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[Nerjin]

Replace in for IG if possible

[zombie urist]

And even if you decide to kill me, Ill just use my last ability and put in a replacement for Jiokuy.

Whoever replaces in for IG needs to explain this.

If we do assume that IG is responsible for Jack's death, then where's the necromancer kill? Where's the scum kill? Argh this is pretty frustrating.

Ahmmm....

[4maskwolf]

Oh, and replacement list

[Hapah]

PPE: Ha, started typing this up earlier today and just go around to finishing it. Click preview and "46 new replies have been posted".

PFW

Bed time for me.

I forgot to say: Thanks so much Hapah for replacing in for me...As in, so much.
._.

No trouble! Wish I would have known life was gonna be a bastard as soon as I stepped in though, I woulda let the other guy that volunteered have it.

Did anyone else hear an explosion last night?

I did not.

EVERYONE should we be lynching IG over the Toony-IG conflict? I say no, but I'd be interested to see what others think.

Given how the day has played out so far I don't think it'd be a terrible idea. Has your opinion changed with this new data?

Because jack was found as a charred skeleton, its only logical to assume it was jack who blew up.

The fact that you saw/heard the explosion cannot be dismissed. There are other ways that Meph could've made your spell fail, but he chose this one: it means you were likely somehow involved.

Why would your character see that and not mine? I suppose I showed up after so it would be too late, but what about Flabort?

Let's see:

There is indeed a Necromancer among us.
I found a molten candle at Jiokuy's grave site. The candle had charcoal imbedded in it.
According to the books I consulted, this device can be used to "rekindle [a] soul to life once again." Also, the passage relates to an unholy unlife, rather than a pure and holy life.
Otherwise, my night appeared uneventful.

Nope.

Maybe...perhaps...you're the Necromancer?

I'm not sure I follow. You think IG is the neccy?

NQT, Hapah, did you do anything near the graveyard or Jack's house last night?

I did not on both counts.

I suppose a randomly targeted kill after a failed revive is possible but I think it's unlikely.

I feel confident in saying that IG caused Jack to get burned; intentional or not. I don't see why it would have been mentioned in his results otherwise.

And even if you decide to kill me, Ill just use my last ability and put in a replacement for Jiokuy.

Whoever replaces in for IG needs to explain this.

Seconded so hard.

I'm starting to suspect that there might not be a "traditional" scum or cult team. My reasoning is that with one definite SK (Werebear), one very likely SK (Neccy, if you believe flabort. His claims seem genuine to me), and one whatever-the-hell IG is (who I think exploded Jack, intentional or not), how weak would the actual scum team need to be for the game to be balanced? I took a quick look at the rolelists from past SuperNats, and if there are this many thirds with a real scum team it seems like the deck would be stacked pretty far towards anti-town. Am I totally off-base thinking this?

[flabort]

So, in conclusion to the last point you made, Hapah, maybe early early day 1 IG was right and we should have been hunting third parties?

I find that hard to believe, but it does seem conceivable. The thought that we're facing an all SK threat may have crossed my mind a few times; usually to be dismissed, of course.

[Hapah]

Nah, we couldn't have known then. Had no real reason to suspect an unusual setup. But now, we've got a little more information and the idea doesn't seem so far-fetched (to me, at least).

[Jim Groovester]

I'm starting to suspect that there might not be a "traditional" scum or cult team. My reasoning is that with one definite SK (Werebear), one very likely SK (Neccy, if you believe flabort. His claims seem genuine to me), and one whatever-the-hell IG is (who I think exploded Jack, intentional or not), how weak would the actual scum team need to be for the game to be balanced? I took a quick look at the rolelists from past SuperNats, and if there are this many thirds with a real scum team it seems like the deck would be stacked pretty far towards anti-town. Am I totally off-base thinking this?

I'm starting to come around to the same opinion. I think we should be wary of a traditional scum team though. Regardless I'm still in favor of lynching IG/his replacement unless somebody even scummier comes along.

