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[Darkwind3]

I'll be gone from Thursday to Sunday, so I'll need an extended extension next turn in order to not chainstale. Sorry to interrupt the game just as it's getting interesting! For what it's worth I can't blame you, Karlito.

While we wait, why not play a fun game. I have 27 of an item in my magic item treasury! Anyone want to guess which item?
Bonus: I have 17 of Cheap Spammable #2. Which item could it be?

e: i am really bad at playing fake ea vanheim can you guys tell

[E. Albright]

Well, it probably isn't quills, because those would be in use. And it can't possibly be frostbrands or shrouds, since your forgers are working around the clock to just to replace the ones you're losing to Lissikos.

[e] Hosting pushed 72h - lemme know if you'd need another 12h beyond that.

[Darkwind3]

I'm back! Sorry for the delay, though I see that as always the time it takes to do the turn expands to fill the time available.

Well, it probably isn't quills, because those would be in use. And it can't possibly be frostbrands or shrouds, since your forgers are working around the clock to just to replace the ones you're losing to Lissikos.

[e] Hosting pushed 72h - lemme know if you'd need another 12h beyond that.

You're very right about Frost Brands and Shrouds (sadly). Well, I've got about half a dozen extra Frost Brands, since I'm stealing back most of the ones I lose to Lissikos. I'll note it could also be (and isn't) Lightless Lanterns or Imp Familiars for the same reasons as Owl Quills.

[E. Albright]

So um. We had a double stale, despite (or perhaps because of) the 72h weekend extension. On the one hand, it was both belligerents in the only interplayer war going at the moment. On the other, it was half the players in the game. I'm willing to roll back or drive on, but I'd lean strongly towards drive on given that this turn had an extra 72h already. I'll go with the consensus, and shan't touch my turn until we've decided, but my vote is for continuing.

[E. Albright]

Okay, so, no feedback from the staling parties? I'm going to close the window on a rollback, barring heavy objections. I'll push the host time 24h, but I'm going to go ahead with my turn and assume everyone else will do likewise.

[E. Albright]

So um. Half our players are AWOL at this point - it's been about a week since I've heard from either, and we've had two stales each. I know Karlito disappeared from the EFS game as well. Do we want to pause? Seek replacements? Call it a day? I've been turtling but am still invested in playing, so I'd prefer to look at productive means of going forward, but I'd like some feedback from the other half of the remaining players too...

[Darkwind3]

I'm a bit surprised Karlito and USEC_OFFICER both went missing, what, the turn after the war started? Though I imagine the extended delay had something to do with it. (Sorry about that; if it's any consolation, my vacation was very nice!) I haven't tried to contact either of them. If you have and haven't heard back, it might be best to try to seek replacements.

Worst case, I'm pretty sure the game was leading up to the two of us bashing each others' faces in eventually anyways, although neither of us apparently had the will to set it off. We could just fight it out until there's a clear winner. If you'd prefer to just let the game end, though, I would be alright with that.

[E. Albright]

Well, I was going to suggest finding replacements, but since you attacked one of the AWOL players that really isn't as viable as it had been. I'd lean towards calling it, because otherwise it's just going to be too weird with two passive nations (and both of us having little incentive to do anything but eat them and try to steal their thrones).

Kind of a pity since my turtling was all about making me even more noxious than I'd been at first blush...

[Darkwind3]

Fair enough. It was unfortunate timing that they both began staling the turn before I started to attack, and really I should have just called it off. But it is what it is.

For what it's worth, by the end I had 33 Lifelong Protections sitting in my treasury + the research to cast Fog Warriors (and Army of Gold in 6 turns). I would probably still have lost; I had no idea how to play this nation well and screwed it up basically every step of the way.

Honestly, I didn't devote the time I should have to this game, and as a result I wasn't remotely as aggressive as I should have been (though none of us were), because planning wars takes time.

[E. Albright]

I got completely paranoid about getting flanked if I attacked anyone - plus my research was something like half of everyone else's for quite a while (though I closed that gap rapidly once I got Cons-6 and blew ~150f on lanterns over the course of two turns).

