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Poll

Predict the winner, yo.

Waterplouf, and the Submarine Eskimos
- 5 (13.5%)
Shadowgandor, and the Descendants of Giant Popsicles
- 0 (0%)
Boksi, and the Climate Change Deniers
- 4 (10.8%)
a1s, and the Recycled Italians
- 0 (0%)
Korbac, and the Japanese Porn Industry
- 12 (32.4%)
Il Palazzo, and the Dreamy Octopi
- 12 (32.4%)
Bluerobin, and the Power Metal Band
- 1 (2.7%)
EuchreJack, and the Best Judea
- 0 (0%)
Karlito, and the Animal Farm
- 3 (8.1%)

Total Members Voted: 37


Pages: 1 ... 19 20 [21] 22 23 ... 65

Author Topic: Dominions 3 Round 9  (Read 81928 times)

Il Palazzo

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #300 on: September 30, 2012, 05:05:04 am »

(damnit, time to roll out the meta artillery)
Perhaps this'll sound less objective coming from me, but I don't agree with this "LA Ermor, R'lyeh & Pangea need to be eliminated as fast as possible" sentiment. Yeah, their dominions kill population, but it's more of a liability for at least R'lyeh and Pangea(though Ermor needs forts too, not to mention a steady supply of corpses). With passing time we get less and less income, while being saddled with hordes of chaff units that in my case also need to eat. We still need to buy and pay upkeep for our mages,  you know.

As for the pop-killing dominion, it's very easy for other players to keep it at bay with your own, unless somebody was irresponsible enough to choose very low dom strength for their pretender. A temple near the border, a couple of cheap priests. That's all it takes.

So the longer you wait, the easier time you'll have, as the economies of R'lyeh and Pangea go down the drain.

But somebody, somewhere started the scare, wrote some opinion piece on some forum that caters to that primal fear inside every one of us. The fear of being taken out of the game without a fight, with some slowly incapacitating, passively acting trick that the pop-killing dominions fit so nicely.
And now people mindlessly keep on repeating the mantra, turning it into a self-reinforcing "common sense" that nobody even considers challenging.

I mean, what the hell? It's not like any of the three nations is so unbalanced that if you let it survive to the endgame then you're screwed. I saw a several thousand strong Ermor army being decimated by a few hundred Man archers. I saw games well into their eightieth turns with R'lyeh confined to their lakes and unable to become a threat for anybody.

These are just nations like any other. They have their strengths and weaknesses, and the popkill dominions are not the trump-all ace. These are merely there to give some flavour and perhaps help put all the LA nations on equal footing, what with every other LA nation having recruitables vastly superior to the dom summons of any of the three nations.

So when you are considering the decision to gang up on somebody, don't buy into the cheap, self-perpetuation mythos. Chose somebody you actualy feel threatened by. And most of all, don't start the game with a pre-set decision of eliminating some nation.

And finally, think of other players. When we chose to play Pangea, R'lyeh or Ermor, we want to have a go at actually playing, with all the diplomacy, power struggles and backstabbing it involves, and not being singled out from the start for no good reason but some ill-founded perception of a threat to people's views on how the game should and shouldn't be played, our feeble attempts at reasoning with the aggressors shot down without as much as a second thought. "Because you're Ermor/R'lyeh/Pangea" the only explanation given.
What you're all doing here, is basically saying that choosing any of the three nations is against the rules, and we should be kicked out for our crime of defying you.

Just think about it. Don't be a bully.
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Korbac

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #301 on: September 30, 2012, 05:58:27 am »

A good speech, with some relevant points. It's a bit of a gutter that nations do tend to try to band together on LA Ermor, R'yleh, and Pangaea, but that's a risk you should know you're taking when you play those nations.

One important factor not mentioned - If these nations exist into the lategame, all their territory becomes almost devoid of pop. This is usually kind of bad for them, too, but it creates a lot of difficulty for the nations trying to invade them. You must attack them with "need not eat" units, or else pack a bunch of nature mages specifically for the trip. Furthermore, there is no gold to be gained from these lands, and thus, very little reason to invade them, which can leave these countries free to snowball against nations' whose allies refuse to aid them. After all, what have they got to gain?

The point that you guys have less gold is true as time goes on, but by the stage in the game you're at that position you've transitioned mainly to summons for your commanders and freespawn for your footsoldiers, so it's not as important. And to be entirely honest, many players will be lower on gold than usual anyway, as hurricanes / earthquakes / famines etc. start flying.

