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[Putnam]

I think hearing about it here would be the same as if we saw it?

[Araph]

I think hearing about it here would be the same as if we saw it?

Exactly.

[LordBucket]

Not attending the duel meant missing out on the screenshots. Which is not all bad, as I'd starting working on them and they were going to be terribly time consuming and tedious to make, which would have meant the episode being delayed an extra day or two.

[GlyphGryph]

3. Of course destruction won't become viable any time soon if we never train it! Why should we abandon it to grind weapons on mudcrabs when we've just got it? Why not just train magic on the mudrabs?

I think he meant we should train both - health AND magicka. So zap them, but let them beat us up a bit first, and fall back to weapons before time to sleep.

[Araph]

Go out into the swamps and become a master at destruction and all forms of combat by fighting mudcrabs for twenty years. Return to civilization and see what's changed.

But fo' reals, destruction and combat grinding time. Those mudcrabs aren't going to fight themselves.

[IronyOwl]

"Every one of us loses if Dagoth Ur comes to power."

Keep that in mind. I don't think there's a choice here.

Except that we know very little about this version's Dagoth Ur. If he/she's the incarnation of Princess Luna, that's going to throw things out of whack. If he's in league with Discord, that's going to throw things out of whack. If he's far more reasonable than some of our interpretations of him suggest, that's going to throw things out of whack.

Though personally, I don't think it's going to be a big deal in any case. We'll presumably have learned much more about him by the time we're in much of a position to be taking sides.

2. How do we know that they know each other? The only one who might be someone we know is the orc in daedric, and even then it's not certain.

Because they cheered her on, she went to them afterwards, and they left together? If there were five or six of them and none of them were the people we currently suspect to be ponies, that'd throw a wrench in the interpretation that they're the mane 6. Currently we have no reason to believe as much and a fair number of reasons to suspect otherwise.

3. Of course destruction won't become viable any time soon if we never train it! Why should we abandon it to grind weapons on mudcrabs when we've just got it? Why not just train magic on the mudrabs?

I think he meant we should train both - health AND magicka. So zap them, but let them beat us up a bit first, and fall back to weapons before time to sleep.

Spells don't work that way in vanilla Morrowind, and we've seen evidence to suggest that remains true here. Remember what Fast Eddie was doing when we met him? Remember what the guild guide said most other guides spent their money on? It's casting the spell that grants experience. Whether you cast it on thin air or mudcrabs or Dagoth Ur himself should all be identical.

...This doesn't make sense in the context of Morrowind, since it'd require two PCs, but hey; there are other things that don't fit with Morrowind already:

What would require two PCs?

About that orc in Daedric armor. Who do we know of who's associated with the color green and would have a reason to follow around and protect someone who bears a certain similarity to Rarity?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

...It's Spike, if I wasn't clear enough. The orc corresponds to Spike.

Fair suspicion. Awesomeicus fits the gender, though Rainbow Dash is certainly butch enough to roll a male character. He's less awesomeness-oriented than RB either, but I could see him being goofy enough for it.

Also, let's not get our jimmies rustled by not seeing the duel. We got a pretty darn eloquent description of it, which from our perspective is nearly the same as Michael actually seeing it.

I think hearing about it here would be the same as if we saw it?

We missed out on seeing Adorabella and her friends. That could have been massive. The number of them alone had the potential to tell us a great deal, to say nothing of being able to actually see each one, in most cases probably without armor obscuring their faces.

Don't even get me started on if we'd managed to talk to any of them about it, which I'll admit doesn't sound too likely.

Go out into the swamps and become a master at destruction and all forms of combat by fighting mudcrabs for twenty years. Return to civilization and see what's changed.

But fo' reals, destruction and combat grinding time. Those mudcrabs aren't going to fight themselves.

Still gotta figure out where. I'd tentatively suggest warping back to Balmora, then meandering from there to Pelagiad, fighting anything we think we can take along the way (meaning rats, kwama foragers, and maybe nix hounds) and fleeing to the nearest strong person for anything we can't (cliff racers, kagouti, alits). Also collecting alchemy reagents because why not.

