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[MaximumZero]

So, the best way that I've found to ask a girl out is to make like you're going to whisper into her ear and kiss her on the cheek (or neck, but that's way farther than you want to go right now. :3) If she goes, "Aww, how cute," you may be swinging and missing. Maybe. If she blushes and giggles, you've hit a homerun.

[martinuzz]

Sorry for the premature desillusion, but that stops working past 13 years

[MaximumZero]

That worked for me with my ladyfriend, who is 24, and I'm 29. So nyah.

[kaijyuu]

Continuing to avoid the issue can potentially end up leaving you somewhat adrift in a relational sense, and can lead directly to the friendzone if you aren't careful.

Must... hold... back... friendzone... rant...

Instead I guess I'll just say my current ladyfriend and I were friends for 8 years before stepping it up. "Friend" and "romantic partner" are not mutually exclusive.

[GlyphGryph]

No, but people don't like changing their framing, and it's hard for many people to move to the next level if they are unwilling to risk things as they are.

[kaijyuu]

it's hard for many people to move to the next level if they are unwilling to risk things as they are.

This I'll agree with. Again with my current ladyfriend, I avoided admitting my crush for ~4 years with the excuse "I don't want to screw things up and lose her as a friend too."

However, your regular "friendzone" explanation states that becoming friends somehow precludes becoming romantic partners. It's misidentifying the issue; the real issue is the other person just plain isn't interested, nor would they be if you asked before becoming full on friends.

[ivanthe8th]

This I'll agree with. Again with my current ladyfriend, I avoided admitting my crush for ~4 years with the excuse "I don't want to screw things up and lose her as a friend too."

However, your regular "friendzone" explanation states that becoming friends somehow precludes becoming romantic partners. It's misidentifying the issue; the real issue is the other person just plain isn't interested, nor would they be if you asked before becoming full on friends.

That's more along the lines of what I was meaning. It's not all that difficult for friends to become romantic partners, but for it to happen someone needs to just go ahead and say something. You're not magically going to go from "pals" to "lovers" without at least one straightforward conversation.

If you had one with your ladyfriend, congratulations. But, as GlyphGryph said it's easy to establish a frame of reference for a relationship that one party may feel reluctant to change. I'm in favor of honesty; if you honestly want a more serious relationship *right now* then say something *right now*.

[kaijyuu]

I'm in favor of honesty; if you honestly want a more serious relationship *right now* then say something *right now*.

* kaijyuu nods

Damn straight