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[Mephansteras]

This sounds fun. I'll have to try it out!

[Jonathan S. Fox]

I've got a general question for you programmers out there. I'm dabbling in the field myself (degree in computer science, but not actively programming for a career), and I was wondering how one even starts making a game like this, like what steps do you take to actually get this to a working state? I'm sure you can't just start coding then figure it all out later, especially making ascii-based games requiring tilesets etc. I'm just wondering what order you do things in, the steps needed to get something like this working, and things like that. I'd be interested in making little games like this as a side project, but I just have no idea where to start or anything. Assume I'm not completely dumbfounded by programming, I have some minor experience in Java/C++ and a little bit of python, I just wouldn't know how to get everything to work together, or how to implement save states, or even how to make the whole graphics portion of it.

Yeah, I would definitely be one to get it semi-working and then add stuff as I go. But I was more wondering along the lines of what exactly I need to do to get it working. I can code fine, but I have no idea on how to make it into a working exe or even where to start to actually have it do stuff. I can do logic and programming, but I don't know how to, say, make the whole game into a package that can be run and worked on, or even how to display anything graphically. I'm sure, using ZSS as an example, that I could do the actually gameplay elements like programming AI for zombies and stuff, but I don't know how to package it all together and get it to work, like I have no experience with compiling or anything like that.

A lot depends on what sort of game you want to build.

ZSS is written in Python using Libtcod (LIBrary for The Chronicles Of Doryen). A guy who goes by Jotaf wrote a pretty excellent tutorial for python+libtcod that walks you through the stuff you're feeling a little lost on -- it starts with installing libraries and software, copying files into a directory, then opens up a blank file and steps through coding it line by line. At every step, the reasoning and expected logic of the code is exhaustively explained. The tutorial steps through iteratively developing a game from the ground up, sometimes going back and revising things initially done in a quick and dirty manner to make them more flexible. It covers making a window, drawing to it, keyboard and mouse input, saving and loading, handling data internally, map generation, building to an exe file... it's pretty sweet.

Of course, it's making a generic roguelike. You won't end up with ZSS or anything with fancy graphics at the end. It does, however, provide a great tutorial for how to do what it does, and I stepped through this same tutorial when initially building the game. Though I hope you'd have trouble seeing the evidence -- I deviated wildly from the tutorial at every step, and used it mostly to answer the same sort of questions you had; "I can already build structures in the general sense, but how do I lay in the foundation/plumbing/electrical for this building I want to make?"

If you're looking for more graphics support than an ASCII game, you'll want to use a less specialized library than libtcod, and get help specific to that. You may need a bit of luck to find a similarly robust tutorial to the one I linked above, but there are still resources out there. For 2D things, there's SDL in C, SDL or SFML in C++, and PyGame in Python. Maybe Direct2D for Windows-only applications? I'm not sure for Java. In 3D I think you'll be looking at OpenGL or Direct3D, but I think if you're going for 3D you'll probably be better off going with something like Unity rather than trying to roll your own engine, because that gets complicated and you probably want to be making games, not writing graphics code. I don't have significant experience working directly with any of these libraries (though I have worked on teams where others did), so I don't have much commentary beyond that. I could tell you about graphics in Adobe Flash or Adobe AIR, but it doesn't sound like that's where you're looking.

[BoxOfAids]

Aha! That was the kind of thing I was looking for! Much appreciated, that'll do nicely for me. Yeah I'm basically just helpless as to getting started, but like you said, I'll probably be off deviating from their steps as well, writing my own stuff.

Many thanks!

[mainiac]

Hey fox, are you gonna keep working on this awesome project?

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Hey fox, are you gonna keep working on this awesome project?

Yes, I'm just being a lazy bum.

You can help me by advising me on what you feel would add the most to the game as a next feature.

[KaiserKlay]

I got some ideas:
 The Obvious Ones:
1. a skill/class system based on the books available to the survivors.
2. Character aging and death.
3. Agriculture.
4. Armor and weapon Crafting.
Next, some suggestions of my own:
1. a finite map made up of multiple sectors.
2. survivor factions that fight over the previously mentioned sectors.
3. Recycling destroyed vehicles/armor/weapons.
4. Needs other than food and water, specifically entertainment.
5. Limited loot for each sector, forcing you to either: A. recycle things you don't need. Or B. Move to a new city with different factions.
6. News/world events that affect the game.
Ex. "Over your salvaged radio you hear of national guardsmen being deployed near your area."
Or "Your constant broadcasts have attracted the attention of bandits."
Which would possibly lower zombie spawn rates and increase enemy human spawn rates respectively.
7. Skills being passed down over generations (assuming the player survives that long)

Welp, those are just my ideas, whether or not you use them is up to you.

[My Name is Immaterial]

I agree generally with the above, but I disagree with the class system suggestion. Personally, I think it would turn out to be a gimmick that doesn't add more than it restricts. The system in LCS is a great starting point.
I like the finite map, and traveling to other cities. I was instantly reminded of Organ Trail.

My suggestions for the short term:
1. Skill gains. If you can only add one thing, add this.
2. Agriculture and recruitment in the same package. Pretty simple.
3. Defenses and buildings, maybe with recycling of weapons. A first step could be a well as a counterpart to the farm.

[Glloyd]

Haha, Organ Trail. Still doesn't beat dying of dysentery. I do like the idea of traveling to different locations on a map, but mainly I'd like to see the outlines of features fleshed out. Such as the safe-house section, adding farming, utilities, defense, etc. Plus vehicles, which seem to be planned. Ways to find and recruit new survivors, perhaps by exploring those locations, and more interactions with the existing NPC's.

[mainiac]

Hey fox, are you gonna keep working on this awesome project?

Yes, I'm just being a lazy bum.

You can help me by advising me on what you feel would add the most to the game as a next feature.

I think there are two things that are pretty simple but would be good to do next:

1) Experience system.  I think LCS is a great inspiration here, higher levels give you a simple boost to stats, nice and simple.
2) A non combat site.  Just as an example of things to come.  Before I suggested an exchange where you could trade food for water or vice versa.

And you aren't a lazy bum, you are doing something awesome just as a hobby.

[Strife26]

I'd probably go with the non-combat site, especially if it came rolled up with farming and recruitment


And maybe an option to start distilling water? Heck if water doesn't seem to be pretty scarce if the group has more than a few people.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Tomorrow:

1. Skills and skill gains.
2. Assign people to jobs, starting with scavenging, which scrounges up food and water outside the activity of your main squad. Jobs only done when they're not already acting with your squad.
3. Ability to recruit survivors you meet, if you have room in your squad for them to come with you.

[mainiac]

YAY!

[Glloyd]

Awesome!

[Yannanth]

.

[mainiac]

If you sit around in this game you will starve, quickly.