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Only Judeism

Only Islam

Yes to both Judeism and Islam

[scrdest]

the Baptist ianterpretation insists on translating alll poistiver references to "wine" as "unfermented grape juice". Which in Bibical times was essentially POISON due to the ease in whcih grape juse breeds bacteria.

I've heard that it meant 'water slightly fermented to kill bacteria'.

You cannot ferment water. Or, for that matter, ferment something 'slightly' without a degree of understanding of microbiology unlikely in ancient times.

The ancient wine, however, was different from the modern wine due to the simplicity of the fermentation process (pre-modern red wine, for example, is what we would call rose nowadays), and for once, it wasn't (usually) being drunk straight, but diluted with water.

[Zanzetkuken The Great]

the Baptist ianterpretation insists on translating alll poistiver references to "wine" as "unfermented grape juice". Which in Bibical times was essentially POISON due to the ease in whcih grape juse breeds bacteria.

I've heard that it meant 'water slightly fermented to kill bacteria'.

You cannot ferment water. Or, for that matter, ferment something 'slightly' without a degree of understanding of microbiology unlikely in ancient times.

I can't recall what the exact words used were right now.  What I said was the best I could recall.  It was probably what you mentioned in your second, 'Wine moderately to highly diluted with water."

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Posting my not so baptist beleif on alchoholic beverages: I think it's ok to drink them just not to the point of intoxication

Why would you drink alcoholic beverages if not to intoxicate yourself? Let's get real, most alcoholic drinks are nasty. Even good wine takes a "refined palate."

The Russians drink a slightly fermented beer just as a 'keep you full between meals' drink
It's literally slightly fermented beer, I think it's around 1~2 proof

[Orange Wizard]

I'm half tempted to start my own religion worshipping the Leviathan of Job.

[Phmcw]

Posting my not so baptist beleif on alchoholic beverages: I think it's ok to drink them just not to the point of intoxication

Why would you drink alcoholic beverages if not to intoxicate yourself? Let's get real, most alcoholic drinks are nasty. Even good wine takes a "refined palate."

The Russians drink a slightly fermented beer just as a 'keep you full between meals' drink
It's literally slightly fermented beer, I think it's around 1~2 proof

Re read the palabre mate. First everyone boozed itself up with wine at the time. It was "the" party drink (and expensive, too). Gauls bought a ton from the Romans because it was stronger than anything they had.  And second he made between 75 and 115 litters (20 to 30 gallons) of the stuff after they drank all the wine there was.

[scrdest]

Posting my not so baptist beleif on alchoholic beverages: I think it's ok to drink them just not to the point of intoxication

Why would you drink alcoholic beverages if not to intoxicate yourself? Let's get real, most alcoholic drinks are nasty. Even good wine takes a "refined palate."

The Russians drink a slightly fermented beer just as a 'keep you full between meals' drink
It's literally slightly fermented beer, I think it's around 1~2 proof

Re read the palabre mate. First everyone boozed itself up with wine at the time. It was "the" party drink (and expensive, too). Gauls bought a ton from the Romans because it was stronger than anything they had.  And second he made between 75 and 115 litters (20 to 30 gallons) of the stuff after they drank all the wine there was.

True, but that was sorta the point - Roman wine was stronger because it was usually drunk diluted, and not doing so had been seen as uncouth.

[Phmcw]

. Then he called the bridegroom aside 10 and said, “Everyone brings out the choice wine first and then the cheaper wine after the guests have had too much to drink; but you have saved the best till now.”

Serioulsy. Not only diluted wine was stronger than cheap beer, he mention that usually you bring cheap wine when the guest are wasted and that here he did the opposite. Which suppose that the guest were wasted.

[Orange Wizard]

This argument seems very silly from my point of view.

[smjjames]

That is actually one of the teachings in Islam. That lying is one of the tools that should be used to spread the faith. [/slight derail]

As for the leviathan, it sounds so ridiculous it can't be true. Therefore, it must be a misinterpretation of a crocodile.

I think there were some interpretations of the leviathan being a whale. Then again, Jonah was swallowed by a whale.

[Graknorke]

This argument seems very silly from my point of view.

What exactly is the argument? I'm not seeing the point of contention.
Guests at a party got drunk and Jesus made them some fancy wine because they ran out.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

I don't think they got drunk at the party

If there's a bunch of people and choice wine is expensive
I could see everbody downing a glass of the good stuff, not getting wasted, and still tuning out and having to drink diluted weaker wine

[TD1]

He made  an awful lot of wine just for an after dinner sip. In fact, if he didn't want them drunk, why make so much? Any individual could Choose to get drunk with the amount he gave them, and even then, the fact he had to make a new batch of wine to replace the old is highly suggestive that the party-goers had had an awful lot to drink before hand.

[Frumple]

This argument seems very silly from my point of view.

What exactly is the argument? I'm not seeing the point of contention.

Pretty sure the argument is that the history of christian advocacy against alcohol and/or drunkenness is inconsistent with biblical depictions of alcohol use. The point of contention seems to be as to the extent the biblical drunks got, well, drunk. I'm seeing a lot of wishful thinking involve dilution and the far more likely alternative of them being stone blind drunk and then having divine fiat bring in more booze anyway.

Streaker J was a boozer that told his followers to flash people. Also had a hate-on for fig trees, and a bunch of other gorram weird stuff.

Honestly, the whole "Blatant Dionysus Ripoff" thing makes more and more sense as you think about it. SJ was depicted as acting a lot like a god of booze would.

[Helgoland]

If there's a bunch of people and choice wine is expensive
I could see everbody downing a glass of the good stuff, not getting wasted, and still tuning out and having to drink diluted weaker wine

Good =/= contains a lot of alcohol
Cheap and expensive wine have about the same amount of alcohol. It's the flavor that makes one more expensive than the other.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

He made  an awful lot of wine just for an after dinner sip. In fact, if he didn't want them drunk, why make so much? Any individual could Choose to get drunk with the amount he gave them, and even then, the fact he had to make a new batch of wine to replace the old is highly suggestive that the party-goers had had an awful lot to drink before hand.

Or they didn't have enough

Here
A guy can afford to buy about 8 bottles of wine
He invites the whole town to his wedding
There is enough wine for most people to have a half a glass of it, others get non at all
Guy asks Jesus to make some more so sverbody can have enough