Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Jifodus]

I’m looking for games with a particular style of gameplay, and for the most part packaged in single player form on a PC (though I suppose I could go for emulation). In particular I’m seeking games that are, in a highly abstract description, effectively puzzle games that afford multiple solutions to the same problem.

The general style of gameplay I’m thinking about is akin to what’s found in stealth games, where usually there are multiple routes to a destination. Such as in Metal Gear where they usually provide multiple potential routes through a level to reach the mission objective, whether it’s through some convoluted path where I’d never be seen by a hostile soldier, or a rather direct route slaughtering all the NPCs in the level, or toying with the AI by endlessly distracting them. Similarly in the Thief games where the end goal is collect all the loot, and the manner in which the levels are traversed can be varied. Which like in Metal Gear works through pure sneaking, distracting, murdering, and environmental manipulation.

Sandbox games are probably what could be considered the logical extreme of the style of gameplay I’m trying to find, since in a pure sandbox game I basically pick an end goal (i.e. solution to a puzzle) and then use the tools and/or items the game world offers to reach the end goal. The extreme example of what I’m looking for would be something along the lines of The Sims, where the game world provides a ton of objects with different mechanics and I can basically randomly string them together and eventually reach somewhere. I may’ve originally had a goal (e.g. become a Master Chef), but I somehow got distracted enough fishing for fertilizer for that perfect garden of ingredients that all I ever accomplished before getting bored of the current game is that I’ve maxed out fishing.

I’m not looking for pure puzzle games, where there is really only one way to solve the puzzle (or there are alternatives yet one way that’s horribly unbalanced that the alternates may as well not even exist). Whether or not the immediate play space is randomized or not. Since I find it getting old quite fast, true the first few times it offers some fun, but then it gets rather old when I’m slogging through the same set of puzzles repeatedly. Minigames end up like this most of the time and it’s usually painfully obvious, but it seems to me that most of the recent well-known games end up in the same boat.

To pick on everyone’s favorite recent sandbox game as an example of what I’m not trying to find, Minecraft is a well hidden type of this game. Random worlds, effectively unlimited creative output through voxel editing, yet at its heart it’s got a puzzle that really only one solution. Dig down to reach Diamond to advance to reach The Nether. In The Nether fight Blaze to eventually make it to The End. It isn’t bad that there’s only one way to reach the very end of the game, but my issue with Minecraft is that within each world, there’s only one way to reach the next world. For example, when it comes to reaching The Nether, my only option is to dig down for diamonds, pure lateral exploration won’t ever get me diamonds so I can mine obsidian for the portal. To reach The End, I always have to enter combat to get the required materials, I always have to go underground to encounter a stronghold.

Even Dwarf Fortress has become this style of game for me. I pick a goal, e.g. create a magma defended fortress, I make it through to the point of survival and then there’s only one path to the goal, dig down to magma lake, pump up magma to surface. There really isn’t much variety in solving that problem. True, there’s always starting on a volcano so I don’t have to pump up the magma, but then there isn’t even a problem to solve. In both cases, I’ll eventually get bored of what I’m doing and quit.

I’m mostly looking for the journey, the end doesn’t really matter (if my Sims example is of any indication). I may play through to the end once just to see it, but if the end isn’t actually required then I’ll probably never reach it again after the first time. For example with the TES games, sure there’s a main storyline and if I’m intrigued by the story line enough I’ll play through it once just to see it, but when I actually play through the TES games, I derive the most enjoyment simply by becoming distracted along the way (usually within the third/fourth main quest) and finding new things to do and new ways to stitch together the intentional as well as accidental tools the game offers.

Suggestions don’t need to have deeply engaging mechanics that require a ton of thought and strategy to succeed, most of the time I’ll usually end up setting the game to easy mode, just so that it’s easier to toy with it. I can generally play at any level of difficulty without too much trouble, I just prefer not to be consistently frustrated when all I really want to do is screw around with the game.

So anyone got any suggestions or recommendations?

[Ricky]

The hitman series comes to mind.
To a lesser extent From Dust comes to mind.
Maybe Deus Ex. Maybe Crayon Physics deluxe.
if you like having goals to accomplish Kerbal space program might satisfy your needs.