Note that this is largely because I believe, but am not at all certain of, the notion that the things around Pelagiad tend to be fairly weak, that kagouti can spawn between there and Seyda Neen, and because I'm not familiar with the regions around Caldera at all.

Though actually, can we take rats on our own? We might not have much choice but to warp to Balmora and Silt Strider to Seyda Neen for some crab and kwama bludgeoning if not. But then where would we sleep to recover?

[The_Jester]

Unless I am remembering completely wrong, Seyda Neen does have an inn, Arille's Trade house has a room upstairs that you can rent. I do agree that we need to do some training of destruction, but we can't spend too much time on that.

As for the whole ponies thing, I can't really speak to it since I have no knowledge whatsoever of MLP, but it seems plausible that they are at least the inspiration for our "PC" characters, although I think it is taking it too far to try to see ponies in Dagoth Ur, or Vivec, or other NPC's. We haven't seen any evidence of that kind of crossover.

So if we are agreed that Dagoth Ur needs to be defeated, shouldn't that be our eventual goal? Which means, at the least, we need to reclaim Keening and Sunder. Probably Wraithguard too. From there, we actually have several awesome options. We could go the traditional route and Nerevarine or not, kill Dagoth Ur ourselves. We could also do the whole Prophet thing and throw our knowledge and support behind someone else, guiding them to either become the Nerevarine or just kill Dagoth Ur. We could also do something that Morrowind's game limitations didn't allow for but seems attractive and plausible here, we build an army. How badass would it be to roll into Red Mountain at the head of an army?

[syvarris]

Oh, dang it.  Destruction is redundant with our weapon skills.  I would have preferred... pretty much any other school.

At least we can raise magic-related stats, I guess.

Empty our magicka casting fleabite.  We don't actually need a target, right?  After that, go out and fight things.

[WillowLuman]

In vanilla Morrowind, you just have to cast the spell to get XP. If you really want to power level, the thing to do would be to make a custom 1pt on target fireball spell. That might not work here, but then again it might. Since it would use the same pattern as any other fireball, we'd still be practicing that pattern.

[GlyphGryph]

Thats a good point. We can ask for the cheapest spell they have - we can light candles or something with it, hah.

Instead of just killing random stuff outside balmora, we can also check if theres any new low level quests at the fighters guild as well. fighting things regularly and THEN draining our magicka before napping sounds good.

Dont we have to worry about stuff breaking though?

[IronyOwl]

Unless I am remembering completely wrong, Seyda Neen does have an inn, Arille's Trade house has a room upstairs that you can rent.

Doesn't appear so, at least in vanilla. A quick check back doesn't suggest he's offered or mentioned one to us in the past.

As for the whole ponies thing, I can't really speak to it since I have no knowledge whatsoever of MLP, but it seems plausible that they are at least the inspiration for our "PC" characters, although I think it is taking it too far to try to see ponies in Dagoth Ur, or Vivec, or other NPC's. We haven't seen any evidence of that kind of crossover.

We've seen suggestions of Celestia and possibly Luna, and more recently evidence that they may be working together. It certainly could be that the gang is getting together to follow their usual mentor's orders to defeat an entirely native threat, but it seems more likely that there'll be some kind of pony influence on the other side.

Particularly since that dream we had with the horse statues. Where there was a black and gold one, and the gold one was saying something about wanting to be friends? That sounds an awful lot like it could be a Morrowind interpretation of... I might not have mentioned that, or if I did it was a while ago.

Spoiler: MORE PONIES (click to show/hide)

So I mentioned that Celestia raises the sun and Luna raises the moon. I mentioned that Luna was indisposed so Celestia took over.

What I kind of forgot to mention, because I didn't want to blather ponies all over everyone and it didn't seem relevant to what I was trying to explain at the time, is that Luna became bitter and jealous of how everyone loved the day and just sort of slept through her night, attempted to drown the world in eternal darkness, and so was defeated and banished to the moon by her sister Celestia, where she remained imprisoned for a thousand years. She eventually broke free, was defeated/purified, apologized for that whole mess, and went back to being the mistress of night.

So yes, any indication that the sun and moon (or black and gold horse statues) aren't necessarily working together makes me wonder.