I had a large stockpile of mandragoras to shred your glamours (12 magic attacks per square will do that pretty handily), and I'm pretty sure my sacreds would still be able to massacre anything they met at this point so long as they weren't grossly outnumbered. It would help, of course, that my top Hall of Fame prospect had been drilling them with an Ancient Master for the last who-knows-how-long so at least half of my 200-ish were level 3+ (some were close to level 5) and thus individually had high enough Attack to rip through thug Defense unboosted (and the Strength to pop Fog Warriors right out of the gate) - and once they berserked they'd have high enough Attack to take on a fair range of moderately Defense/avoidance-oriented SCs even though they were only one attack per square. And that would be with nothing more than a bless for boosting. I will admit the massed Lifelong Protections could have been a PITA for them, though. Not insurmountable, but definitely something requiring support to overcome. My demon knights were piling up, but for the moment only 10 of them were training, though I was seriously considering shuffling around the site users so I could instruct more Demon Knights.

All in all, it would have been messy, but likely interesting. I really didn't have a grasp of just how evil my sacreds were for the first year or two - I knew they were monsters against indies, but when I had 5 plus an H2 kill 20-ish of Karlito's giants (with a prophet leading them) with 0 casualties, I probably should have taken that as a sign to go on a rampage even if it meant I might get swarmed. I'm so not used to playing strong sacred nations...

[Il Palazzo]

I'm so not used to playing strong sacred nations...

You should've played Qurghannia!

[Darkwind3]

I had a large stockpile of mandragoras to shred your glamours (12 magic attacks per square will do that pretty handily), and I'm pretty sure my sacreds would still be able to massacre anything they met at this point so long as they weren't grossly outnumbered. It would help, of course, that my top Hall of Fame prospect had been drilling them with an Ancient Master for the last who-knows-how-long so at least half of my 200-ish were level 3+ (some were close to level 5) and thus individually had high enough Attack to rip through thug Defense unboosted (and the Strength to pop Fog Warriors right out of the gate) - and once they berserked they'd have high enough Attack to take on a fair range of moderately Defense/avoidance-oriented SCs even though they were only one attack per square. And that would be with nothing more than a bless for boosting. I will admit the massed Lifelong Protections could have been a PITA for them, though. Not insurmountable, but definitely something requiring support to overcome. My demon knights were piling up, but for the moment only 10 of them were training, though I was seriously considering shuffling around the site users so I could instruct more Demon Knights.

All in all, it would have been messy, but likely interesting. I really didn't have a grasp of just how evil my sacreds were for the first year or two - I knew they were monsters against indies, but when I had 5 plus an H2 kill 20-ish of Karlito's giants (with a prophet leading them) with 0 casualties, I probably should have taken that as a sign to go on a rampage even if it meant I might get swarmed. I'm so not used to playing strong sacred nations...

What glamour troops? All I had was Corpse Constructs and Bone Fiends. I don't think I had more than a dozen recruitable troops by the end of the game, I blew all my gold on mages. The entirety of my tactical plan was to use demon + undead spam to serve as chaff for A1s with Bows of War + Flaming Arrows, with Destruction spam to help deal with your sacreds' ridiculous armor. If the bows of war with flaming arrows didn't kill your giants, Fog Warriors and Army of Gold would have done little more than slow your victory. I wasn't planning on using thugs for anything more than raiding or army support (and certainly not a core role in the fight) because in my early tests I realized that your giants required ridiculous stacks of half a dozen thugs to defeat even small raiding parties. They're nasty.

I was desperately hoping you would run around with a single giant deathstack when we eventually fought, because that's the only way I could deal with your sacreds. I couldn't figure out a ay to deal with a raiding force of less than half a dozen of your giants efficiently (and honestly I never tested my battleplan so I'm not sure I could have defeated a huge stack of those berserkers even unsupported). My only hope was Mind Hunt, assassination spells, and teleporting Rain of Stones casters to try to kill your priests, all of which can be countered fairly simply (though they can certainly be frustrating).

On my part, I should have been 1) recruiting the S2W1s from my capital constantly, rather than the E2A1s, and 2) using my thugs to raid immediately once I was able to gear, teleport, and self-buff. Raiding nations like this tend to rapidly lose steam once they leave the midgame, but I was so terrified of your giants I didn't want to attack you and didn't want to attack someone else and leave myself open to you, so I just turtled.

[Karlito]

Damn guys, sorry about ruining the game there. I got caught up with some commitments and had some internet access problems.

[E. Albright]

Well, on a positive note, this way we all avoided the embarrassment of Lissikos's immanent re-emergance to crush us underheel - much as they had been abusing the poor elves - prior to inevitably marching to an ignominious victory.

[AlStar]

We're not talking about my old nation Lissikos, are we? The one that managed to lose all of its armies, wizards, and land?

I'd rather assumed it fell about 2 turns after I went AI. If not, there must be a story there, because I just could not make the nation work.