[nenjin]

Ninja'd by Ricky, I was going to say Hitman as well.

Deus Ex too, but it's got sort of a game way of doing things (tying xp to whether not you found side passages and awarding the most xp for a painstaking non-lethal takedown.) Levels are sandboxy, don't know if I'd say that about the environment.

Project Zomboid has a decent degree of stealth as it relates to zombies, and is very sandboxy. There's not a lot of super refined puzzles in it though, it's more the puzzle of how to survive. Darkwood also kinda fits the build, as it's all about moving around at night and trying to avoid guys, while set in a large sandbox-esqe forest. More of a horror-game though.

[Scripten]

Roller Coaster Tycoon. The entire series is fantastic, and each has decent scenarios that are all sort of mini-puzzles in and of themselves.

[hemmingjay]

Monaco?

[Trif]

Try Dishonored. It's a game about stealthily assassinating people. There are always multiple approaches to a target, some dynamic elements in the campaign, you can even get rid of all quest targets non-lethally if you're paying attention.

I recommend turning the quest markers off. The level design is usually good enough to guide you in the right direction without a glowing point in your vision.

[Sergarr]

Majesty? (the first one)

[Darkmere]

Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead.

Goal: Survive until you find something else that catches your attention.
Further goal: you decide.

Become a master woodsman and build your own bunker cabin lined with fire traps and spike pits to outlast the apocalypse? Teach yourself enough technowizardry to replace your arm with a laser cannon and raid science labs for parts? Become a mutant octopus martial artist? Build a mobile tank camper from scratch and wander from town to town? Nuke a zombie horde? All of the above? (I've left out several spoilers as well)

[Bouchart]

Have you considered Arcanum?  It's Fallout-ish, but has a great deal of character customization and abilities available.

[Nelia Hawk]

i dont know... maybe "mark of the ninja" for the case of stealth game with different solutions to problems?
as in you can go full stealth or full combat or whatever combination of items you want etc.
well it has nothing in the case of "sandbox" or "getting lost doing something else entirely than what you had planed" though.

[Delta Foxtrot]

Definitely the first Deus Ex.
Thirding the Hitman games.

Could someone else verify if AI War fits? I've only recently gotten it and dabbled a bit, but my gut feel is that it might fit the OP's criteria. Yes it's a 2D space RTS but it plays a lot like a puzzle to me. Puzzle in a randomized galaxy with customizable content.

[Sergarr]

"I just prefer not to be consistently frustrated when all I really want to do is screw around with the game."

From what I've heard, AI War doesn't fit under that criteria.

[Sonlirain]

Alpha Protocol?
A stealth agent game with a large "metagame" between missions. It's not exacly a sandbox but there's plenty of variables.

Then tehre's Jagged Aliance with it's "free this island in whatever way you consider fit"

[Jifodus]

Thanks 

I've played through the Hitman series as well as Deus Ex. I've played the Hitman series fairly recently, but the last time I tried playing Deus Ex I developed a bad headache. Unfortunately it's a general problem I have with most first person games. I end up developing a headache / motion sickness, my suspicion is that the default FOV on a widescreen display causes the sides/corners to move in a way that ends up messing with my peripheral vision, and I've yet to determine a safe configuration. Fortunately stealth based games almost always fit my criteria so I've tended to play through them, unfortunately it also means fresh choices are slim since stealth based games are a bit niche.

The hitman series comes to mind.
To a lesser extent From Dust comes to mind.
Maybe Deus Ex. Maybe Crayon Physics deluxe.
if you like having goals to accomplish Kerbal space program might satisfy your needs.

I'll give From Dust a shot, I remember reading awhile back that it was a quasi-sandbox style game, and I figured it would be interesting, it just didn't seem interesting enough at the time for the introductory pricing. Crayon Physics, definitely, I actually bought it (probably in some Steam sale) after playing the demo, I just never got around to playing it. So thanks for the reminder.

Ninja'd by Ricky, I was going to say Hitman as well.

Deus Ex too, but it's got sort of a game way of doing things (tying xp to whether not you found side passages and awarding the most xp for a painstaking non-lethal takedown.) Levels are sandboxy, don't know if I'd say that about the environment.

