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Ted Cruz

7 (6.5%)

Rick Santorum

16 (14.8%)

Michelle Bachmann

13 (12%)

Chris Christie

23 (21.3%)

Rand Paul

49 (45.4%)

Total Members Voted: 107

[lue]

I'd really like to see the Republicans lose control of the House at this point, they seriously don't make me feel confident in their ability to run a government (at the very least, they've shown me they currently can't pick leaders who are able to keep things under control, what with a guy like Böhner* leading the House. I think he means well, he just seems ineffective at his job).

For what it's worth, if America had a multi-party system (read: something closer to parliamentary systems like the UK and Germany in terms of the voting system used), I'd be completely fine with some Tea Party existing (mainly because they'd never win big margins ). But extremism fairs very poorly in a two-party system. The only reason they're around is because of gerrymandering! Never fight a close election! (The problem is compounded when primaries are their only remaining threat, and those get threatened whenever someone isn't ideological enough.)

Well, to be fair, some of them did promise their constituents that they would shut down the government. So on the bright side of life, some politicians do keep their promises !

* Why yes, I think spelling and pronouncing his last name as Böhner is more correct and more fun .

[Helgoland]

Better get those emergency crops growing. Potato currency is best currency.

Dug over a vegetable patch yesterday - we'll be planting wine, though. But potatoes always remain an opportunity.

[Xantalos]

If only you guys could pull an Australia.

[Baffler]

Better get those emergency crops growing. Potato currency is best currency.

Dug over a vegetable patch yesterday - we'll be planting wine, though. But potatoes always remain an opportunity.

These guys are up with me.

Anywho, I still see this as a calculated, tactical brinkmanship. I don't think that they'll go all the way with this, surely they realize that a default on U.S debt would screw everyone over, up to and including themselves. The growing disquiet going on over this is just what they need though. They're hoping that it will reach such a fever pitch that the opposition will cave, because they sure look crazy enough to go through with it.

Where have we seen tactics like this before? It seems so oddly familiar...

[SalmonGod]

Within 36 hours they started getting violently mad whenever anyone asked them about why they shut down the government to stop Obamacare and started insisting the whole thing was about reducing government spending, because they seem to think the American populace have the memory of goldfish.

Unfortunately, I think the majority of Americans do have the political memory of goldfish.  I can't tell you how many times I've seen people, even on these very forums, be aware of the facts regarding an issue as it occurs.  Then only a year or two later completely forget those facts in favor of the nonsense falsehoods and deceptive reframings politicians and mainstream media repeats thousands of times.

Example: I've discussed Bradley Manning with hundreds of people who followed the content released from his leaks as Wikileaks, teamed with several established and reputable journalist organizations, trickled it out bit by bit over the course of almost a year.  Now just a couple years later, what do I catch most of those same people saying about him?  "He recklessly dumped a bunch of files on the internet!"

Just lastnight, I was at a restaurant, and the first thing I heard from a neighboring table as I sat down was "Oh, I didn't know Obamacare and the Affordable Care Act was the same thing..."  (and those people proceeded to be the most loud and obnoxious people in the room the entire time I was there)  These American stereotypes are alive and well in the flesh all over the place.

This pretty well sums up my political perspective at this point.  I don't have much hope for anything, regardless of whatever happens with the government shutdown/debt ceiling event.

[Xantalos]

ter·ror·ism 
/ˈterəˌrizəm/
Noun
The use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims

Not sure if what these guys are doing counts or not.

[Scelly9]

ter·ror·ism 
/ˈterəˌrizəm/
Noun
The use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims

Not sure if what these guys are doing counts or not.

I think it does. "If you don't do this, we'll shut down the government." Sounds like intimidation to me.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

This pretty well sums up my political perspective at this point.  I don't have much hope for anything, regardless of whatever happens with the government shutdown/debt ceiling event.

I figured you would be more Rise Against than Muse.

[SalmonGod]

This pretty well sums up my political perspective at this point.  I don't have much hope for anything, regardless of whatever happens with the government shutdown/debt ceiling event.

I figured you would be more Rise Against than Muse.