Actually, If we're only dealing with third parties, a mass claim should be pretty informative and relatively safe. So I guess the question is, who else is willing to gamble on there not being a traditional scum team or cult team?

[Jim Groovester]

On second thought:

  Composing himself, the High Priest looks out at the rest of you. "Jiokuy was a Werebear, that much is obvious. But he was no friend of this town. It seems the gods had cursed him for his sins, and he in turn took it upon himself to be a force for evil as a Killer. But he was not the threat that the gods are truly worried about. We are safer now, yes, but still all in great danger. May the gods keep the Just safe tonight."

This flavor passage does seem to suggest that there is a scum team. Or it could be Meph faking us out.

Interesting that IG mentioned trying to get forgiveness from the gods.

[notquitethere]

It's just I'm having Supernatural 6 flashbacks where I didn't know the possibility of the hybrid cult and then lost horribly because I'd assumed nothing like that could happen, which along with Magic Mafia has given me a heightened fear of ignored cults. As far as I'm concerned, IG was a bit shady, but he didn't look to be a cult leader and so there are still better people to target.

If you believe IG was responsible for Jack's death, then where's the necromancer kill? Was Flabort lying? Where's the scum kill? Why would IG claim the revive when he could so easily be counter claimed AND claim the revive failed?

Uh oh. I've just realised, IG could well have said he raised ZU 'cos he was fakeclaiming priest all along, then realise he might be counterclaimed then hastily claw that back. Also, why is he both an Exile Mage AND a Hemomancer?

Nerjin, if you're replacing in for IG, get a copy of the night PMs and tell us with your superior clarity and penmanship what's really going on.

Spoiler: Regarding Replacing Out (click to show/hide)

It was totally unnecessary to call Toady in. Cursing and calling someone Dariush 2, while a bit harsh, is not very unusual for mafia. IG was a bit of a bad sport in replacing out when the heat really hit, that behaviour does not a good mafia player make.

As an aside to this aside, does anyone else's pokéball hand start twitching whenever a wild Toady One appears?

[Tiruin]

Given how I'm now technically unopposed with my word here (thanks Hapah) in reference to the scuffle--do not let whatever happens in Mafia bleed out and toxify your vision to make this a 'personal thing'.
Treat the attitude as a role--the role you're hunting. Attitudes =/= The Person.

IG: To speak frankly, there are times wherein anger gets to you because of what others say--reply calmly no matter what happened before, after or at the current time. Do not compare people to [certain figures that are a figure of {bad}] in your eyes--it brands people. It labels people. It is unjustified and not...right.

I know your background--or at least could guess what factors come through your mind and thoughts when faced with adversity. I ask, please, do not let it paint your vision here in treating others. You have to look at the attitude and probably find a cleaner way to settle disputes, like asking 'hey, why're you like that?'. Jim is snarky snark, but he's not Dariush. Dariush, in his defense, is exposed daily to an environment that is...more caustic than the norm, wherein toxicity is (generally) the norm, but he's controlling it. Just quick to use...crude words when bad stuff occurs (and generalisms), but that's another story.

Now as a point to your playstyle, there's the whole 'quote a person and reword how you feel', which is good! But know that in-game, people will act to it not against YOU but treat it as a significant point to discern your role.

@4mask: While reporting to Toady is all well and good--there are times wherein you can note a wrong being done by others and intervene yourself. Diffuse the situation without throwing a punch into the mixture. I'd like most grievances to be fixed that way, but most aren't all because of assumptions and presumptions made on both sides (you did this because x but I did y because z...). Speak as equals and how you'd want to be spoken to. With respect, understanding and clarity.

Not saying anything against any of y'all, but I do note that sometimes, the toxicity rises in such levels that the whole Mafia board (and those who inhabit it) are being viewed in a very bad light by other people (much like how NAZI = GERMANY branding...you can see the logic in that [Hint: There's none, but the beliefs to individuals AND NOT THE PEOPLE, and even further--the attitude and not the person. It's a deep concept.]). An allegory pertaining to how negativity blinds people and paints a huge mess out of a relatively tiny problem/source.

