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[mainiac]

Also, the posts here prove my point for me. I say that the condescension and elitist attitudes shown by Trump's detractors are just driving more people to support him, and within a dozen posts somebody says something about 'I don't understand why people are supporting Trump' and the response is 'The average human is very dim'.

Well of course the bay12 forums are an excellent place to assess how American elites think.  All the kingmakers in American politics hang out in this thread and shitpost.

[penguinofhonor]

Fuck, my cover is blown.

[SirQuiamus]

Also, the posts here prove my point for me. I say that the condescension and elitist attitudes shown by Trump's detractors are just driving more people to support him, and within a dozen posts somebody says something about 'I don't understand why people are supporting Trump' and the response is 'The average human is very dim'.

So you'd vote for an objectively terrible candidate because someone you don't like told you not to vote for him? Yeah, that's perfectly valid political reasoning – for a four-year-old.

For the record, I don't think the main problem is simply that "the average human is very dim" – it's rather that the average human is way too eager to get in bed with a blatant fraud like Trump just to take a futile, symbolic jab at a social out-group. Which is exactly what you're doing when you complain about the "condescending anti-Trump liberal elites," or whatever.

[RedKing]

@Covenant: You're more than welcome to take him back with you to the UK. He can replace Farage and lead UKIP to glorious Fortress Britannia.

"I'm going to build a wall through the English Channel and make the French pay for it."

[SirQuiamus]

I may have already spent most of this month's welfare money on booze, but hey, I'm anti-Trump so I must be part of the global liberal elite! Feels good to be on top!

*SirQuiamus condescends haughtily*

[Sheb]

Aren't you Finnish? I mean, just buying any booze probably cost you most of your welfare money. :p

[mainiac]

Finns, the worst kind of Washington insiders.

[SirQuiamus]

our booze is elite booze and our welfare is elitefare

[Frumple]

Friends, no, but lying to the coworkers and claiming to be intent to may be a survival tactic in places like the one I live in.

To be fair, I wouldn't feel comfortable talking politics with just about anyone in the general area on basically any subject. Too much of a chance of getting attacked, and almost a certainty of it damaging future job prospects et al. Lot less live and let live on the conservative side of the political spectrum

[mainiac]

The condescension and elitism I mentioned is clear to see on televisions, newspapers, the internet and similar.

So, other people make generalities = elitist condescension.
You make generalities = PROUD HUMBLE EVERYONE

Hey coveant, stop being an elitist looking down on good old fashioned Americans like myself.  I'm sick of people like you in your ivory tower acting like you are better then me.  Get over yourself.

I wouldn't describe anyone in this thread as part of the elite, liberal or otherwise. No offence.

And yet you used a post in this thread as evidence of elitist bias...

I do take offense actually.  I take offense at you insulting our intelligence by offering an argument and then saying it doesn't count.  Just because we aren't ivory tower elites like yourself doesn't mean we deserve to have our time wasted that way by big shots like yourself.

[sluissa]

Friends, no, but lying to the coworkers and claiming to be intent to may be a survival tactic in places like the one I live in.

To be fair, I wouldn't feel comfortable talking politics with just about anyone in the general area on basically any subject. Too much of a chance of getting attacked, and almost a certainty of it damaging future job prospects et al. Lot less live and let live on the conservative side of the political spectrum

This is true on both sides but also massively overblown as well. I am a fairly liberal person living in conservativeland. And while i do tend to avoid talking politics, ive never had hate for it or repercussions attached to expressing a view. On the otherhand. Plenty of liberals do write off this entire area as uneducated backwater simply because of local politics. I disagree politically with a lot of people but i also love a lot of those same people. And politics aside any of us would give the shirt off our backs to help any of the others.

[Frumple]

I am a fairly liberal person living in conservativeland. And while i do tend to avoid talking politics, ive never had hate for it or repercussions attached to expressing a view.

Hey, I'm a fairly liberal person living in conservativeland, too. I've seen limbs broken over not toeing the conservative line. I've specifically had people tell me they would think I'd be incapable of understanding morality if I admitted to being anything but christian. The list kinda' rolls on. If it's overblown for your area, all I can do is express the most genuine of congratulations it is, because no one should have to live through this shit.

[mainiac]

Problem is, no one's listening to them.

People have been talking about these issues for decades.  There are Pop Songs, movies of all kinds, decades of research across the political spectrum, political speeches talk about these constantly.

People like to blame distant forces of government.  They'll do that without evidence.

Interestingly enough if you want to enter into the realm of evidence, 538 has discussed how there is a statistically significant correlation between google searches for racialist crap and support for Donald Trump.

[SirQuiamus]

When it's a constant wall of noise rather than a rare occurrence (because let's be honest, how many conversations have you been part of that assume everyone involved thinks/knows Trump is a joke? How many comedians, articles, TV shows, monologues, etc?), the effect on people can add up.

At this point I'm 100% sure that everyone with a mental age of 12+ years knows that Trump is a joke, but alarmingly many of them still think that he's a funny one. "Never mind that he's a liar and a scoundrel – he's still 'one of us,' right? He'll show those damn liberals what's for, and that's more important than actual political outcomes, no doubt about that."

They feel that they are the 'social out-group' you talked about. And perhaps they have a point - would you feel comfortable telling your friends and co-workers you were going to vote for Trump?

If I were a member of the Trump-loving Red Tribe, I would feel 100% comfortable informing my Red-Tribe friends and co-workers about my choice of candidate – after all, they'd be voting for him as well. As for my Trump-hating Blue-Tribe "friends" and co-workers... well, I'd probably tell them who I'm voting for without telling them why, and I'd do it as confrontationally as possible, with accusations of "elitism" thrown in. My Blue-Tribe "friends" and co-workers would undoubtedly respond with accusations of sexism and racism, in a tone that clearly confirms my expectations of Blue-Tribe condescension towards my tribe: "Those out-group bastards refuse to tolerate my in-group – I'll fucking show them! Even if Trump turns out to be a gay Muslim pedo-rapist-murderer, I'm still voting for him just to spite those condescending out-group assholes!"

None of this would mean that the out-group is necessarily wrong about Trump being a terrible candidate, but who cares? Politics is no more about politics, just entertainment and social signalling.

EDIT:

Spoiler: Dear God... TRUMP WILL MAKE GRANT WRITING GREAT AGAIN (click to show/hide)

Why the fuck am I sitting here on the dole when I could be making megabucks in research grants WITH REAL STRONK FAST GRANT TRUMP MAGIC?

[mainiac]

None of this would mean that the out-group is necessarily wrong about Trump being a terrible candidate, but who cares? Politics is no more about politics, just entertainment and social signalling.

But at the end of the day there's actual policy and governing.