Not familiar with Rise Against, actually.  Muse's last album was really good, though.  A nice snapshot of the current cultural/political consciousness for anyone of my age and disposition.  I just wish they had gone for a more fully coherent and complete concept album, instead of a handful of political songs... and thrown in some more anger with more of Bellamy's older, more passionate vocals.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Not familiar with Rise Against, actually.

I am shocked beyond reason.

[SalmonGod]

Not familiar with Rise Against, actually.

I am shocked beyond reason.

This is more my style for raw, poetic bravado.  (I can tear your walls down with the beating of my heart)

I'm really not much for punk, to be honest... I appreciate it what it represents, but find that I can't really listen to it.  I prefer something better articulated, with more direction.

[misko27]

Regardless, Republicans already are losing.

Better get those emergency crops growing. Potato currency is best currency.

Dug over a vegetable patch yesterday - we'll be planting wine, though. But potatoes always remain an opportunity.

These guys are up with me.

Anywho, I still see this as a calculated, tactical brinkmanship. I don't think that they'll go all the way with this, surely they realize that a default on U.S debt would screw everyone over, up to and including themselves. The growing disquiet going on over this is just what they need though. They're hoping that it will reach such a fever pitch that the opposition will cave, because they sure look crazy enough to go through with it.

Where have we seen tactics like this before? It seems so oddly familiar...

The President and the Democrats have played a very good game of Dr. Strangelove Negotiating. They haven't threatened anything, they merely have warned. The difference is a threat stakes your word on something, a warning states you will do something regardless of whether you say it or not. "We will not negotiate with terrorists". They know that if they really do go over the cliff the The Tea Party is destroyed as a entity and republicans as a whole, and if the Tea Party concedes they win politically and survive econimically. Their position is quite strong here, and most people know it.


The Tea Party here is in the position of 1 hostage-taker with 1 hostage who's just heard over the mega-phone that the police will not negotiate. Their options are shoot the hostage, and lose the last leverage they have (leading to them being killed by the Police, or in this extended metaphor, being destroyed completely as a political movement) or surrendering. The only situation where they take a option other then surrender is where they hold some belief that they can win after shooting the hostage. They got away in the Sequestor, and they have been trying to play-down the consequences of the Shutdown, so this is a common thought amongst some of them. This is insane, and many others know this. One of the worst problems is that because of gerry-mandering, this risk doesn't apply to the people personally responsible, as the Tea Partiers are almost assured their seats. This is a question For Boehner, whose Speakership is a risk.


It's fair to say there won't be a republican in the White House at this rate, and they may actually manage to hand the Democrats total control in the 6th year of a Democratic president. Democrats know this.

[Loud Whispers]

ter·ror·ism 
/ˈterəˌrizəm/
Noun
The use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims

Not sure if what these guys are doing counts or not.

Personally I would like to go back in a world where terrorists were murderers, yobs and extremists. Terrorism is one of those words that gets people to do really stupid things that can't be undone, and its definition is broadened more and more with each passing event. Especially worrying taking into account all the clauses in the NDAA that allow the mobilization of the military, the military reservists, police, execution and detention of people without warrant and so forth.

[lue]

Perhaps we can coin a new word, for a less-severe kind of terrorism. Horrorism?

I think my current plan of action is to hope things end up well, and perhaps wish for a few firings in the House if miracles happen . (Worst case, we'd have to wait for Dems to take the House in 2014 to do said firings, assuming those Tea Partiers get re-elected.)

[Loud Whispers]

Perhaps we can coin a new word, for a less-severe kind of terrorism. Horrorism?

The issue with this of course is that both terror and horror are base, primal emotional responses to many things. I suppose it's odder if you pick any other such base emotion, like could you imagine a world where terrorism was replaced by euphorism? People jumping at shadows that excited or made people happy? They're downright unavoidable emotions.
There are more issues with "terrorism" too. It legitimizes partisans of the corrupt and the despot; and whether it be murderers, protesters or politicians - it makes no distinction. It incites fear, it is terrorism, hold no restraint and give no mercy.

Two words exist to generalize politics: Corrupt practice.
No new words need be coined.