Webadict: Please prod Tiruin.
Persus13: What points in flabort's attack on Nerjin do you believe to be the good points?
Nerjin: Why am I the one asking the above question to Persus13, instead of you? You had the chance to try to learn what Persus was thinking were the good points, and you instead just jabbed Persus for his relatively high opinion of flabort's attack. A reflexive defence instead of an informed defence, basically. What makes it so important to strongly indicate you disagree with Persus13 without even trying to figure out exactly what the disagreements are?
Nerjin: Respond to the above stuff addressed to you.
Alright. I've looked back a bit through the Flabort votes, and found material of interest. One particular player caught my attention:
Imp.
What caught my attention was Imp's vote at the end of the day:
updated reads, on flabort and Varee:
I had thought that flabort was a pretty new player and was judging his play under that standard. He felt pretty Town from that perspective; minimal hostility, friendly, open, curious, boastful, having fun. I didn't and really still don't feel hostile intent from his day game. His use of ability seemed somewhat advanced for a newbie, but also confused; I wasn't sure what to think about it. His apparent goals in using the vote ability especially, and what he said about his revive were the main things that contradicted this newbie Townie feel for me. His goals in how he used his vote power did not and do not seem Town, and do not match the values and priorities he had shown in his day game. His claims being somewhat panicked then, his discription here:
Yes, I was panicking too. Somewhat. You don't gather ~5 votes, get daykilled, and then get the only votes so far back on you and not panic about that; someone wants you dead, and that someone is very determined. I want to be alive long enough to learn who.
That doesn't sound or feel like a new player playing Town. Furthermore he's made a claim of being very, very familiar with hammers. So he also knows he doesn't 'need to be alive' to learn anything; we learn everything when the game is over no matter when we die. This attitude doesn't match the rest of his earlier attitude. His more recent talk of calculation, manipulation, and claims of subtle control don't match it either. I don't think flabort's a newbie any more, and I also don't think he's Town anymore. I especially dislike how he keeps changing what he has said about his revive ability's limits, from his original claim about it:
I'm afraid there's no point to voting me.
to his current claim that yes, he could be killed by a lynch now, if we lynch him now, but also saying
I don't see the rest of the game going well if you continue to lynch me.
Moderate lean Scum.
I really distrust Varee. D1 when he started to get votes and more pressure, he switched from goofing off to discussing who he would build a house/give a power to. He hasn't chosen to speak plainly at any point, he doesn't appear at all concerned as to the alignment or intentions of anyone he might target to give this 'gift' to. He seems way to trusting of the opinions of other players. He gives me the 'leave me alone, pay attention to other people' feel that I consider to be a scumtell. Part of his explanation for why his power apparently gave nothing to Toaster:
1.1 Flabort did not target me or toaster as if he target one of us either he would also get the power or toaster would get the power
But Varee never said he needed Flabort's 'help' to make this work. That's a new and strange angle to this whole 'toilet' thing. He claims his vote is safest where it is now (unused?), he claims that pressing a case is not the best way for him to gain info now, he still has no suspicions, but uses phrases like:
Well if both me and flabort is to be trusted
I worry about that 'santa claim' of his. Nice cover for a converter even. Moderate lean Scum.
Part of what caught my eye was how the flabort content started. "I didn't and really still don't feel hostile intent from his day game" is not exactly a phrase I expect to see associated with "Moderate lean Scum," particularly in a case that was based around flabort's day game. Downplaying the scumminess of one's end-of-day target as one votes for them seems like an effort to minimize association with the end result.
What really set off alarm bells, though, was one of her reasons for the flabort vote (bolding by me):
Yes, I was panicking too. Somewhat. You don't gather ~5 votes, get daykilled, and then get the only votes so far back on you and not panic about that; someone wants you dead, and that someone is very determined. I want to be alive long enough to learn who.
That doesn't sound or feel like a new player playing Town. Furthermore he's made a claim of being very, very familiar with hammers. So he also knows he doesn't 'need to be alive' to learn anything; we learn everything when the game is over no matter when we die.
Yes, this is Imp attacking flabort for saying he wanted to be alive long enough to learn who tried to kill him, using the post-game reveal to say that he'll learn anyway whether alive or dead. There were a lot of valid reasons to attack flabort. This is not among them. It is a contrived reason, dependent on an unrealistically literal reading of flabort's statement; it is dependent on an assumption that flabort had no interest in dealing with the person(s) who wanted him dead and cared only about learning who they were. The assumption is, of course, not supported by flabort's actions, including his repeated assertions that one of his reasons for attacking Nerjin was a belief that Nerjin was the daykiller.
I also noticed Imp's other suspect: the other easy target, Varee.
So I looked back through Imp's posts. Her primary case has been one on Varee, which she started pushing in the middle of Day 1. She largely abandoned it Day 2 until her flabort vote (her second vote so far), asking Varee only a few scattered questions about his alleged construction power until the vote.
Imp, for all her questioning of everyone, hasn't taken much action. Lots of poking and prodding, but very little attacking. About the biggest conflict she's gotten into with anyone but Varee or flabort that I noticed was a
rather short
clash with TolyK about memory issues, soon abandoned. She questions everyone, making herself look active and useful, but she doesn't visibly get anywhere. Mostly, she just sits back and suspects the easy targets.
Imp, overall, has done little to help the town. While keeping up the appearance of activity through questioning, her questioning has rarely seemed to help her get anywhere. She has focused on (and only ever voted for) the easiest targets in the game: Varee and flabort. Her last-minute participation in the Day 2 wagon on the latter was odd and poor, with a bizarre attack and a statement about not seeing malice in flabort's day game.
Imp has
promised content will come on the 23rd. Let's see what she eventually delivers.
Imp: Who, aside from Varee, do you suspect? Also, you asked
this question to Cheeetar a while back about his knowledge of the acronym PFP. Is there any answer that would have been a sign of scumhood that you can think of?
Author
Topic: BYOR 13 - Game Over: Thirteen (Read 259396 times)