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[samanato]

Isn't tempering limited to iron-based alloys? EDIT: ignore that, it apparently was applied to bronze too

[Evaris]

Isn't tempering limited to iron-based alloys? EDIT: ignore that, it apparently was applied to bronze too

Yeah I used to think that too till I did more research myself honestly.(hence why I had to redo my cupronickel RAW in my mod as well, seeing as I was using a weaker untempered version, and it's nice IMO to have an alternative to steel of nearly the same strength.)

[PersonGuy]

Poleaxes would be a awesome addition to the game as i am sure the where around during the 1400s and slightly less sure they where around before they would be a great utility weapon as its a axe, hammer, and spear all in one where historically one of the most favored weapons of a knight on foot. Although i don't really see dwarves using a conventional highly effective model of such a weapon effectively due to it primarily being a fairly long shafted weapon to be useful like how dwarves don't use pikes, mauls, or two handed sword.

[Evaris]

Poleaxes would be a awesome addition to the game as i am sure the where around during the 1400s and slightly less sure they where around before they would be a great utility weapon as its a axe, hammer, and spear all in one where historically one of the most favored weapons of a knight on foot. Although i don't really see dwarves using a conventional highly effective model of such a weapon effectively due to it primarily being a fairly long shafted weapon to be useful like how dwarves don't use pikes, mauls, or two handed sword.

Well we do have halberds, but polehammers might be an addition.

[Scruiser]

I really like this suggestion, you worked out all the history, details, and raws and it fits well with the time period.  I hope this gets seriously considered once the current round of bug fixes is done.

[Neonivek]

Nethercap is a mushroom... and all you did was essentially make a mushy concrete.

I don't see why it would essentially make super stone armor especially when concrete is significantly weaker then the stone it originates from.

I am being harsh but I am against "making magic for magic's sake" which this is mostly "well it is both rare and deep underground... of course it is much better!".

I mean Adamantine was a super material, but its purpose is directly tied into the lore.

[Evaris]

Nethercap is a mushroom... and all you did was essentially make a mushy concrete.

I don't see why it would essentially make super stone armor especially when concrete is significantly weaker then the stone it originates from.

I am being harsh but I am against "making magic for magic's sake" which this is mostly "well it is both rare and deep underground... of course it is much better!".

I mean Adamantine was a super material, but its purpose is directly tied into the lore.

1.  I'm aware nethercap is a mushroom, but it acts like wood, and thus it should act similarly when you get down to pulping it.  The fixed temperature would keep the water frozen, as pykrete has a melting temperature of ~45*F, well above the fixed temperature of nethercap.  So why it would be "mushy" makes no sense.  Just because it's called something-krete does not mean it's based on concrete, pykrete was named as it was on account of it fracturing about the same as concrete despite it being mostly ice. 

2.  It doesn't make "super stone armor"  It makes higher-tensile strength (as in it can bend a bit more than most) moldable stone... which is still crap compared to metal or higher strength stone like Marble and Granite if they were modeled for their full material properties. (sadly "stone template" is just a basis.  Stone varies widely in strength obviously) 

3.    I'm not trying to make magic or anything.  I'm trying to take an already present magical object (below freezing point of water woody mushroom.)  and utilize it in a way that makes sense given real life physical interactions with an object of the given temperature and other outstanding known material properties - in this case, making pykrete out of it. 

[Neonivek]

  It makes higher-tensile strength (as in it can bend a bit more than most) moldable stone

That would be 0 to make it 0 oddly enough

I'm trying to take an already present magical object (below freezing point of water woody mushroom)

It could just be warm blooded and regulate body heat, have some sort of chemical reaction, or just be something naturally occurring without outside mystical help.

Just because it's called something-krete does not mean it's based on concrete, pykrete was named as it was on account of it fracturing about the same as concrete despite it being mostly ice.

Sorry let me correct myself.

Why would bricks be so strong?

[Scruiser]

Nethercap is a mushroom... and all you did was essentially make a mushy concrete.

I don't see why it would essentially make super stone armor especially when concrete is significantly weaker then the stone it originates from.

I am being harsh but I am against "making magic for magic's sake" which this is mostly "well it is both rare and deep underground... of course it is much better!".

I mean Adamantine was a super material, but its purpose is directly tied into the lore.

Pykrete  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pykrete exists IRL and was considered for use during WWII.  Its main weakness is its melting point, which nethercaps would fix.  To quote wikipedia:

Pykrete has some interesting properties, notably its relatively slow melting rate (because of low thermal conductivity), and its vastly improved strength and toughness over ice; it is closer in form to concrete.

Pykrete is slightly more difficult to form than concrete, as it expands during the freezing process. However, it can be repaired and maintained using seawater. The mixture can be moulded into any shape and frozen, and it will be extremely tough and durable, as long as it is kept at or below freezing.

