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[PanTheSatyr]

This is pretty cool, I would suggest more but you seem to have everything pinned down in the future list. great work
(I will say though, is the stone list going to tell us which are magma safe or not?)

Thanks.

Yes, beside that it will contain if you can use this stone for healthcare (plaster powder), the color of it, flux y/n, and which military usable ores it may contain veins of (Copper, Tin, Cassiterite, Bismuth, Silver, Iron).

I'm not sure yet how to design that page.

You seem to be planning only 1 page (or a 2-page spread) on embarks--because the embark is the first part of the game where the player has to think

More were planned, similar to what you suggested.

First I wanted to write an Introduction to why you should spent some time to choose your embark location and equipment / items and how much it can effect your strategy and gameplay. Noting the possibility's, for example that it's absolutely possible to start with nothing more then a single pickaxe. And also noting that choosing a different embark location or equipment may be a good thing to do if you feel that the start of a new fortress feels like routine. (1 single page)

Then i wanted to list all things that can be considered when choosing your embark location (like neighbors) and how difficult or rewarding they may be. That alone will likely fill some pages.

After that i wanted to create multiple single pages with exemplary embark profiles which also includes the biomes and dangers they are suitable for and a concise strategy for the first year. (doing one layout for them and reusing that).

Two more important pages:
4) You Might Think That, But You're Wrong: [...]

Good ideas.

Also, add a note "v0.34.11" somewhere in a corner.

I will add that on the index/cover that i will add at some point.

I'm definitely looking forward to those, see if i can contribute. DF geology is pretty interesting - from my extremely rudimentary knowledge, i think it emulates real-world geology reasonably well where mineral types and layers are concerned, but distribution and frequencies are very non-realistic, likely because it's supposed to work in a mining/mineral exploitation game (it'd be a bit of a drag if 90% of sites were all non-economic stone).

Yes, it is quite realistic (especially relative to other games) with tradeoffs for gameplay.  Like many things are in DF.

[Bihlbo]

Most of my decisions about food and booze come down to value. For instance, if I'm planning on keeping stocked with 4 types of above-ground-plant-based booze, I'd like to know which ones will bring greater satisfaction among the dwarves. It would be nice if the crops page also included values. And on that page nothing is mentioned about how the quarry bush is unique in that it can produce multiple kinds of food; and nothing is mentioned about how booze can be used when making meals.

On the metals page I think I'd want to know what makes bismuth bronze different from bronze besides just the materials used to make it. Is it heavier, more valuable, more abundant, better for certain applications? Instead of just saying that non-military alloys are something you need to look up, why not include the most important information about them? What I want to know about those alloys is which ones are more valuable than the sum of their base metals. If the rest are the same or worse, I just won't make those alloys unless it's demanded. And I'd want to know that rare alloys and metals should be stocked in case they are demanded.

On the animals page you have a 0 in the column headers for things like Edible and Bones. That number doesn't mean anything when used like that. Maybe you were trying to say "number of bones", in which case you want to use the symbol for number: #. I think it would be more useful to replace "Milk is considered as food, not a drink. It won't be helpful if your dwarves are thirsty!" with "Thirsty dwarves will not drink milk, because it's food. Milk can be made into cheese or cooked into meals." However, I think you're better served with a whole page just for processing where the reader will be told that milk can only be gathered with buckets then stored in barrels, and that milk can be processed into cheese in the farmer's workshop, and both cheese and barreled milk can be used by a cook as ingredients in meals.

Managing meals is tough for a newb and that should probably be covered. Especially useful would be information on how to: avoid cooking all your booze; use up your abundant foodstuffs (seeds, tallow, eggs, etc) first; decide when to make each of the three types of meals; determine how many meals you should have on hand; how to stockpile for an efficient kitchen (though that's a more advanced topic).

[PanTheSatyr]

I updated the Compendium by adding a page about stone layers. (A page about stones itself is still planned)


@Bihlbo

That was a good critique.

And on that page nothing is mentioned about how the quarry bush is unique in that it can produce multiple kinds of food; and nothing is mentioned about how booze can be used when making meals.

Industry flowcharts are already planned and they will include such informations.

Including all these informations in the crop page would probably make that page heavy to read. My intention with the crop page was that you can design stockpiles with it, like having a stockpile next to your still that only accept brewable plants.

I will mention the value of products in the industry flowcharts.

On the metals page I think I'd want to know what makes bismuth bronze different from bronze besides just the materials used to make it.