PPE: ...wait, it wasn't black and gold, it was silver and gold. Hrm...

Spoiler: Dreams So Far (click to show/hide)

You are standing on an open plain covered in lush, green grass. The wind blows through your hair, and the grass billows gently before you. You gaze at the sky and admire how the sun peeks tentatively though the silky clouds as if not wanting to disturb the scene, but casting the entire plain in a soothing warmth. Then...you hear something. A low, rumbling noise. Steady, and approaching. It sounds like a herd of buffalo. You turn towards the sound and feel the echoing rumble throughout your body when suddenly the first of the herd bursts into view over a nearby hill. But they're not buffalo. They're horses.

You smile as the herd approaches, changing direction to move towards you. Then, for a moment as they encircle and envelop you, you run with them.

You wake up laughing and give yourself a facepalm. You dreamt about ponies. Figures. The legion armor chestpiece has a pair of horses facing each other that kind of remind you of Celestia and Luna, minus wings and horns. You've been staring at Strillian for most of the past week of instruction. No wonder you'd dream about ponies. Anyway, pleasant respite though it was, you were kind of hoping for something more informational. On the bright side, at least you know you're not a vampire or a werewolf, and presumably the Dark Brotherhood isn't after you yet. And since you didn't dream about the Sixth House or Dagoth Ur, it's possible that might mean that the main quest hasn't been started yet. Or it might just mean that you're not the Nerevarine and therefore you're not eligible to receive useful dreams.

You get up and see that the holes in your legs have completely healed. It's kind of creepy.

You are standing knee deep in swamp water, with trees and shrubs all around you. In front of you but not facing you is a silver statue of a rearing horse that you recognize immediately: it's the horse on the right breast of the Imperial Legion guard armor. You step forward to inspect it more closely, but before you can get close enough to touch it a number of blurry and indistinct shapes rise from the swamp all around you. It's difficult to make out what they're supposed to be, or even how many there are. Then, suddenly one of them moves impossibly fast in no particular direction and the entire world slows to a stop.

Your eyes are suddenly filled with a blinding light that compels you to cover them, but doing so doesn't stop the light from reaching your eyes. Instinctively you know that the light is permeating not only your hand and eyes, but all of you. Every fiber of your being. Every cell in your body, every thought in your mind, everything that exists in your soul...it can see. With eye cover doing nothing to stop the light, you force your eyes open and turn to see a gold statue you hadn't noticed before. It is behind you, facing and mirroring the silver statue. It appears to be the horse from the left breast of the guard armor, and it's definitely the source of the light that permeates everything. You cautiously approach only to hear a faint sound, a voice. It says '...would like for us to be friends...'

And then you realize that the statue is not made of gold. It is wearing gold armor.



You wake up drenched in warm sweat.

You are walking through a town, with wooden and stone buildings all around you but no people besides yourself. In the distance you see a massive set of scales in the shape of a woman dressed in white, with outstretched arms hanging from the sky and a bright yellow and orange sun on one side and a white, pockmarked crescent moon on the other. Curious, you approach. For several minutes you walk in the direction of the celestial scales, but they don't appear to be getting any closer.

Suddenly the crescent moon bounds from its side of the scale and towards you, causing the side with the sun not to fall down, but to rise up into the sky where it blazes with blinding light. You hold a hand over your face to keep from being blinded but the light passes through your hand as easily as through the air, and you see that your hand is made of the same light as that passes through it. The moon, never stopping, bounces towards you and pierces your chest with the pointy end of its crescent, passing cleanly through your body and leaving a gaping hole.

You then watch as light from the sun fills the hole in your chest and restores the flesh as if you'd never been injured at all. You anticipate a sense of deja vu, but it never comes.

You are walking through a town, with wooden and stone buildings all around you but no people besides yourself. In the distance you see-

You put a hand on the restored bit of your arm that was a bloodied hole when you went to sleep. You feel like you should be creeped out, but you're not. You feel at peace, as if everything in the whole world is going to be ok. You feel happy. Joyful. You feel...loved? You feel like you're going to-

Confused and disoriented, but smiling, you wipe the stray tears from your face and stand up to look around.