Project Zomboid has a decent degree of stealth as it relates to zombies, and is very sandboxy. There's not a lot of super refined puzzles in it though, it's more the puzzle of how to survive. Darkwood also kinda fits the build, as it's all about moving around at night and trying to avoid guys, while set in a large sandbox-esqe forest. More of a horror-game though.

Unfortunately, I've actually started becoming disinterested in survival style games. I'm not certain since when, but they've seemed to have started to devolve into something that's pretty formulaic. First day, find shelter. Second day, acquire survival gear. Third day, develop long term survival strategy (e.g. food, hunting grounds, scavenge sites). There is variety to it, but it tends to be in the vein of solving for A, B, C, and D in the equation: A + B + C + D = Survival.

A survival game that I'd find more interesting is here's a flashlight, pair of scissors, the clothes on your character, oh and it's going to be snowing all the time, with these few fixed elements can you make it out alive? Note for it to have any replay ability, it'd need to randomize what fixed elements are available, or have plenty of superfluous elements in the world so that not all of them are required in one game.

I suspect if a survival game is developed long enough to support multiple parallel paths, it might actually reach the point where I'd actually enjoy playing it long term, but most of the ones I've played haven't made it that far. Minecraft might become this, but from the recent developments I've seen, it seems to be more about extending the length of a game instead of providing alternative paths.

I'll give Project Zomboid a shot, see if it manages to hold my interest.

Roller Coaster Tycoon. The entire series is fantastic, and each has decent scenarios that are all sort of mini-puzzles in and of themselves.

Yeash, I've enjoyed RCT2 and I've recently got and have been playing RCT3.

Monaco?

Hm... how did I manage to miss Monaco? It definitely looks like what I'm looking for.

Try Dishonored. It's a game about stealthily assassinating people. There are always multiple approaches to a target, some dynamic elements in the campaign, you can even get rid of all quest targets non-lethally if you're paying attention.

I recommend turning the quest markers off. The level design is usually good enough to guide you in the right direction without a glowing point in your vision.

If it's anything like the assassination part of Assassin's Creed, then I'll probably enjoy it.

Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead.

Goal: Survive until you find something else that catches your attention.
Further goal: you decide.

Become a master woodsman and build your own bunker cabin lined with fire traps and spike pits to outlast the apocalypse? Teach yourself enough technowizardry to replace your arm with a laser cannon and raid science labs for parts? Become a mutant octopus martial artist? Build a mobile tank camper from scratch and wander from town to town? Nuke a zombie horde? All of the above? (I've left out several spoilers as well)

Sure, I'll see how well it manages to keep me entertained.

Have you considered Arcanum?  It's Fallout-ish, but has a great deal of character customization and abilities available.

I've played a little bit of Fallout 1, from the bits that I have played I did find it pretty good. Admittedly, I've probably also enjoyed it far more by reading about what happened within a game than I've ever gotten myself. Though Arcanum looks interesting, so I'll give it a shot.

Majesty? (the first one)

Is Majesty: The Fantasy Kingdom Sim what you're referring to? I'll take a look at it.

i dont know... maybe "mark of the ninja" for the case of stealth game with different solutions to problems?
as in you can go full stealth or full combat or whatever combination of items you want etc.
well it has nothing in the case of "sandbox" or "getting lost doing something else entirely than what you had planed" though.

True, I saw this game recently, but it seemed to play too much towards action for my particular tastes. With a preference to quick moves and killing blows, and not really about trying to locate paths through the level with minimal interaction. Though if I'm wrong about it, I'm willing to give it a shot.

Definitely the first Deus Ex.
Thirding the Hitman games.

Could someone else verify if AI War fits? I've only recently gotten it and dabbled a bit, but my gut feel is that it might fit the OP's criteria. Yes it's a 2D space RTS but it plays a lot like a puzzle to me. Puzzle in a randomized galaxy with customizable content.

I quite like RTS games, at least not the RTS games that play at a fast pace (*cough*StarCraft*cough*). So I'll see what it has to offer. TBS games I tend to also enjoy.

Alpha Protocol?
A stealth agent game with a large "metagame" between missions. It's not exacly a sandbox but there's plenty of variables.

Then tehre's Jagged Aliance with it's "free this island in whatever way you consider fit"

I'll give them a try. At least with most games that have a story, I'll generally play through them once.