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[LordSlowpoke]

eh, if it does collapse it's only going to make china stronger

honestly you're fucked either way, except instead of annexing your land they'll buy it out wholesale and grow wheat there

[BlindKitty]

Hearing about Germany's 'historic responsibility' makes me shiver a little actually. There is plenty of land in Poland, for example, that Germany might have 'historic responsibility' to protect once shit hits the fan. Like the USSR had the 'historic responsibility' to be the guardian of stability in so-called Western Ukraine and Western Belarus. In 1939. It just sounds wrong to hear they feel responsible for stability anywhere outside of their own borders.

But hey, maybe I'm just prejudiced because people like Heinz Reinefarth were never tried in Germany after killing my grandparents during massive, massive war-crimes?

Also, China is much better than Russia as far as I'm concerned. For starters, they will need a lot of time to take over Asia, and leave us alone. Probably for so long that Muslims will take over Europe sooner than China, so there is no much threat from there.

[Sergarr]

Oh god my sides, yeah Merkel's taking a stand and is going to economically nuke Russia.

Economically nuke = Full oil and natural gas embargo. I think we will see something milder

Russian economy is going to a collapse with a happy "chooo-chooo" sound already, but, IMO, it will take at the very least a year to get there. Not that my opinion matters I never understood that macroeconomics stuff

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/country-list/rating
S&P Rating:
RUSSIA    BBB-
UKRAINE  CCC
TE Rating:
Russia     54.81   STABLE
Ukraine    28.75   NEGATIVE

I'm pretty sure that means that Ukraine economy will collapse much, much faster than Russian economy.

[GreatJustice]

I wouldn't put much stock in the ratings agencies. I mean, they had subprime mortgage debt as being quite safe back in 2008, and they consider the US (a country with several trillion dollars debt and a deficit in the hundreds of billions) to have safer debt than China (the country that buys the US's debt), so take what they say with a small mountain of salt.

Anyhow, by the looks of things, things are headed for a repeat of 2008 in the near future barring some massive economic restructuring, and "trade wars" between Russia and Western Europe will only make that come sooner and be more painful for all involved.

[Sergarr]

The repeat of 2008? Seriously? The world economy hasn't even recovered yet from 2008 crisis!

[Sheb]

Depending on the metric you use and the economy you measure, it has.

Anyway, it seems kinda weird to claim Germany has an historical responsibility to protect stability. Maybe in the sense of "We fucked it so badly in the 30's that we feel like we must prevent such a mess happening again.

BlindKitty, can you elaborate on Muslims taking over Europe, or was that merely a terrible attempt at a joke?

[BlindKitty]

@Sheb

I call it, it is because of people like Owlbread that Europe will be conquered by Muslims.

Man, I love how no American or Western European forumite would ever get away with saying things like this, but when it comes from Russian nationalists it just glazes on over.

Just wondering whether I'm more Western European or Russian.

Also, I just found something interesting - about 20 minutes long video about the origins of WW II and a lot of interesting information about Polish involvement and losses in WW II. It has English captions, so it should be easy to understand for pretty much everybody.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHb-qIJTZ-M

[Sheb]

Oh, stupid joke then :p

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Oh god my sides, yeah Merkel's taking a stand and is going to economically nuke Russia.

Economically nuke = Full oil and natural gas embargo. I think we will see something milder

Russian economy is going to a collapse with a happy "chooo-chooo" sound already, but, IMO, it will take at the very least a year to get there. Not that my opinion matters I never understood that macroeconomics stuff

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/country-list/rating
S&P Rating:
RUSSIA    BBB-
UKRAINE  CCC
TE Rating:
Russia     54.81   STABLE
Ukraine    28.75   NEGATIVE

I'm pretty sure that means that Ukraine economy will collapse much, much faster than Russian economy.

Yep. Ukrainian economy is almost collapsed, tell me something I don't know
But I believe that for Ukraine there are a chance to change direction we are heading. Having no war in our country would help...

Whatever will happen, this autumn\winter is going to be very, very hard time for Ukraine. I hope that the winter will be mild...
 

[GreatJustice]

The repeat of 2008? Seriously? The world economy hasn't even recovered yet from 2008 crisis!

It has if you're a banker, a construction worker or a part time worker in a Western country

[Sheb]

Or Chinese.

[Loud Whispers]

I wouldn't put much stock in the ratings agencies. I mean, they had subprime mortgage debt as being quite safe back in 2008, and they consider the US (a country with several trillion dollars debt and a deficit in the hundreds of billions) to have safer debt than China (the country that buys the US's debt), so take what they say with a small mountain of salt.

The latter part is still true, US debt is best debt.

The repeat of 2008? Seriously? The world economy hasn't even recovered yet from 2008 crisis!

It has if you're a banker, a construction worker or a part time worker in a Western country

Yeah it's been half a decade and more since, many Western nations have recovered/surpassed pre-crash economies

[martinuzz]

Oh, stupid joke then :p

C'mon keep it a bit more civil in your own thread. No need to go calling BlindKitty's joke stupid just cause you didn't like it.
I liked it

On other news, a NATO high general stated, that from a military perspective, the war is lost for Kiev, and the best thing they can do is retreat all their forces to prevent more dead.
link: http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/ukraine-nato-haelt-niederlage-fuer-kiew-fuer-sicher-a-989308.html

[LordSlowpoke]

wow that's reassuring

thanks nato

[MarcAFK]

wow that's reassuring

thanks nato

Thanks Obama!

"We have been defeated. We are beaten; we have lost the battle." Thanks Président Raynaud.