, but there was a campaign I did not take part of where the party rarely got any loot because the sorcerer's response to everything was "blow it up".

Yes, even locked chests.

But why.

[BlackFlyme]

Because full spellcasters don't really need gear and destroying things was fun, I guess.

There's a guide to Pathfinder Wizards that have a recurring tongue-in-cheek theme of 'spellcasters are gods, and any non-spellcasting class is just there for your manipulation', but more than a few people actually take it seriously.

[nullBolt]

Because full spellcasters don't really need gear and destroying things was fun, I guess.

There's a guide to Pathfinder Wizards that have a recurring tongue-in-cheek theme of 'spellcasters are gods, and any non-spellcasting class is just there for your manipulation', but more than a few people actually take it seriously.

"Your explosion seems particular large, even larger than normal. As the bubble of destruction expands, you can see glittering shards of gold on it's very edges. Roll me a quick Spellcraft or Knowledge (Arcana) check, please. 26? Great. You think you might've destroyed one of the legendary Rods of Explosive Prowess, permanently rendering it's ability to improve destructive magical abilities null and void."

He'd stop immediately.

[BlackFlyme]

Again, I wasn't in that campaign, and it is long ended now.

It was Skulls and Shackles: a pirate campaign. He literally sunk every ship the party came across, loot and all.

Most of the wealth from that campaign comes from commandeering the ships you attack and selling them.

[nullBolt]

Does anyone know any systems (other than RuneQuest) which would support Elder Scrolls-style mixing and matching of classes? So having like a spellsword is actually viable and doesn't require you to pick that class from the start? Also, preferably everyone knows at least a little bit of magic along the way.

[Bohandas]

Either that or disappearing for six hours let's them organise in a way you just aren't expecting.

That's exactly what I'm talking about.

[Gentlefish]

Does anyone know any systems (other than RuneQuest) which would support Elder Scrolls-style mixing and matching of classes? So having like a spellsword is actually viable and doesn't require you to pick that class from the start? Also, preferably everyone knows at least a little bit of magic along the way.

If you use pathfinder, this site has classes-as-feats and a bunch of other really cool things.

Such as a simplified (and useful!) grapple flow, poison crafting, and optimised teamwork-and-pet shenanigans.

[nullBolt]

Does anyone know any systems (other than RuneQuest) which would support Elder Scrolls-style mixing and matching of classes? So having like a spellsword is actually viable and doesn't require you to pick that class from the start? Also, preferably everyone knows at least a little bit of magic along the way.

If you use pathfinder, this site has classes-as-feats and a bunch of other really cool things.

Such as a simplified (and useful!) grapple flow, poison crafting, and optimised teamwork-and-pet shenanigans.

That's actually almost a good way of playing Pathfinder, thanks.

[Gentlefish]

I just shared most of the goodies with my GM. It makes poison crafting and trap-making actually a valuable use of resources.

[Jimmy]

I think a lot of DMs fail to realize that the rules aren't just there to penalize the players. The DM has the most control out of the entire group, picking what challenges the PCs face, how NPCs respond to their actions, and setting the entire tone for the game world. By contrast, the players have only one thing they control: their character. Using the rules to give their character an advantage is pretty clearly a good thing in my books.

Plus, I'll take winning a difficult encounter through clever use of the rules over losing the encounter and causing the death of the entire party any day. I'd much rather preserve the story progress and interpersonal history between the characters than throw it away because some might call my strategy exploitive.

I think if you're looking to play a game where eldritch abominations beyond mortal comprehension are fearsome and awe inspiring, you're using the wrong system with D&D or Pathfinder. You'd be much better off with something like Call of Cthulhu, where you're expected to solve the encounters through strategy and stealth, and combat is typically fatal. In D&D, the typical character and the typical CR appropriate monster are built with the expectation that you're going to kill it and take its stuff. That's why there's a hundred different ways to deal damage but just a single Diplomacy skill.

Plus frankly, I can't see my character getting a reputation as a dragonslayer to be anything but good for business. Let word get around that our adventuring company can deal with the biggest baddest nasties on the block, and hopefully we'll start getting some good adventure hooks out of the deal. Not to mention, it'll likely do wonders for my Leadership score.

[Neonivek]

I think if you're looking to play a game where eldritch abominations beyond mortal comprehension are fearsome and awe inspiring, you're using the wrong system with D&D or Pathfinder.

That is kind of showing more of a limitation of the DM to demonstrate the power of a creature. There are plenty of ways to do it with just a dragon.

Especially when THREE of the 5th edition adventure paths are all about not fighting the big boss in a fair fight.

[Gentlefish]

That's why there's a hundred different ways to deal damage but just a single Diplomacy skill.

Sure there's a single diplomacy skill. There's also a single Acrobatics skill, should we not include chasms and tumbling because it's "just one skill"?

There's also Bluff, Intimidate, Linguistics(Forgery/Detect forgery all rolled up), Sense Motive, and plenty of non-lethal spells and many, many ways to convert someone to your side / convince them to let you by.

...Hell, in an AD&D adapted to PF, we let two bugbears go in exchange for information.

Then, just a little ways down the line, a couple of gnolls said in their shared language that we (they thought we were bugbears) shouldn't be there and to let them by.

I responded in a human accent, that we would absolutely let them by. And they walked right on by us.