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[Darvi]

I think just about everyone except Switzerland and the dwarf countries across the world have at some time committed an atrocity. Big powers attract hungry autocrats.

Wha...? You're not going to let the Swiss off the hook of nazi collaboration, are you?!

And I think I've committed a bunch of crimes against humanity too...

[LordSlowpoke]

darvi confirmed for dwarf country

[Loud Whispers]

I think just about everyone except Switzerland and the dwarf countries across the world have at some time committed an atrocity. Big powers attract hungry autocrats.

Wha...? You're not going to let the Swiss off the hook of nazi collaboration, are you?!

No atrocities committed in their economic concessions, plus collaboration is an incredibly strong term which I don't think applies. The Swiss still shot down/forced down Luftwaffe planes that entered their airspace and captured whatever soldiers entered their lands. Which is ballsy when this is your country:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Dutchling]

Where's Luxembourg?

[Descan]

That big long country between France and Germany.

[ChairmanPoo]

Have you checked the Bergier Comission report? I've not read the whole thing, but they conclude that during WWII the Swiss did, in fact, maintain a cozy and collaborative relationship with the Axis, including, but not limited to, arms deals, financial benefits, and collaboration in nazi thefts, and provide lots of data for those in each of the relevant chapters.

[Loud Whispers]

Have you checked the Bergier Comission report? I've not read the whole thing, but they conclude that during WWII the Swiss did, in fact, maintain a cozy and collaborative relationship with the Axis, including, but not limited to, arms deals, financial benefits, and collaboration in nazi thefts, and provide lots of data for those in each of the relevant chapters.

All of its fuel and half of its food came from trade.
When you're surrounded by the Axis your choices are:

• Trade with Axis
• Starve
• Get invaded

It's hardly a cozy relationship when Hitler is your neighbour, your only neighbour and all encompassing neighbour. And again, no atrocities. Even the opposite - it was a haven for those fleeing the war.

[ChairmanPoo]

. Even the opposite - it was a haven for those fleeing the war.

Not quite true. There's also a very interesting chapter concerning Swiss policy towards refugees, the J stamp, and how those policies evolved during WW2.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

That big long country between France and Germany.

That's a river, Descan.

Anyway, the real controversy about Switzerland and the Nazis was that their government kept/kind-of-stole all the gold the Nazis laundered through them, much of which was taken from Holocaust victims, ranging from seized gold assets to melted down tooth fillings.

[scriver]

I think just about everyone except Switzerland and the dwarf countries across the world have at some time committed an atrocity. Big powers attract hungry autocrats.

Wha...? You're not going to let the Swiss off the hook of nazi collaboration, are you?!

No atrocities committed in their economic concessions, plus collaboration is an incredibly strong term which I don't think applies. The Swiss still shot down/forced down Luftwaffe planes that entered their airspace and captured whatever soldiers entered their lands. Which is ballsy when this is your country:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

That map shows Spain as neutral as well, which it may very well have been so militarily speaking, but when all things came around the Franco regime sure didn't have any trouble sending Jews and other "troublemakers" to Nazi concentration camps.

Sweden, likewise, doesn't exactly have clear conscience when it comes to collaboration with Nazi Germany, despite being "neutral" on paper.

[Guardian G.I.]

That map shows Spain as neutral as well, which it may very well have been so militarily speaking, but when all things came around the Franco regime sure didn't have any trouble sending Jews and other "troublemakers" to Nazi concentration camps.

Furthermore, Spanish volunteers fought on the Eastern Front on the side of Nazi Germany against the Soviet Union.

[ChairmanPoo]

The most die-hard fascists of them were even stuck around after Franco's regimee started to cut ties with Germany (not because of any moral qualms, mind you, Franco wasn't beyond racist massacres and slave labor it's just that by 1944 the nazis were obviously losing the war, so he bailed out)

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I've heard it said before that Franco was more of an traditional authoritarian than an actual fascist, so his lack of standing to the end with the Axis is hardly surprising.

[Owlbread]

Hearts of Iron is useful in the way it characterises guys like Franco as "Paternal Autocrat" rather than Fascist or National Socialist.

[ChairmanPoo]

IMO Franco's regimee, at least for the first 15 years or so, was fascist in pretty much all regards (later on they switched towards a more amorphous right-wing dictatorship, although they kept some fascist structures -like the so-called "vertical trade unions"- during the whole run). Franco himself, however, was a master bluffer whose major concern was the well-being of his own butt, so it's not at all surprising that he jumped ship at the last minute. It was neither the first bait-and-switch that he pulled, nor the last, and probably not even the biggest.