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[pisskop]

Dating is about having fun.  I look at it like sex.  You make sure the other is satisfied and/or wants more, and back they come.

  Specific advice is hard to give because every person is different.  You have a different temperment than I, and every girl is different.  In addition to the cultural difference, theres typal differences and what your endgame is matters too.

  Whatever you decide, enjoy it!  Your partner will pick up on genuine enthusiasm.  When you meet somebody you would like to honestly get to know better it will be a natural progression.

[Taffer]

...

[~Neri]

I mean you should get to know the person before you even start considering them as a possible relationship.

Don't go into a friendship with the intent of romancing them.

You should just know the people before considering.

Don't want to end up with an abusive asshole or an absolute arsehat do you?

[Bauglir]

Don't want to end up with an abusive asshole or an absolute arsehat do you?

Well, yeah, that's what the initial stages of dating are for. Getting to know somebody as you gradually escalate things so that you have an opportunity to nope out if necessary.

[Phmcw]

Well first lesson right here : there are different dating culture and taboo.

Friend first is a good idea in Belgium and France, though not the only way. No idea about the USA but some here seems to think it's "creepy" (which seems backward to me but whatever) and my impression is that it will seems unmanly. In any case don't be a wet towel.

Generally speaking, check if you like the person you love, and force your heart to let go if you don't. Sentiments aren't known to give one's insight, and can make you dumb and blind.
Love is something you build together, attraction only last so long.

[Taffer]

...

[smeeprocket]

wow, that was friend-zoning described clearly and succinctly. Well done.

[Phmcw]

As usual there is two tales in this : assholes pretend to be nice and expect girls to swoon to their feets but there is also the fact that becoming friend with someone and seducing them are two diffrent things.

Some guy don't "try to be friends first", they try to be friend, then "friender" and expect that to lead to dating. You need to take a risk and seduce at some point, and that lead shy and genuinely nice guys to lonelyness.

[smeeprocket]

As usual there is two tales in this : assholes pretend to be nice and expect girls to swoon to their feets but there is also the fact that becoming friend with someone and seducing them are two diffrent things.

Some guy don't "try to be friends first", they try to be friend, then "friender" and expect that to lead to dating. You need to take a risk and seduce at some point, and that lead shy and genuinely nice guys to lonelyness.

there's definitely not two sides to this. The "nice guy" side makes it clear in their own words that the women they are nice to owe them sex. That is the entire definition. You treat girls well, and they better pay up. They get bitter and enraged when the women, who have either said no at this point and assume things have been understood, or don't know about it, continue to date "Assholes." Inexplicably these guys do not understand that they are the assholes.

It's not even about seduction, because if they are rebuked, it releases this self-entitled bitter rage. How DARE she say she just wants to be friends after I did all that (insert stuff that good friends do without expecting sex in trade) for her.

http://imgur.com/gallery/RmAjE

[sjm9876]

-snip-

As summary, cause slight text wall, parsed through my own experience of the world.

Don't see a girl you like, and befriend her before trying to 'seduce' (or whatever word we're using) her. It's misleading and somewhat demeaning to befriend someone purely because you want a relationship.

Do make friends with girls. It is entirely possible for that to develop into something more. Go to clubs and interest groups, increase your chances, but try not to break the previous point.

Of course, feel free to replace girl with guy or whatever. I'm a guy, and I wouldn't be too happy if a close friend suddenly revealed they'd just wanted to hook up all along (not that that would likely happen with me being me).

Of course, I won't deny it is possible for the negative course to work out, and I'm not prepared to argue the morals of it.

-snip-

Smee, whilst I may be misinterpreting you, you appear to be making rather sweeping generalisations. As someone who could be considered a 'nice guy' without ulterior motives, it somewhat frustrates me to have people I like as friends spontaneously erupt at me because apparently men can't be nice to women without wanting sex. Course, I may well be misreading, and if so, feel free to ignore this - it isn't contributing to the topic.

[smeeprocket]

-snip-

As summary, cause slight text wall, parsed through my own experience of the world.

Don't see a girl you like, and befriend her before trying to 'seduce' (or whatever word we're using) her. It's misleading and somewhat demeaning to befriend someone purely because you want a relationship.

Do make friends with girls. It is entirely possible for that to develop into something more. Go to clubs and interest groups, increase your chances, but try not to break the previous point.

Of course, feel free to replace girl with guy or whatever. I'm a guy, and I wouldn't be too happy if a close friend suddenly revealed they'd just wanted to hook up all along (not that that would likely happen with me being me).

Of course, I won't deny it is possible for the negative course to work out, and I'm not prepared to argue the morals of it.

-snip-

Smee, whilst I may be misinterpreting you, you appear to be making rather sweeping generalisations. As someone who could be considered a 'nice guy' without ulterior motives, it somewhat frustrates me to have people I like as friends spontaneously erupt at me because apparently men can't be nice to women without wanting sex. Course, I may well be misreading, and if so, feel free to ignore this - it isn't contributing to the topic.

Nice guy generally refers to those insipid filth I mentioned. Don't call yourself a nice guy if you don't identify as that because that is a big red flag for most women.

Whatever meaning the word had before MRAs and whiny 4channers got a hold of it is dead and gone.

Also, I don't remember mentioning "spontaneous eruption" (is that a euphemism?)

edit: an honestly, it puts me on edge when guys I don't know well, maybe are just new friends with, do nice things for me. I have had it thrown back in my face a number of times, the least of which involved a guy in a game saying out of the blue that he wanted to mount me. (I was playing a fucking troll, I had warts and was green and had a protruding belly. I couldn't have tried to desexualize myself more without being an ogre, but trolls were why I starte dplaying to begin with.)

[Phmcw]

It have two meaning because it's liked to two phenomenon : one is "I've been less awfull than usual, now you must have sex with me" types of guys,  the second is that being super nice and friendly doesn't peak sexual interest.

(very dumbed down but to the point explaination) I mean a girl can bake me cookies all day, I won't feel a suddent urge to fuck her, and inducing sudden urge to fuck you is kind of the point of seduction.

You'll often see girls and guy going for less than nice peoples and some believe that it mean that peoples don't want nice peoples or don't want peoples to be nice with them.
In fact they often do, but they want to go with peoples they admire and desire first.

[Sheb]

Well, my advice would be: don't try it. Just go out, meet people, and it'll kind of happen. Seriously. If it doesn't happen, go out, do more stuff and meet more people.

But then, I'm European, and we don't have that culture of going on date as much as Americans do I guess.

[ICBM pilot]

Well, my advice would be: don't try it. Just go out, meet people, and it'll kind of happen. Seriously. If it doesn't happen, go out, do more stuff and meet more people.

But then, I'm European, and we don't have that culture of going on date as much as Americans do I guess.

I don't even know what people do these days.

[Sheb]

Well, go and do some volunteering, some woofing, join a SCA group...  Pretty much whatever you want.