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Author Topic: Sheb's European Megathread: Remove Feta!  (Read 1751391 times)

martinuzz

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15645 on: March 27, 2015, 04:22:43 am »

Apparently the pilot had suffered from heavy depressions and anxiety attacks before. He had to break up his aviation studies for it, and also during his flight career he had already been sent on medical leave.

Police announced they found 'something important' while searching his parents' house. Speculation in the media thinks it's a goodbye letter.
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http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=73719.msg1830479#msg1830479

Morrigi

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15646 on: March 27, 2015, 05:40:38 am »

...
Ok, let me rephrase: Putin wants to lead a superpower. Being a superpower is the aspect of the USSR that Putin is most interested in. He is a fan of that part. The other parts vary: some of them come with the territory and are embraced (an abrasive attitude in world affairs), others are incidental (like communism) and will be left behind.
But being a superpower without having a strong economical and political system behind you is impossible. Current Russia cannot physically be a world's superpower. Without communism or any other strong ideology, this is not possible. I don't believe that Putin doesn't know that.
Orthodox Christianity might do it.
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15647 on: March 27, 2015, 06:53:55 am »

Hope.... Putin's problem that there are no single ideology universally popular in Russia.

Yes, Orthodox Christiaity has some weight, Islam has some weight , communism has some weight, white racism has some weight, pan-slavism has some weight, imperialism has some weight, WW2-victory "religion" has some weight, Western consumerism has some weigh and even liberalism has some weight.

Brain of average Russian has few of those mixed together forming nation-wide cognitive dissonance(s)

But even if one of those would win. I know no examples in history when old ideology built a new empire.
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Sergarr

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15648 on: March 27, 2015, 07:03:53 am »

...
Ok, let me rephrase: Putin wants to lead a superpower. Being a superpower is the aspect of the USSR that Putin is most interested in. He is a fan of that part. The other parts vary: some of them come with the territory and are embraced (an abrasive attitude in world affairs), others are incidental (like communism) and will be left behind.
But being a superpower without having a strong economical and political system behind you is impossible. Current Russia cannot physically be a world's superpower. Without communism or any other strong ideology, this is not possible. I don't believe that Putin doesn't know that.
Orthodox Christianity might do it.
It's absolutely not strong enough in Russia for that. It's also not a religion suited for world's domination, more for defensive purposes.

We need something new, something completely different from all the religions and ideologies of before, something which would use all the available knowledge to humanity and all the available information-processing instruments for maximum benefit to the society and its people.
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Ukrainian Ranger

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15649 on: March 27, 2015, 08:25:35 am »

You understand that such new ideologies can take power only after a major war, right?
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smjjames

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15650 on: March 27, 2015, 09:05:23 am »

You understand that such new ideologies can take power only after a major war, right?

Uh, no, take Christianity for example, it didn't take a major war to take power, but just sort of slowly grew.

Anyways, on that germanwings flight crash, the co-pilot apparently had some sort of medical illness which he hid from his employer. Just what though, I have no idea. In fact, the guy wasn't even medically fit to fly, but he tore up the medical notices and flew anyway.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/27/europe/france-germanwings-plane-crash-main/index.html
« Last Edit: March 27, 2015, 09:09:50 am by smjjames »
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wobbly

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15651 on: March 27, 2015, 09:42:56 am »

...
Ok, let me rephrase: Putin wants to lead a superpower. Being a superpower is the aspect of the USSR that Putin is most interested in. He is a fan of that part. The other parts vary: some of them come with the territory and are embraced (an abrasive attitude in world affairs), others are incidental (like communism) and will be left behind.
But being a superpower without having a strong economical and political system behind you is impossible. Current Russia cannot physically be a world's superpower. Without communism or any other strong ideology, this is not possible. I don't believe that Putin doesn't know that.
Orthodox Christianity might do it.
It's absolutely not strong enough in Russia for that. It's also not a religion suited for world's domination, more for defensive purposes.