I will add that. (they both don't differ beside the required materials)

Instead of just saying that non-military alloys are something you need to look up, why not include the most important information about them?

Okay, i will add a page about non military alloys.

On the animals page you have a 0 in the column headers for things like Edible and Bones.

You mean "⌀" ? It stands for arithmetic average (or diameter, depending on context).

The number of bones and meat animals offer depend on several factors (like their strength and age) so i used the average for each animal.

I used ⌀ instead of writing average because I lacked the space.

"Thirsty dwarves will not drink milk, because it's food. Milk can be made into cheese or cooked into meals."

You're right, it sounds better. I will replace that sentence.

However, I think you're better served with a whole page just for processing

That is planned.

[Larix]

Stone layers page - nice compact description of the main features. Perhaps add that aquifers most commonly appear in soil layers (any (?) type of soil other than the variants of clay), those are a very important issue for newer players.

Just to ease the editing process - i see a few typographical errors.
in the explanation of igneous extrusive:
- twice mis-spelled "igneos" (correct is "igneous")
- "Its quite hard to find flux[...]", missing an apostrophe, should be "It's".

igneous intrusive, last sentence
- "for military porpuses", typo in the last word, should be "purposes".

I'm undecided on whether full listings of the various decorative metals are really needed, they're a pretty obscure part of the game and almost never become important. The only decorative alloy of wider appeal is brass, because of its strong value increase over the constituent metals.
PS: but putting in extra notes for the various magma-proof materials - stones, glass and metals - would be quite valuable; e.g. nickel, while a low-value metal only used in one alloy of little interest, is magma-proof and can thus be used for blocks and pipes (in pumps), chains (in rollers) and minecarts without using up valuable iron/steel.

[PanTheSatyr]

Thanks, i will correct them tomorrow. And add note about aquifer for soil layers.

Perhaps add that aquifers most commonly appear in soil layers (any (?) type of soil other than the variants of clay), those are a very important issue for newer players.

I will add that when i correct the typos.

Also, I added Aquifers to pages i intend to do.

I'm undecided on whether full listings of the various decorative metals are really needed, they're a pretty obscure part of the game and almost never become important.

That was the reason i omitted them at first.

I guess I'll add them at some point for the sake of completeness, but it won't be of high priority for me.



Btw. i just uploaded a new page, this time the pro and contra of each melee weapon you can produce in fortress mode.

[Urist Da Vinci]

...
Btw. i just uploaded a new page, this time the pro and contra of each melee weapon you can produce in fortress mode.

Some of which are not true, and others which are not even wrong.

(I might help by posting my own sanitized list of pros/cons, if I find the time)

[PanTheSatyr]

Some of which are not true, and others which are not even wrong.

You mean not even right?

(I might help by posting my own sanitized list of pros/cons, if I find the time)

That would be nice.

I got my informations from an older thread (2011) and the magmawiki.

Edit:

I can't see what you mean. Most of the things i stated are supported by the magmawiki.

Source for my claim that blunt weapons are being less affected by their own material then edged weapons:

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Weapon#Combat_testing

All metals (beside adamantine) are at least considered good, only steel and silver being considered better. (platinum maces and hammers are artifacts).

The range for edged weapons instead goes from terrible, poor, good, better to best. So they are heavier affected by their material then blunt weapons.


My claim that blunt weapons are strong against heavy armored enemies is supported here:

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Weapon#Types_of_weapons

That paragraph also supports my claim that swords and axes are stronger against non armored, organic enemies.

And my claim that Spears are strong against armored but organic creatures is supported on the same paragraph and also here:

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Weapon#Types_of_targets
http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2012:Attack_types


My claim that swords are a bit better against armored enemies then axes comes from the fact they have a stab attack with a very small contact area (stab is an edged attack with a contact area of 50, spears have a contact area of 20, the smallest edged contact area of an axe is 40000) (see link above) and a thread that was linked on the magmawiki.


Edit:

This is my source for the claim that Axes have the lowest hitchance against good armor and that maces aren't affected by material.
The data for this excel table is not from me but said thread that was linked in the magmawiki. (Can't find the link right now)
That thread may be outdated (it was from 2011) but it corresponded with everything else that was stated in the magmawiki so i assumed its usable.

Its also the source for the claim that spears aren't as affected by their material then swords and axes are and that axes are a bit heavier affected then swords.

For example, look at the second column - copper armor - and compare axe with sword.

