Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

me

8 (16%)

me

2 (4%)

me

5 (10%)

help i'm trapped in a poll i don't know why i'm here i'm so scared someone please help

29 (58%)

me

6 (12%)

Total Members Voted: 50

[Tomcost]

It troubles me that the third boss is already stronger than all the Siblings except Oric and the Voice already.

It also troubles me, realizing that so far we have bypassed two bosses already, and recruited them to boot. Our luck may run out.

The first time was luck, the second one was "cleverness" (reading FFS' mind).

[flabort]

Just realized an error on my table and fixed it.
I had 2d6 (7) for 6 energy at 167% efficiency, as did GWG in his write up. It's actually 117%
But 7/6 = 1.166667; we both made the same mistake of reading that as 1.66667, so it looked a lot more efficient than it was.

Hope I don't draw in a retcon by saying this, but a more consistant version of the ability would be
Zap, 1d6 long, 3 mana
More zap, 2d6 long, 6 mana
Even more zap, 3d6 long, 9 mana

which would make the earlier abilities less efficient, and keep the later versions of the skill the same, but it would be linear growth.

[Tomcost]

The idea was to give these increases diminishing returns, not linear growth. Why there are diminishing returns? Because it takes less time. Imagine: if there were linear growths, what would you do: cast 1d6 3 turns in a row, or just cast 3 at the same time for the same cost as the three turns altenative?

[GreatWyrmGold]

Umm, I think that its not "adding", it's the total effect. You can choose to do 1, 2 or 3 d6 each time you cast it.

And the 10 sp cost is so that we don't abuse it. It doesn't matter if it is not efficient, it can one shoot each one of our party members (ignoring the fact that proxxy is inmune to elec damage)

If that is true, then:

The first level deals an average of 3.5 damage for a cost of 2 SP, for 1.75 dmg/SP
The second level deals an average of 10.5 damage for a cost of 8? SP, for 1.32 dmg/SP
The third level deals an average of 21 damage for a cost of 18? SP, for 1.67 dmg/SP
And that's just wonky.

Table time!

"Tier"	Dice	Cost	Efficiency	Total Dice	Total Cost	total efficiency
Zap	1d6 (3.5)	2	175%	1d6 (3.5)	2	175%
More Zap	2d6 (7)	6	117%	3d6 (10.5)	8	131%
Even More Zap	3d6 (10.5)	10	105%	4d6 (14)	12	117%
More + Even More	.	.	.	6d6 (21)	18	117%

And then I get back, see this, and wonder who did the math error.
Probably me, given that I was calculating in my head, but I'm not certain.

If we can do those 6d6, then we need to get three more MSP points for Proxxy. Fast.

I still think that it is not the way it works.

Agreed on both points.

It troubles me that the third boss is already stronger than all the Siblings except Oric and the Voice already.

It also troubles me, realizing that so far we have bypassed two bosses already, and recruited them to boot. Our luck may run out.

Why assume that things will change? Don't borrow worry when what little evidence we have suggests there will be none.

Just realized an error on my table and fixed it.
I had 2d6 (7) for 6 energy at 167% efficiency, as did GWG in his write up. It's actually 117%
But 7/6 = 1.166667; we both made the same mistake of reading that as 1.66667, so it looked a lot more efficient than it was.

You can't blame me--my display is hidden inside my head.

The idea was to give these increases diminishing returns, not linear growth. Why there are diminishing returns? Because it takes less time. Imagine: if there were linear growths, what would you do: cast 1d6 3 turns in a row, or just cast 3 at the same time for the same cost as the three turns altenative?

Precisely. My complaint was that it was inconsistently diminishing returns.

[freeformschooler]

The idea was to give these increases diminishing returns, not linear growth. Why there are diminishing returns? Because it takes less time. Imagine: if there were linear growths, what would you do: cast 1d6 3 turns in a row, or just cast 3 at the same time for the same cost as the three turns altenative?

Sorry to hop onto this as GM, but also consider this game mechanic anecdote: Proxxy loses more turns on average by casting the 1d6 version. Because when casting a spell that does 3d6 damage, if you hit, all dice are rolled. On the 1d6 version, if you miss once, you actually take four turns to do the same average damage as the 3d6 version.

The chance to lose turns with a single casting of the spell relative to the other options decreases as the damage dice increase, so that is also factored into the greatly-diminishing returns.

EDIT: I could be doing the calculations wrong, but it does look like it would require 2 failed attempts of the 1d6 turn spell to meet the efficiency of the 3d6 version. Then again... usually 1-2 failed castings is plenty enough time for a foe to reach Melee with Proxxy and give her a -4 to any further zaps.

As a clarification about the rules of the spell's menu: they're red, and they're all-or-nothing. So it's 2, 6 or 10.

[Tomcost]

Didin't consider the possibility of missing in that. Now it makes even more sense.

Also, did anyone pay atention to this?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

YOU are not the thief. The other one is the thief. You remember now. You cannot die here because the thief is going to live forever.

You cannot let the thief live forever.

May be an important point in the Why does Oric want the target dead? question...

[LordSlowpoke]

because oric is the thief

all shopkeepers are thieves, and oric is one of the shopkeepers

do you people even put thought into this

[GreatWyrmGold]

Maybe Cain will try to recruit us to kill Oric, and Oric doesn't want us to help Cain kill Oric or escape or whatever.

[Furtuka]

Or Cain will want to eat our and Proxxy's souls the moment he sees us. Since he finds siblings delicious and all that.

[Tomcost]

The important part of the thing I posted was "You cannot die here because the thief is going to live forever." This means that if the cycle involves us killing the siblings and then getting killed by Oric, it's all done to grant Oric immortality.

EDIT:
Also, on another topic, what does the sign read?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Furtuka]

Sub D#D1982
Exit Panel

[javierpwn]

Which is why I say SubDl's are ancient parts of the dungeon, possibly predating the arrival of Oric&Co.

[Furtuka]

We don't have much theorycragting on the ceiling eye yet do we?

[Tomcost]

Hmm, I dind't understand it very well, and sincerely, I hoped the name to say to which DL was this Sub-dungeon related. The eye clearly has something to do with Floe, the eye, but the exit panel sent us to DL2, which is odd. I wonder what would have happened if we had entered the panel when we were being chased by the searchbots. Would we have been sent back to that place?

[flame99]

Flirt with young Hellyfish in a not-at-all creepy manner.
Whew... Just spent about a week trying to read through the thread.