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Author Topic: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.  (Read 207641 times)

SaberToothTiger

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1515 on: December 11, 2016, 03:57:08 pm »
ptw
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1516 on: December 11, 2016, 04:47:40 pm »
Quote from: Sergarr on December 11, 2016, 08:36:28 am
I guess I should point it out again that Russia has killed, as of September this year, almost as many ISIS members than it did rebel fighters, according to an absolutely not pro-Russian source, Syrian Observatory of Human Rights.

Such ally, much helping. Wow.
This kind of allies can very well have clashes and conflicting interests leading to fighting.

In Syria Russia and ISIS want different things but global goal (weakening the West) is identical.
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Vilanat

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1517 on: December 11, 2016, 04:50:39 pm »
According to ISIS, they have captured in Palmyra:
- 30 tanks
- 6 BMPs
- 6 122mm guns
- 7 23mm mounted technicals
- ATGMs
- countless light weapons and ammo

https://twitter.com/worldonalert/status/808028848205991936

This now give ISIS an entire Tank battalion, completely intact and armed, along with supply trucks and enough equipment for an infantry support platoon.

The remarkable Syrian army just left these lying around fully loaded as they fled. the Russians at least had the sense to demolish their own equipment.
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Sheb

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1518 on: December 11, 2016, 04:55:48 pm »
Hopefully this will at least stop Russians from mocking the USA for the Iraqi leaving stuff behing.
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smjjames

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1519 on: December 11, 2016, 05:04:07 pm »
Quote from: Sergarr on December 11, 2016, 08:36:28 am
Quote from: DJ on December 11, 2016, 06:24:26 am
Honestly I'm surprised Russia hasn't decided to turn Mosul into Dresden 2.0 yet.
Mosul is under Coalition's air umbrella. I think there's a certain unspoken agreement about division of responsibilities.

There's probably also an agreement on who can participate. Like for example, Turkey wanted to be in on the ground fight, but got told off. They did supply some artillery cover though I think.

Besides, the Iraqi government actually wants to keep civillian casualities to a minimum and not alienate thm.

Quote from: Ukrainian Ranger on December 11, 2016, 04:47:40 pm
Quote from: Sergarr on December 11, 2016, 08:36:28 am
I guess I should point it out again that Russia has killed, as of September this year, almost as many ISIS members than it did rebel fighters, according to an absolutely not pro-Russian source, Syrian Observatory of Human Rights.

Such ally, much helping. Wow.
This kind of allies can very well have clashes and conflicting interests leading to fighting.

In Syria Russia and ISIS want different things but global goal (weakening the West) is identical.

Their global goal is only superficially similar, ISIS can and will (and has) turn(ed) on the Russians.

Quote from: Vilanat on December 11, 2016, 04:50:39 pm
According to ISIS, they have captured in Palmyra:
- 30 tanks
- 6 BMPs
- 6 122mm guns
- 7 23mm mounted technicals
- ATGMs
- countless light weapons and ammo

https://twitter.com/worldonalert/status/808028848205991936

This now give ISIS an entire Tank battalion, completely intact and armed, along with supply trucks and enough equipment for an infantry support platoon.

The remarkable Syrian army just left these lying around fully loaded as they fled. the Russians at least had the sense to demolish their own equipment.

*facepalm*

Quote from: Sheb on December 11, 2016, 04:55:48 pm
Hopefully this will at least stop Russians from mocking the USA for the Iraqi leaving stuff behing.

At least the Iraqis didn't abandon an entire armored battalion for ISIS to take..... not to my knowledge anyway.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 05:11:11 pm by smjjames »
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BorkBorkGoesTheCode

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1520 on: December 11, 2016, 05:16:40 pm »
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Sergarr

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1521 on: December 11, 2016, 05:24:15 pm »
Quote from: Sheb on December 11, 2016, 04:55:48 pm
Hopefully this will at least stop Russians from mocking the USA for the Iraqi leaving stuff behing.
That's kind of not news, anyone who has followed Syrian Civil War knows that SAA always leaves out a lot of equipment when attacked. And by "always" I do mean always, no matter who they're fighting, FSA, an-Nusra, ISIS, they always report getting loads of loot afterwards. Syrian Army soldiers are mostly low-level Arab troops with zero motivation and a lot of corruption, not much you can do to prevent that from happening.

So, no it won't stop those Russians from mocking them, because otherwise they would've stopped a long time ago.

Quote from: smjjames on December 11, 2016, 05:04:07 pm
Quote from: Sheb on December 11, 2016, 04:55:48 pm
Hopefully this will at least stop Russians from mocking the USA for the Iraqi leaving stuff behing.

At least the Iraqis didn't abandon an entire armored battalion for ISIS to take..... not to my knowledge anyway.
They left a good third of the country to ISIS with barely any fighting, I'm pretty sure that ISIS took more than 30 tanks back then.
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martinuzz

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1522 on: December 11, 2016, 05:31:05 pm »
Inb4 ISIS captures the only Russian aircraft carrier
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Strife26

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1523 on: December 11, 2016, 05:44:46 pm »
At the least, the Iraqi Rabbit Army let more than ten Abrams be captured.

Y'know what'd be a real game changer in this ugly war? Some competent armored forces.
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Vilanat

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1524 on: December 11, 2016, 05:46:04 pm »
Yeah, the Iraqis left more and better equipment. Armor upgraded Humvees, M1A1 Abrams Tanks, Heavy Artillery and plenty of Rifles, Machine Guns (Mounted and SAWs) and Ammunition.
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smjjames

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1525 on: December 11, 2016, 05:56:12 pm »
I knew about the armored humvees, artillery and lots of guns, wasn't so sure on the tanks.

Having a competent armored brigade, even if it's just the Russians would definetly change things, along with having a professional army vs what sounds like not much more than mercenaries. However having either Russian or US forces actually send troops to actually fight would likely trigger an escalation as the other side would likely also send some of their own, not neccesarily to fight each other though.

Besides, the US sending combat divisions there is exactly what ISIS wants, and could just make the situation worse for all we know.
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Strife26

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1526 on: December 11, 2016, 05:59:55 pm »
Yep. But the desire is always to fix the results of shitty nation building with more nation building.
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Vilanat

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1527 on: December 11, 2016, 06:03:41 pm »
The irony is that in Syria it is actually the mercenaries that are holding grounds, winning back Aleppo and are basically the main fighting force against Rebels/Jihadists/ISIS. even in Palmyra, a Druze para-military unit was the one suffering most casualties because they stayed defending while the Army ran away.
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smjjames

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1528 on: December 11, 2016, 06:09:20 pm »
Quote from: Strife26 on December 11, 2016, 05:59:55 pm
Yep. But the desire is always to fix the results of shitty nation building with more nation building.

Trump has said that we need to stop doing all this nation building, so, there's some hope that we can break the habit. Or at least the habit of using a sledgehammer and glue to do it.

Still though, we can't be entirely hands-off in the MidEast, it's.... just not that simple to just be 'I'm washing my hands of this and am outta here'.
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Strife26

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Re: The Let's go back to Iraq, now without WMDs Thread. About the IS(IS) threat.
« Reply #1529 on: December 11, 2016, 06:14:47 pm »
So we should just be using a ball peen hammer and scotch tape?
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