(Sorry, Pazz. Nothing personal. :()

EDIT : Regardless of what I / others say, I'm pretty sure people will seek to use the wars of these countries for their own enrichment rather than getting rid of them early on, one of them will snowball and become really strong, and I will be smug in my grave. :P

DUB EDIT : Ermor isn't dead yet, are they?  :o If so, that's a mighty fast bumrush and that's a shame. :(
« Last Edit: September 30, 2012, 06:28:53 am by Korbac »
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Shadowgandor

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #302 on: September 30, 2012, 06:49:51 am »

The Ermor capital was near my only way out of my starting place. If I was to expand without having to build a row of temples along the side of his capital and heavily reinforce it with PD, or have my population die, I had to take it out.
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Karlito

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #303 on: September 30, 2012, 09:33:53 am »

Hell, anyone can have a population killing dominion, all it takes is one pick of the death scale.
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EuchreJack

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #304 on: September 30, 2012, 04:04:25 pm »

Very nice speech Il Palazzo.  So, the reason to eliminate LA R'lyeh is because Il Palazzo is commanding it, not because it's LA R'lyeh.   :P

I saw games well into their eightieth turns with R'lyeh confined to their lakes and unable to become a threat for anybody.
And that is another good reason to at least combat R'lyeh early.  It's no fun rooting them out of their lakes for the win.  Most nations really don't go underwater easily.

As for Pangea...did I mention the large army on my border?  I somehow doubt I'm going to be the attacker there.

One should also note that I have never said anything bad about Ermor.  Prior to the reboot, we even had a minor trade agreement, which somehow got lost in the restart.

Bluerobin

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #305 on: September 30, 2012, 05:32:42 pm »

It's true, Ermor's been nothing but friendly so far. I mean, it's a very large part of any Ermor strategy guide you see ("You probably won't be friends with anyone, but try anyway!") but it's nice to see the effort being made. It's always sad to see someone attacked this early, but we're halfway through the second year already, so there's been a good amount of time to do some building up and stuff.
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The moment the lever was pulled, somebody's pet kitten stepped onto the bridge. I read somewhere that if a cat falls more than 11 stories, it instinctively flares its legs out to increase air resistance. This slows it down enough to stick the landing with relatively minor injuries. In Dwarf Fortress, apparently, cats don't do that.

EuchreJack

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #306 on: September 30, 2012, 07:22:08 pm »

FYI, Midgard, Atlantis, and Abyssia need to submit their turns.  No pressure or anything, just that I've seen them active, so I thought I'd mention it, just in case they weren't aware.

Boksi

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #307 on: September 30, 2012, 07:36:28 pm »

I'll get it done eventually. In time for the deadline, at least.
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[BODY_DETAIL:NAIL:NAIL:NAIL]
[HAMMER:HAMMER:HAMMER]

[TSU_NOUN:nose]
[SUN_TSU_NOUN:art:war]

a1s

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #308 on: September 30, 2012, 08:45:20 pm »

The Ermor capital was near my only way out of my starting place.
Just FYI, that's not true. (70) and (83) are both connected to (101), and (70) is also connected to (59). Port maps are impossible to use without the "Neighbors" filter.

P.S. I was able to look up what Ermor's and R'lyeh's dominions do, but the wiki mentions nothing about Pangaea's. What is the risk there?
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I tried to play chess but two of my opponents were playing competitive checkers as a third person walked in with Game of Thrones in hand confused cause they thought this was the book club.

Karlito

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #309 on: September 30, 2012, 08:47:14 pm »

Same thing as yours basically, except mine is optional.
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a1s

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #310 on: September 30, 2012, 11:32:03 pm »

Optional and you don't even have it yet. So why is everyone out to get you? ???
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I tried to play chess but two of my opponents were playing competitive checkers as a third person walked in with Game of Thrones in hand confused cause they thought this was the book club.

Karlito

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #311 on: September 30, 2012, 11:57:57 pm »

I cast it two turns ago.
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Il Palazzo

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #312 on: October 01, 2012, 07:29:32 am »

Heh, looks like I won't be able to weasel my way out of this one.
Oh well. I did try, didn't I?
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a1s

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #313 on: October 01, 2012, 07:52:53 am »

Same thing as yours basically
Also, this is not true. The half life (time needed to decrease the population of a province in half) for a 10 candle Pangaean dominion is ~13 months. For a 10 candle Ermorian dominion it's 1 (and for half life to be 13 months it has to be about 1 candle). That's not even counting the Growth scales, which Pangaea is likely to have cranked up to 11 (in binary). Out of the 3 harmful dominions, Pangean seems the most pleasant for bystanders. In fact I'd prefer it over MA C'tis too.  :P
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I tried to play chess but two of my opponents were playing competitive checkers as a third person walked in with Game of Thrones in hand confused cause they thought this was the book club.

Bluerobin

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Re: Dominions 3 Round 9 - What a nice warhammer you've got there.
« Reply #314 on: October 01, 2012, 08:50:35 am »

Heh, looks like I won't be able to weasel my way out of this one.
Oh well. I did try, didn't I?
Valiant effort and you gave me something to think about, that's for sure.
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The moment the lever was pulled, somebody's pet kitten stepped onto the bridge. I read somewhere that if a cat falls more than 11 stories, it instinctively flares its legs out to increase air resistance. This slows it down enough to stick the landing with relatively minor injuries. In Dwarf Fortress, apparently, cats don't do that.
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