It seems dwarfy and like something dwarfs would invent given their ingenuity, after encountering nethercaps.

[Neonivek]

Great now it just needs to resist the process of sublimation!

But still all this makes is bricks. I can't imagine them increasing the project size with anything but bricks.

Though another issue is that Nethercap is a "perfectly-insulated material" it doesn't absorb nor give off heat. Though I figure that is a limitation in the engine.

[Evaris]

Great now it just needs to resist the process of sublimation!

But still all this makes is bricks. I can't imagine them increasing the project size with anything but bricks.

Though another issue is that Nethercap is a "perfectly-insulated material" it doesn't absorb nor give off heat.

It's described as being "cool to the touch"  Meaning that some form of heat transfer (or conversion of heat energy to another form, possibly matter) is taking place. 
Directly from the RAW: [PREFSTRING:coldness to the touch]

Also there is no reason this can only make bricks - given the set temperature at 30 degrees F for nethercap, it would take quite a few minutes to solidify - if you have a mold in place it would be quite simple to pour the mixture into a mold for it to harden in any shape you wanted while you waited for it to harden.

[Larix]

The set temperature of nethercap is 0°C (34°F), the exact melting point of water. And due to how temperature works in DF, it cannot freeze water. Pykrete was apparently reported to lose its strengths at temperatures above -15°C (something like 4F, i think).

If you have a very cold embark, you could make pykrete by combining wood with water and letting it freeze. This material could be exempt from the standard flash-melting.

PS: I don't quite see the point of the added alloys. We already have several purely decorative metals that are largely ignored; and i'm not convinced throwing in three or four more weapon-capable alloys into the room between copper and steel would really add that much. It'd probably still end up "copper is shitty but can at least cut - bronze is middle-of-the road, adequate but nothing great - steel is enough for everything not supremely FUN" with a few more variants in the bronze range with nothing to really set them apart. That they existed isn't reason enough to include them.

[Evaris]

The set temperature of nethercap is 0°C (34°F), the exact melting point of water. And due to how temperature works in DF, it cannot freeze water. Pykrete was apparently reported to lose its strengths at temperatures above -15°C (something like 4F, i think).

If you have a very cold embark, you could make pykrete by combining wood with water and letting it freeze. This material could be exempt from the standard flash-melting.

PS: I don't quite see the point of the added alloys. We already have several purely decorative metals that are largely ignored; and i'm not convinced throwing in three or four more weapon-capable alloys into the room between copper and steel would really add that much. It'd probably still end up "copper is shitty but can at least cut - bronze is middle-of-the road, adequate but nothing great - steel is enough for everything not supremely FUN" with a few more variants in the bronze range with nothing to really set them apart. That they existed isn't reason enough to include them.

1.  Pykrete is still stable and solid at 34*F.  Also, Nethercap's temperature (and the freezing point of water) is at 32*F, not 34*F.  And Again, pykrete would be solid at temperatures above this.

2.  Well let's look at cupronickel.  It's almost steel quality if tempered, and we already have a version of it, albeit a weaker, decorative alloy mix.  (nickel silver)   So can you tell me why dwarves would produce a less valuable, non-weapon capable alloy mix, and not a weapon quality one? 

[Scruiser]

That they existed isn't reason enough to include them.

I think a large portion of the development of dwarf fortress disagrees with this point.  We have a huge variety of minerals with only a few functional differences, a huge variety of animals, many of which are functionally similar, a huge variety of gem cuts, and with the recent update, a huge variety of surface vegetables, many of which are functionally similar.  Simulation and realism is a major factor in a lot of these, and the suggested alloys provide just enough mechanical variety to keep them interesting while contributing to the realism and variety.  Its not a huge priority, but when the economy is updated so that civs prioritize materials based on their usage in weapons, it might be a good time to add in these alloys.
In the short term, I would suggest putting the alloy RAWs on the mod forum and seeing if any mod authors are interested in adding them.

[Evaris]

That they existed isn't reason enough to include them.

I think a large portion of the development of dwarf fortress disagrees with this point.  We have a huge variety of minerals with only a few functional differences, a huge variety of animals, many of which are functionally similar, a huge variety of gem cuts, and with the recent update, a huge variety of surface vegetables, many of which are functionally similar.  Simulation and realism is a major factor in a lot of these, and the suggested alloys provide just enough mechanical variety to keep them interesting while contributing to the realism and variety.  Its not a huge priority, but when the economy is updated so that civs prioritize materials based on their usage in weapons, it might be a good time to add in these alloys.
In the short term, I would suggest putting the alloy RAWs on the mod forum and seeing if any mod authors are interested in adding them.

Well they would also be a simple addition to the game, even in the short term, so for me, the alloys are a bit of "variety is the spice of life" more than anything.