Hit chances for an Axe:

1

2

18

18

100

100

Hit chances for a Sword:

6

7

59

50

97

100

The sword has a generally higher chance to cause at least some damage and the difference between each material is drastic but less so then for the axe.
The axe however as a higher chance to deal heavier wounds when it hits so its preferable against enemies that have no chances to deflect or block attacks.

[ShadowHammer]

The compendium looks great. I really like that style of art that you used.

- "for military porpuses", typo in the last word, should be "purposes".

That's definitely debatable. He might have mean that if you are weaponizing porpoises then the information becomes relevant.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

shhh... Don't tell anyone that porpoises aren't in the game

[PanTheSatyr]

You made me chuckle.

I corrected the typos, changed a bit of text, moved things a bit and revised some graphics so they look less rough and wobbly.

[PDF urist master]

are foreign weapons planned? like whips or daggers? some foreign weapons behave very differently from native weapons.

also, I think slashing weapons, such as axes or swords, are the BEST weapons against creatures made of stone or metals inferior to the metal of the weapon. Most creatures made of stone and metal are inorganic and hammers will only chip it, dealing fairly little damage. axes and swords will sever limbs and body parts, making them the most effective weapons against such creatures.

[SixOfSpades]

More comments / suggestions. The page on stone layers looks brilliant!

A page on moods -- Yeah, it's been done to death, but no compendium would be complete without it. Possible discussion of "controlling" moods: Turning useless migrants into platinum warhammers just waiting to happen, forbidding materials to force a better price/quality, that kind of thing.

A page on mandates -- Avoiding nobles that issue bad ones, when & how to satisfy those you get, discussion of luxurious jail cells, giving a wiffle bat to the Captain of the Guard.

A page on Evil weather and its effects.

A page on blood -- Why rain both creates & destroys it, where dwarves will (and won't) clean it up, how to get rid of it, & why it's important to do so before it spirals out of control. If you think, "Ah, that's just an aesthetic point, my fort looks cooler covered in blood anyway," just replace the word "blood" with "syndrome-inducing Forgotten Beast extract" and you'll see why you should have practiced when it was just blood. Discussion of wells (and keeping them clean), Dwarven Bathtubs, Dwarven Showers.

A page on save-scumming -- What it can & can't undo. Reloading a save made during a mood can change the resulting artifact, but not its name. Reloading a save made prior to a baby's birth will re-randomize everything about the baby. Reloading a save made after starting a new season will not change the dates that merchants, goblins, or megabeasts enter the map during that season, but it can change the positions from which they enter, the type of goblins (ambush vs. siege), and the specific megabeast.

Possibly, a page on self-imposed rules: Is it ethical to pretend that fire-breathing dragons cannot escape flimsy wooden cages? Is it an abuse to run a Dwarven Water Reactor to produce free energy from nothing? Are picks overpowered as weapons? Etc.

As PDF urist master says, daggers and especially whips are important to document, especially due to their amazing lethality (are whips fixed now?). Also, I'm surprised you left picks off your list of weapons, seeing as how they're practically the dwarven equivalent of a lightsaber.

[PanTheSatyr]

@PDF Urist Master

Yes, foreign weapons are planned after bows/bolts and armor + layering.

You may be right, it sounds plausible that steel or adamantine swords may be stronger then hammers against a forgotten beast made out of copper... Or even Iron?

The wiki only says that blunt weapons are better (in general? ) by collapsing them.

Has anyone tested that out in the arena?

@SixOfSpades

Good suggestions! Moods and noobles were already intended. I won't cover save scamming in detail.

I really like the idea to devote a page for ethics,  DF is a lot more fun when played without using exploits and seeing it as a sandbox.

[PanTheSatyr]

Also, I'm surprised you left picks off your list of weapons, seeing as how they're practically the dwarven equivalent of a lightsaber.

I haven't found any objective observations about how viable pickaxes are compared to other weapons, and the magmawiki wasn't helpful either, so....

I made some SCIENCE! to find out how pickaxes compare to any other fortress weapon.

EDIT: made a mistake while testing, see next post of me.

[PDF urist master]

it's kind of unfair to miners since even with skilled soldiers, the experience with weapons gives them a massive advantage over the miners (think dabbling vs skilled)

I think it's better to test it with dabbling weapon wielders as their level of skill is equivalent.

[Sutremaine]

Alternatively, you could edit pickaxes to use a skill that can be assigned in the arena.