I'll probably have to think on this more, but the fact that the last dream had such an impact on us seems to confirm that at least one of them was more than a normal dream.

In vanilla Morrowind, you just have to cast the spell to get XP. If you really want to power level, the thing to do would be to make a custom 1pt on target fireball spell. That might not work here, but then again it might. Since it would use the same pattern as any other fireball, we'd still be practicing that pattern.

Thats a good point. We can ask for the cheapest spell they have - we can light candles or something with it, hah.

Instead of just killing random stuff outside balmora, we can also check if theres any new low level quests at the fighters guild as well. fighting things regularly and THEN draining our magicka before napping sounds good.

Fleabite is a 1 magicka destruction spell that we know.

Dont we have to worry about stuff breaking though?

We do, but raising armorer will be useful in the future and good for our attributes anyway. We might want to buy some tongs or whatever if we were going to Seyda Neen, but most other grind spots are pretty close to shops.

Speaking of which, our viperblade will probably be excessive for mudcrabs. Against them in particular, we'd probably want to fistfight them down while they chew softly on our armor. Rats and kwama foragers we'll probably want to fight normally, and most other things probably require desperate shankings or fleeing in terror.

[The_Jester]

Unless I am remembering completely wrong, Seyda Neen does have an inn, Arille's Trade house has a room upstairs that you can rent.

Doesn't appear so, at least in vanilla. A quick check back doesn't suggest he's offered or mentioned one to us in the past.

I guess I remembered wrong then. I don't know where I got that from.

[MonkeyHead]

Oh god no, not ponies....

Anyway, I don't know if anyone has suggested this (too much to check back through), but what would happen if we killed a plot-centric NPC? Not that we are capable of such things yet, but in the vanilla game you get the "broken prophecy" message. What is the equivalent here? Would we doom the world, or get a reset?

[IronyOwl]

I guess I remembered wrong then. I don't know where I got that from.

It looks like an inn, and it's sort of the only service hub in that town, so I can see how you'd get mixed up. It's also, let's face it, a bit odd that a town of that size and (at least initial) importance doesn't have one.

Oh god no, not ponies....

Anyway, I don't know if anyone has suggested this (too much to check back through), but what would happen if we killed a plot-centric NPC? Not that we are capable of such things yet, but in the vanilla game you get the "broken prophecy" message. What is the equivalent here? Would we doom the world, or get a reset?

Interesting second-best-thing might be tracking down people we know to be essential and checking them for Azura's Mark. Except I'm not even sure if that's one of the ones we recognize, so...

One other issue in a long list of issues with murdering essential NPCs is that they cease being essential once they've fulfilled their purpose. Given how advanced we seem to be in the main quest, and given how badly we may have mucked it up, I suspect it'd be pretty easy to kill a target, have nothing happen, and be left with no idea why.


Actually, here's an interesting thought exercise. Essential NPCs give you the message if they're killed in game. But in game, there's no way for them to be unable to fulfill their purpose except for killing them. Here, that might not be the case. If we convinced Fyr to go on a plane trip for four months, would that ruin everything? If we'd locked Caius in a dungeon where he couldn't do spy things, would that have an impact? If we convinced some other random person to stop obsessing over the Dwemer or close down their potion shop or just refuse to offer quests to adventurers, would any of that have a similar impact to just murdering them?

Sadly, it's probably not really any more testable, but-

Wait. That could potentially be exactly what happened, couldn't it? Lemme see... hm. The reset when we were talking to Caius happened after we gave a big speech about how Dagoth Ur was going to kill everything or turn them into insane corprus monsters, and then we gave a much shorter version of the same answer.

It's possible that made all the difference, but I don't see why convincing Caius that we were on his side would have broken the chain of prophecy. Back to untestable, I suppose.

[The_Jester]

I don't think the main quest is really going to work the same way here. For example, Caius seems to have skipped over a lot of the initial information gathering steps, possibly because Michael shared a lot of that information with him already.

As for the Seyda Neen sleeping thing, sometimes I forget we are in the legion. I bet if we showed up at the Census and Excise office and told them we are on special assignment, they would let us use the bed in the basement.