Don't give in to presumptions guys. It's not becoming of a person to do so and judge the other from it. This is out-of-mafia advice (or how you treat mafia talk anyways).

[Persus13]

Toony:

Jack AT probably prevented Night 1's kill, good on him.

I doubt it, given that Jack A T said we almost certainly had a cult yesterday. I doubt he'd be so certain if he had blocked a kill.

@NQT:

Everyone on the IG lynch
I don't see the contradiction, though IG could have been clearer. He uncovered ZU's face, started the ritual, was disturbed, Toony comes along, digs him up and then revives him. Where's the contradiction?

ZU's grave wasn't disturbed when I arrived. I had to do "a good bit of digging" to unearth the body.

Did it specifically say it was undisturbed?

notquitethere:

Not so fast Persus. We know ZU may be good, we also know that there are scum players out there. It's absurd to lynch ZU today. Better kill all the original scum and see whether we've won and then if not we can kill ZU as back up. It's senseless to waste a lynch on him, especially in a potential cult set-up.

Yeah, good point. Unvote. Lynching a possible third party is not the best idea at the moment.

EVERYONE should we be lynching IG over the Toony-IG conflict? I say no, but I'd be interested to see what others think.

I wouldn't mind lynching IG (and haven't minded since D1), but I do think we should focus on hunting elsewhere as well to be in a good position tomorrow.

Did it say anything about putting the soil back over ZU?

I put the soil back over ZU.

This is really convenient, especially since it's right after IG said he had nothing else to add and he hadn't specified this earlier, even though it would have explained the contradiction.
Why are you leading IG by asking questions that help his claim? I'm noticing a pattern where you go "maybe it was this" and IG going "that's right" even though he didn't mention it earlier.

It's just I'm having Supernatural 6 flashbacks where I didn't know the possibility of the hybrid cult and then lost horribly because I'd assumed nothing like that could happen, which along with Magic Mafia has given me a heightened fear of ignored cults. As far as I'm concerned, IG was a bit shady, but he didn't look to be a cult leader and so there are still better people to target.

Yeah, but does a full-blown cult and multiple third parties sound like a balanced game to you? Unless flabort is lying and distracting us with good flavor (which frankly, I don't think him capable of). What's your theory?

Toaster:

Persus:

Why are you and Jim so passive-aggressive with TheWetSheep?

Not sure what you're looking for here; voting him is about as non-passive as you can get.

Yes, after implying he was scummy without being very aggressive about it for several days.

Flabort:

I think what IG means is that his proc'd first, then failed, consuming it. THEN Toony's proc'd.

Yes, but Jim was specifically saying that that isn't how revives work in Supernatural games. All revives are one-shots, and the last time a revive failed, the person was able to reuse it the next night.

And get back on Toaster's case. What did YOU do last night, and why haven't we heard about it yet?

Anyone else besides Toony or IG Surely some of your actions last night are worth mentioning. NQT, Hapah, did you do anything near the graveyard or Jack's house last night?

Maybe people haven't claimed because they don't want to die tomorrow night?

Imperial

Know what? Don't really care about toaster right now. IG, I was willing to believe you before, but that's just dumb. If you're going to be that childish, and ignorant, and blind... At this moment, nothing you're saying seems believable.
Imperial Guardsman, I am a fool for having believed you earlier.

Oh, just because Im complaining that he isnt being clear?

He's being very clear. The only ambiguous thing in this post is the quote where it's unclear which player you think is a scum priest.

Imperial Guardsman:

I for one agree with NQT and think our problem is Toony.

So that's your response to this?

I for one, think that you are a scum priest or something else with ulterior motives.

If that's true, why aren't you voting him?

Quietly voting him back without acknowledging what I said?  Yeah, that's a scum move right there.