We need something new, something completely different from all the religions and ideologies of before, something which would use all the available knowledge to humanity and all the available information-processing instruments for maximum benefit to the society and its people.

It seems to me if you're after the "maximum benefit to the society and its people", it's best not to become a superpower in the first place. Nothing I know about the U.S. makes it seem like a good place to live if you happen to be poor/disadvantaged or part of a minority. I certainly wouldn't like to have been borne in the USSR, and China is hardly a prime example of human rights. I'm quite glad I live in an "unimportant" country.
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Helgoland

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15652 on: March 27, 2015, 11:15:45 am »

But being a superpower without having a strong economical and political system behind you is impossible. Current Russia cannot physically be a world's superpower.
It might not be capable of being a superpower - now or ever -, but that won't necessarily stop Putin from trying. Napoleon, Wilhelm II, that one Austrian private... It was clear from the beginning that they could not achieve what they wanted, but they tried nonetheless.
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Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

Sergarr

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15653 on: March 27, 2015, 11:31:00 am »

But being a superpower without having a strong economical and political system behind you is impossible. Current Russia cannot physically be a world's superpower.
It might not be capable of being a superpower - now or ever -, but that won't necessarily stop Putin from trying. Napoleon, Wilhelm II, that one Austrian private... It was clear from the beginning that they could not achieve what they wanted, but they tried nonetheless.
Napoleon was pretty darn close, though. I mean, if he had managed to defeat and vassalize Russia, the only real opponents left would be Britain and USA. He also had a really powerful ideology behind him, the French Revolution one.

But being a world's superpower through military means is not a really good way. USA achieved that status mostly through economical means, and was much more successful.
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mainiac

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15654 on: March 27, 2015, 11:37:16 am »

US achieved superpower status post industrial revolution.  Napoleon was just before the industrial revolution when military was the only way of being a superpower.
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smjjames

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15655 on: March 27, 2015, 11:47:09 am »

US achieved superpower status post industrial revolution.  Napoleon was just before the industrial revolution when military was the only way of being a superpower.

Not neccesarily the only way. Venice was a trading powerhouse (not sure about superpower status though) during its heyday. Though I'm sure they had plenty of naval muscle power to back that up.
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scrdest

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15656 on: March 27, 2015, 11:53:30 am »

that one Austrian private...
*cough*Gefreiter*cough*
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mainiac

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15657 on: March 27, 2015, 12:00:56 pm »

US achieved superpower status post industrial revolution.  Napoleon was just before the industrial revolution when military was the only way of being a superpower.

Not neccesarily the only way. Venice was a trading powerhouse (not sure about superpower status though) during its heyday. Though I'm sure they had plenty of naval muscle power to back that up.

1) They weren't a superpower
2) Their power came from the military
3) If you want the Italian city state that primarily used economic means it would be Florence whose banking ties far exceeded their military reach.
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« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
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Helgoland

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15658 on: March 27, 2015, 12:06:21 pm »

that one Austrian private...
*cough*Gefreiter*cough*
Aren't those the same thing?
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Arguably he's already a progressive, just one in the style of an enlightened Kaiser.
I'm going to do the smart thing here and disengage. This isn't a hill I paticularly care to die on.

misko27

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Re: Sheb's European Politics Megathread
« Reply #15659 on: March 27, 2015, 12:26:46 pm »

Stop throwing around the word superpower so much guys. It does not just mean "Strong like bull/bear/eagle/tiger". It means a certain sense of dominating influence in world affairs. It's not just enough to punch in above your weight, you need to punch in above everyone else's weight.
Napoleon was pretty darn close, though. I mean, if he had managed to defeat and vassalize Russia, the only real opponents left would be Britain and USA. He also had a really powerful ideology behind him, the French Revolution one.
No. America was no opponent. America bought Louisiana off Napoleon and was pretty happy with that outcome. America had no dog in that fight, but did war with Britain briefly.
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