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[Bdthemag]

tl;dr asimov isn't actually a very good lawset.

It isn't supposed to be. If the AI started with a set of rules that were completely airtight, and didn't allow the AI to have some degree of freedom with then both playing and having an AI would be boring.

[andrea]

I just had my most successful traitor round ever

had to steal a captain jumpsuit, then escape alone.
I am soon discovered with an emag by the AI, but I convince the captain that I just found it.
I play the good guy for a while, then I get the captain to come on the asteroid. just before he arrives I cut off comms ( with a second emag) , I stun him with a paralyzer pen, steal jumpsuit and ID, then throw him in space.

now, I rush in captain's quarters, and modify my ID then I order a weapons crate, and stock up on weapons. and then, I disable comms, before anyone knows anything happened to captain.
and so I begin culling the crew. the HoS alone stands up to me. reactivating comms and hunting me.
Luckily, I meet him just after trying to sabotage comms again, and I stun him and kill him. Then, I could finally call shuttle unopposed, and escape alone.

[USEC_OFFICER]

tl;dr asimov isn't actually a very good lawset.

It isn't supposed to be.

Yep. They were even acknowledged as so in the novels, and had robot psychologists running around unfreezing robots who had become stuck trying to balance their laws. Though Asimov tried to fix the three laws by adding a zeroth law: A robot may not harm humanity, or, by inaction, allow humanity to come to harm. It's... acknowledged as kinda metaphysical and open to interpretation in the novels.

[Aklyon]

Opinions on the other AI rule boards?

[BigD145]

Corporate
Law 3: The crew are cheap to replace.

But, they are needed to run expensive machinery until the next shuttle arrives. Unless things are going poorly, a late arrival could easily replace bad crew.

[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

   I will have you know they are not cheap to replace, after all you have to ship them to the station and thats a magnitude more then their actual worth so while as a unit they are cheap the replacement is not.

[USEC_OFFICER]

Corporate
Law 3: The crew are cheap to replace.

Yeah, pretty much. I'd fully expect a Corporate AI to start bumping off the crew halfway through the round. The station is more expensive to replace than the crew, after all. Tyrant isn't much better. Once the heads lose respect in the eyes of the AI, then it should assume tyrannical control over the station.

   I will have you know they are not cheap to replace, after all you have to ship them to the station and thats a magnitude more then their actual worth so while as a unit they are cheap the replacement is not.

Actually they appear to be teleported onto the shuttle, and power is obviously cheap in the future. Still more expensive than the person they're teleporting though.

[Chiefwaffles]

You have to include training for any vaguely important people, benefits, pay, their personal equipment, etc.
The crew is still by far the cheapest in my opinion, though. Just not "consumable" cheap.

[Bdthemag]

Now, those special preset ai upload boards are a different matter. If you ever get uploaded with one of them, I suggest you just go with a direction you'd like roleplaying-wise, and make it fun for everyone. Sure, you can just kill everyone because technically your law allows it, but it'd be much more fun and memorable if you adapted the laws in a way that is interesting and fun for everyone else. I'd rather have an AI with a PALADIN module who pretends to be a paladin of pelor, than someone who uses the lack of strict laws to fuck around and kill everyone just because their laws were a tad bit loose.

[wlerin]

You have to include training for any vaguely important people, benefits, pay, their personal equipment, etc.
The crew is still by far the cheapest in my opinion, though. Just not "consumable" cheap.

Cheap for the corporation I suppose. But that's only because the personnel are on loan (from themselves), while the equipment belongs to the company. Most of the expenses involved in creating the crew, aside from some training and the expenses of locating skilled individuals, are borne by society, humanity, and the universe (esp. inhabited worlds) rather than the corporation. And then there's payroll.

If the AI was considering their actual worth, vs. most of the tech in the game, they'd come out ahead.


Also... iirc building a new AI can include installing an MMI with a brain attached. So the AI on station are themselves human, or were human. So every human on board is a potential replacement for the AI... so... um... yeah.

Of course the AI laws don't mention any of this.

[Akhier the Dragon hearted]

   I think that since you appear in an arrival shuttle vehicle thing you are not porting on but instead being abstracted away as arriving on a shuttle. Basically crew are cheap enough that if your already getting a shuttle delivery then its alright to let a few die. Of course on the upside it means that it is more cost effective to kill a few rather then just one.

[Glloyd]

The God Emperor of Mankind shall live on!

[Itnetlolor]

The God Emperor of Mankind shall live on!

I could have had a shot at taking you down, had my crappy internet service not crapped out on me just as we were finishing preparations. And no, no strikes have been delivered either, as far as I know.

[Fayrik]

tl;dr asimov isn't actually a very good lawset.

It isn't supposed to be. If the AI started with a set of rules that were completely airtight, and didn't allow the AI to have some degree of freedom with then both playing and having an AI would be boring.

Yeah, but Asimov is very restrictive too, in that it's wording isn't very misenterpretable.

I quite liked playing Paladin, and look forward to trying out Tyrant or Corporate. (I imagine that the latter two would be good in case of a revolution round.)

I think perhaps in the cases that there are AI, the captain should put serious thought into how he can best utilize that "computer". I'd say in nearly all of the situations I can think of, Asimov's laws are the least helpful.

The God Emperor of Mankind shall live on!

Really? On a ship with no hardsuits and no air? I don't see how that's going to happen.

[wlerin]

The God Emperor of Mankind shall live on!

Really? On a ship with no hardsuits and no air? I don't see how that's going to happen.

I don't know about this God Emperor, but the Dune one didn't really need air or hardsuits. And the 40k one stopped being alive a long time ago.

edit: Ah, he's just an augmented human. Nevermind then.