4maskwolf:

Just FYI IG, if you get a warning from the Toad you can blame me for reporting you. Not just for mafia things, but other places as well.

That was kind of unnecessary. Having almost everyone baying for your blood can be very stressful.

Oh, and replacement list

Can't you only replace in for TheWetSheep?


Jim and Hapah:

I'm starting to suspect that there might not be a "traditional" scum or cult team. My reasoning is that with one definite SK (Werebear), one very likely SK (Neccy, if you believe flabort. His claims seem genuine to me), and one whatever-the-hell IG is (who I think exploded Jack, intentional or not), how weak would the actual scum team need to be for the game to be balanced? I took a quick look at the rolelists from past SuperNats, and if there are this many thirds with a real scum team it seems like the deck would be stacked pretty far towards anti-town. Am I totally off-base thinking this?

I'm starting to come around to the same opinion. I think we should be wary of a traditional scum team though. Regardless I'm still in favor of lynching IG/his replacement unless somebody even scummier comes along.

It sounds plausible, but three thirds isn't a lot more then normal. Maybe there's only a 1 or 2 person scumteam, but I doubt there wouldn't be any scumteam.

Everyone:

If we do assume that IG is responsible for Jack's death, then where's the necromancer kill? Where's the scum kill? Argh this is pretty frustrating.

This. Anyone have any ideas? I'm starting to wonder if we're dealing with a Necromancer scum team or something. There have been third party versions of scumteams in the past (Lone Vampire) so it could be possible. Things are definitely confusing and Jim's idea of lynching IG for answers might be a good idea at this point.

[Persus13]

Meph: I think Ottofar needs a prod.

[4maskwolf]

yes.  Replacement list for TWS.

[Imperial Guardsman]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Yeah, about my replacement, what's done is done, guys.
I'm struggling to juggle the pressure and when I can finally begin to handle it 4maskwolf casually walks in and says hey m8 i reported you to toady kthxbai
4maskwolf, there is literally no other reason for reporting me to toady than either removing me from the game or removing me from the board, and if you can't play fair, go down to one of those godmodding suggestion FGRP games.
And about Dariush, he is a stupid, hateful person and I take nothing back. I could care less about his background, unless he has been under everyones boot heel under fear of physical harm on a daily basis and being forced to antagonize the weak to find closure, I simply cannot relate to him. He goes out of his way to be a jerk, therefore I consider him a jerk. Too bad for him.

[notquitethere]

Persus

Why are you leading IG by asking questions that help his claim? I'm noticing a pattern where you go "maybe it was this" and IG going "that's right" even though he didn't mention it earlier.

I just noticed he was really bad at explaining himself. A bit like ZU really. Won't use twenty words to explain something clearly when ten unclear words will do. Obviously, where it looks like he's just making it up as he goes along doesn't help his case and his mention of a second power shows he's been less than honest with us... but he's not a cult leader so I think there's better lynch targets.

Yeah, but does a full-blown cult and multiple third parties sound like a balanced game to you? Unless flabort is lying and distracting us with good flavor (which frankly, I don't think him capable of). What's your theory?

Multiple killers and a cult may be seen as balancing as the killers are likely to hit each other or the cult at times. But look, given there's only been one kill over two nights, unless Jack was REALLY good at selecting targets for protection, we'd expect a few more kills if there were multiple 3rd party killers and a kill cult.

Everyone:

If we do assume that IG is responsible for Jack's death, then where's the necromancer kill? Where's the scum kill? Argh this is pretty frustrating.

This. Anyone have any ideas? I'm starting to wonder if we're dealing with a Necromancer scum team or something. There have been third party versions of scumteams in the past (Lone Vampire) so it could be possible. Things are definitely confusing and Jim's idea of lynching IG for answers might be a good idea at this point.

We can't afford too many info-lynches when there's the a potential cult. Kill mafia narrow the range of suspects for scum hunters, cult teams widen the range. They're the worst.