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[Darvi]

my opinion on these matters is not bigotry.

I don't think you get to make that judgement call.

[TD1]

my opinion on these matters is not bigotry.

I don't think you get to make that judgement call.

Fine then. Tell me, am I a bigoted asshole?

More than the norm, I mean.

[Bauglir]

Where did the 'this thread is a safe space' come from?

That was me misremembering OP, I don't think anybody else has used the phrase except to describe it as something desirable. Not worth arguing about unless penguinofhonor wants it to be something at stake, probably. We should probably move on.

[Angle]

Fine then. Tell me, am I a bigoted asshole?

More than the norm, I mean.

Well, that would require going over your opinions with a fine tooth comb. Which is probably more effort than any of us here really wish to put into things

I've always been under the impression that bigotry is about intolerance towards those who are different from oneself, though apparently wikipedia disagrees with me. Regardless of whether it's bigotry, though, I think that "Trans-people can't actually change their genders" is a rather mean thing to say, considering how important that is to most of them. You can be mean if you want, of course, but I don't have to put up with it if I don't want to.

[penguinofhonor]

.

[TD1]

Fine then. Tell me, am I a bigoted asshole?

More than the norm, I mean.

Well, that would require going over your opinions with a fine tooth comb. Which is probably more effort than any of us here really wish to put into things

I've always been under the impression that bigotry is about intolerance towards those who are different from oneself, though apparently wikipedia disagrees with me. Regardless of whether it's bigotry, though, I think that "Trans-people can't actually change their genders" is a rather mean thing to say, considering how important that is to most of them. You can be mean if you want, of course, but I don't have to put up with it if I don't want to.

In that case, I'm a big meany

Well, beats bigotry I guess.

In all seriousness, I am sorry if me saying that did offend anyone. I was mentioning it more as an example - I don't tend to bring it up, as it doesn't really matter how I view it. If someone has that view, and it makes them happy, then it gains me nothing arguing it.

I just disagree that the arguing is, in itself, bigotry.

[SirQuiamus]

But Penguin, you're also breaking the rules made by this this threads OP (even if that person is you), rule five specifically. That seems a bit hypocritical.

That rule is not a free ticket to say whatever you want. Bigotry is not allowed, and this is where I draw the line on transphobia.

Ugh...it's not...bigotry to state an opinion. It's bigotry to be intolerant to what somebody else thinks. I, for example, think gender is more than just a changeable label. Stating this isn't bigotry, it's just opinion. Were someone to say they prefer to be called she/he, then I would most certainly do so. That's not intolerance, just a differing view.

Crushing that view would be bigotry.

my opinion on these matters is not bigotry.

I don't think you get to make that judgement call.

Fine then. Tell me, am I a bigoted asshole?

More than the norm, I mean.

"Intolerance towards bigotry" is a mainstay of these kinds of arguments, and I feel tempted to give my two cents on that, although we really should be moving on by now.
Anyway, people should be judged according to their actions, not their identities, thoughts, or opinions. Having an opinion is not a deed, but publicly stating your opinion -- especially to those whom it may concern -- is most definitely a deed, a speech act of sorts. Now, everyone is bigoted towards some group or another, and being "tolerant" is little more than simply being mindful of the fact that words matter. No-one can keep that in mind constantly, and that's why we often act like bigoted assholes, but it isn't possible to be a bigoted asshole since that description only concerns behaviour -- it is not a valid identity. Therefore, there is no such thing as intolerance towards bigotry.

EDIT: Removed redundant quote.     

[penguinofhonor]

.

[TD1]

I think we have. We're off transgender discussion, and on to what it is to be a bigot

[Vector]

E: Vec, you don't date atheists?

As a rule of thumb, nope. I could make an exception for one who went above and beyond to openly express tolerance for religious faith in general without prompting, but otherwise, no.

Move. On.

Can I ask what you're asking us to move on from, in specific? I want to respect you, and I also had some more points I wanted to add to one of the trans* sub-discussions we've been having.

[Helgoland]

I think it's the semantics argument - that is indeed in the OP. Trans stuff is fine.
(Although I think explicitly labeling this thread as a safe space for that stuff might invite what Germans call Totschlagargumente - "bludgeoning-to-death arguments", the type that does not further discussion but instead ends it.)
I'm honestly kinda surprised, Vec - I hadn't taken you for the religious kind... Any particular bad experiences with atheists?

[aenri]

Welp, this thread moves fast.

As for my previous statement - I probably need to clarify that I stated that I don't include transwomen in my "woman" dating pool - for my own reasons and I don't think anything's wrong with that. That was directly in response to ...2 or 3 posts up from mine?

I didn't want to make any generalizing statements about nature of transwomen and women. And I won't make any in this thread, because I don't like fanning flames.

[TD1]

E: Vec, you don't date atheists?

As a rule of thumb, nope. I could make an exception for one who went above and beyond to openly express tolerance for religious faith in general without prompting, but otherwise, no.

Eh...really? Because anyone who is religious is actually more likely, IMO, to be intolerant to other religions.

[Dutchling]

b-but

vector notice me

[Angle]

There are plenty of atheists who are like that, for various reasons. I myself might be counted on the edge of that group, depending on how you gauge these things. I do believe that religious faith is a bad thing, and that most people would be better off without it, but I generally try to be gentle about it, and don't engage people unless they consent to having that conversation - I know firsthand how painful it can be to have change a large section of your beliefs like that, after all. There are some atheists that are a lot more aggressive, though, including a host that take insulting peoples religious opinions as an end in and of itself.