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What's your opinion on free will?

I am religious and believe in free will
- 71 (27.7%)
I am religious and do not believe in free will
- 10 (3.9%)
I am not religious and believe in free will
- 114 (44.5%)
I am not religious and do not believe in free will
- 61 (23.8%)

Total Members Voted: 251


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Author Topic: Railgun and Spirituality Discussion  (Read 681518 times)

wierd

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4545 on: January 12, 2016, 08:09:38 am »

There IS, however, a growing body to evidence to suggest that our universe is artificial. ;)
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Grimlocke

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4546 on: January 12, 2016, 08:37:22 am »

Atheism = Not believing there is a god.
Which is not the same as 'Believing there is no god'.

That last one is semantic bunk made up by religious fundamentalist crackpots to try and put atheism on their own level.
On this I'm going to have to disagree. Trouble is I meet a lot of atheists who claim to be the 1st sentence, yet have an attitude to the topic of religion that is a closer match to the 2nd sentence. Once you start mocking the religious as stupid, gullible or ignorant you're more in line with the second (in my own opinion) & a lot of atheists do behave that way.

Sooo, some atheist people did a thing you don't like, and so you want 'atheist' to mean that thing?

Applying the same logic to 'Catholic', 'Right-wing voter' or 'BMW driver' could lead to some undesirable generalization too. Except for BMW drivers, there its entirely valid.
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wierd

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4547 on: January 12, 2016, 08:43:56 am »

There is the dictionary definition of what an atheist is, and there is the statistically likely behavioral stereotype of how people who self-identify with that appellation have.

The two do not appear to converge.

Pointing out the lack of convergence is not making a strawman. Extrapolating from the lack of convergence to arrive at a conclusion, however, does.
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Rolepgeek

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4548 on: January 12, 2016, 09:21:23 am »

I find the logic used in the simulation universe probability argument to be bunk.

Partially because it's all done from arbitrary priori, and partially because it's a convoluted bit of logic that honestly feels like cheating. Probabilities can't be calculated from single events.

Also, I think the difference wobbly, is that atheists often have strong objections to particular ideas of a god. That doesn't mean they necessarily believe against any and all ideas of a god.
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wobbly

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4549 on: January 12, 2016, 11:19:28 am »

@Th4DwArfY1 - I was talking about stronger opinions then just a little silly. Find plenty of things religious people believe or say silly myself.

Atheism = Not believing there is a god.
Which is not the same as 'Believing there is no god'.

That last one is semantic bunk made up by religious fundamentalist crackpots to try and put atheism on their own level.
On this I'm going to have to disagree. Trouble is I meet a lot of atheists who claim to be the 1st sentence, yet have an attitude to the topic of religion that is a closer match to the 2nd sentence. Once you start mocking the religious as stupid, gullible or ignorant you're more in line with the second (in my own opinion) & a lot of atheists do behave that way.

Sooo, some atheist people did a thing you don't like, and so you want 'atheist' to mean that thing?

Applying the same logic to 'Catholic', 'Right-wing voter' or 'BMW driver' could lead to some undesirable generalization too. Except for BMW drivers, there its entirely valid.

Why would I care whether atheism is a thing or not? Just saying there are atheists & there are atheists. Some fit the 1st sentence you gave, some fit the 2nd. It's not just a thing made up by "fundamentalist crackpots".
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Rolan7

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4550 on: January 12, 2016, 11:39:25 am »

Huh, looks like I was mistaken about "antitheist".  It's someone who *opposes* religion, not someone who positively claims there are no gods.

Well shoot, guess I'm an antitheist after all.  And an atheist, of course.

Though you could have a theist antitheist - Kratos comes to mind  ;)  Or Satanists who actually believe in Satan (most "Satanists" just worship an ideal of opposition, which always struck me as misleading).
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Grimlocke

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4551 on: January 12, 2016, 01:48:02 pm »

@Th4DwArfY1 - I was talking about stronger opinions then just a little silly. Find plenty of things religious people believe or say silly myself.

Atheism = Not believing there is a god.
Which is not the same as 'Believing there is no god'.

That last one is semantic bunk made up by religious fundamentalist crackpots to try and put atheism on their own level.
On this I'm going to have to disagree. Trouble is I meet a lot of atheists who claim to be the 1st sentence, yet have an attitude to the topic of religion that is a closer match to the 2nd sentence. Once you start mocking the religious as stupid, gullible or ignorant you're more in line with the second (in my own opinion) & a lot of atheists do behave that way.

Sooo, some atheist people did a thing you don't like, and so you want 'atheist' to mean that thing?

Applying the same logic to 'Catholic', 'Right-wing voter' or 'BMW driver' could lead to some undesirable generalization too. Except for BMW drivers, there its entirely valid.

Why would I care whether atheism is a thing or not? Just saying there are atheists & there are atheists. Some fit the 1st sentence you gave, some fit the 2nd. It's not just a thing made up by "fundamentalist crackpots".

I will just point that back to this.

There is the dictionary definition of what an atheist is, and there is the statistically likely behavioral stereotype of how people who self-identify with that appellation have.

The two do not appear to converge.

Pointing out the lack of convergence is not making a strawman. Extrapolating from the lack of convergence to arrive at a conclusion, however, does.

Just that you have come to associate two things, doesn't change the definition of a word.

A lot of people behave badly, both religious and atheist, but making widespread generalisations to the point that you change the meaning of a word to something bad for yourself will only needlessly antagonise people you might have otherwise gotten along with fine.

That does not only go for atheists, but also for Muslims, right wing voters and maybe even BMW drivers.
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wierd

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4552 on: January 12, 2016, 03:56:35 pm »

Protip: The definitions of words change with time and popular use.

See for example: "Gay", and or, "Patriarchy". "Lesbian" as well. (Originally used to describe somebody from, and or a relation to, the Aegean island of Lesbos.)
« Last Edit: January 12, 2016, 04:03:01 pm by wierd »
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TD1

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4553 on: January 12, 2016, 04:10:15 pm »

Sodomite.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4554 on: January 12, 2016, 04:13:15 pm »

The patriarchy of Constantinople is oppressing me

MonkeyHead

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4555 on: January 12, 2016, 05:26:59 pm »

The patriarchy of Constantinople is oppressing me

Better than him sodomizing you, frankly.

Unless you are into that sort of thing.... YMMV, and all that.

Orange Wizard

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4556 on: January 12, 2016, 06:28:07 pm »

The patriarchy of Constantinople is oppressing me
Don't worry, the Muslims are here to help

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origamiscienceguy

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4557 on: January 12, 2016, 07:08:30 pm »

Imagine if we tried to have this thread on a Youtube comment section.
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4558 on: January 12, 2016, 07:10:26 pm »

Imagine if we tried to have this thread on a Youtube comment section.
The Internet would explode.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Religion and Spirituality Discussion: I am Enlightened by my Euphoria
« Reply #4559 on: January 12, 2016, 07:16:45 pm »

Abyssinian Empire master creed
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