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[someone12345]

Why did meph take out boots/ gloves/ clothing for invaders? I really like goblinite and think that the more you have, the better.

[Broken]

It generates a lot of clutter, decreasing FPS.

[Urist McTeellox]

I'd really love to add these back in, not for the goblinite aspect, but for balance reasons. I can have enemies arrive in full-mithril armour at my forts, where my best fighter is armed with nothing more than a pointy stick. However because the enemy forgot to bring shoes and gloves, I can still defeat them, because disabling a hand/foot is a *very* effective way to win a fight. I broke many sieges against steel-clad opponents by pelting them with wooden/bone arrows until I caught a hand or food.  On the flip side, my armourers were producing almost boots and gloves exclusively, since the rest we could scavenge from fallen foes.

If nothing else, I'd love to see this to be a configurable option.

~ T

[mahrgell]

If they are reintroduced, please combine it with those vanishing metals that were mentioned earlier in another thread. The amounts of looted metals are already quite high as it is right now due to the fact, that there are way more enemy races then in vanilla. (Hexxedgarish has 20-30 thieves per season... don't wanna know what happens when ambushes and sieges show up)
That would combine the prevention of clutter with making enemies less susceptible to those kinds of disabling strikes.

[Urist McTeellox]

Vanishing metals is an idea that I floated, but which I really need to sit down and nut out (or better still, have some fabulous DFHacker coder swoop in and write for us). It involves a bunch of DFHack coding, and while I think the idea is sound, DFHack still comes with a reasonably steep learning curve.

Hexxedgarish has 20-30 thieves per season

That's... I've never had anything like that.  I'm going to have to revisit the Hexx thread now.

~ T

[mahrgell]

about the thieves... I usually get about 6 of each race nowadays. Maybe it is because Hexxedgarish is quite low on value (only half a million) but has >100 dwarves? So no ambushes/sieges, but tons of thieves. Not sure how those thresholds exactly work.

edit: jinxed it... ambush

[Meph]

I can give invaders vanishing materials already. But I cant tell them: Make your gloves/boots from it, and not the breastplate/greave/helm/weapons. And they would vanish after 4 months, even if the guys are carrying them. Siege arrives, you wait 4 months, siege is naked. Yeah slaughterfest.

If I give them gloves and boots its 4 items per person, 100 man siege, 400 items. Thats a lot of hauling, pathfinding and extra metal bars.

If sieges are too easy, you can give all invading races combat skills in the GUI. You cant tell me that they cant dodge, when you give them level 10 in dodging.

[someone12345]

It generates a lot of clutter, decreasing FPS.

Yes, but you can sell it to the caravan, melt it, or just give it to all of your dwarves so they can take care of minor threats personally without involving the the militia.

[shadowclasper]

I have to agree that even though it's an FPS issue. Invaders really should have full armor. Clothing is negotiable I guess...

[Urist McTeellox]

Just throwing in my agreement here for invaders with full armour. I want my citizens to be able to use it, I want to be able to trade it, or I want the hassle of figuring out how to clean it up. I'm not flustered about FPS, and if clutter comes too much there's also DFHack's autodump to quickly remove things if I really want to get things manageable again.

Having said that, I know this won't be for everyone, so I'd be delighted if this was a configurable option in the GUI. It's not like MW doesn't already give us lots of options on things we can switch on and off.

Just to check, at a raw level is this just a case of adding 'SHOES:ITEM_BLAH_BLAH:FORCED' and 'GLOVES:ITEM_BLAH_BLAH:FORCED' to the entity files? The reason I ask is that means I can apply local patches to my play branch, so my invaders can have full gear even if MW/SWP doesn't.

Many thanks!

~ T

[Meph]

Yes, its just these two lines.

Still more a friend of evaporating materials, natural armor and all that.

[Morrigi]

Could a checkbox be made in the UI?

Fully Armored Invaders: yes/no

Everyone's happy, no need to mess around with evaporating stuff.

[shadowclasper]

Why not just have it as a toggle like bunches of other stuff?

[Meph]

Yeah, thats possible.