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[Sheb]

I'm not sure it's post-haggling: Brits aren't used to this kind of stuff.

Also, yeah, that's really a problem too, the way hospital charge a ton, because they only collect a part of that anyway (since people end up defaulting like Smeeprocket, because they can't afford the full, super-inflated price.

[MonkeyHead]

Why can't we have a health system that works? Europe manages to do it pretty well.

As far as the system is concerned, it is working. The system, of course, being the profit making health corporations. Until the focus of the US system is changed away from profit making private enterprise being king to a model that puts offering a service as the priority as we see in the EU, don't expect a thing to be different.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I've started to hear that flat-out ignoring hospital bills is becoming a viable strategy. If they fix you and you don't need anything else from them, there's sometimes nothing they can do to actually get anything out of you, especially if you're.....less than honest regarding your contact info.

[smeeprocket]

I'm not sure it's post-haggling: Brits aren't used to this kind of stuff.

Also, yeah, that's really a problem too, the way hospital charge a ton, because they only collect a part of that anyway (since people end up defaulting like Smeeprocket, because they can't afford the full, super-inflated price.

yea in retrospect I was really lucky (as much as one can be with disability) on all accounts. The debt getting erased, getting on disability at all.

I know a woman who has Lupus and Fybromialgia (sp?) and because she could walk ten steps, the social worker denied her disability. She had to go to court and fight it. The judge was, fortunately, not pleased with the social worker and was tearing him a new one after the case was settled.

Her teeth are rotting out from lupus, getting severely infected, and the hospital won't treat her because "they aren't dentists". It would cost her 12k to get her teeth pulled, not including dentures. Plus, the hospital consistently treats her horribly because they think she is on meth because of her teeth.

They did this to me while I was laid up. Kept making me take drug tests, eventually took my pain meds away (nurse proudly ripped the pain patch off my arm,) because I have piercings and tattoos.

I am sure I had quite the rating on the SCUM index. They were probably rather disappointed that I made it.

[UXLZ]

Man, FUCK America's healthcare system. That is Class A Bullshit. 12K for a teeth pulling!? That's a third of what (I'd assume) a normal person makes per year...
Well, I think the 'Average' is higher, but averages don't mean anything.

So, what was Obamacare? Why did people hate it?

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Obamacare was a basic reform package to turn the healthcare insurance industry from a semi-open cartel to an at-will purchace free market product. The right hates it because they feel that restrictions on the healthcare industry are inherently evil and will degrade American healthcare for any number of reasons, and the left hates it because it doesn't do much of anything beyond what I described in the previous sentence.

[smeeprocket]

Man, FUCK America's healthcare system. That is Class A Bullshit.

So, what was Obamacare? Why did people hate it?

they hate it because... socialism or something. Also, the president is black so anything he does is wrong. He could come out in favor of breathing and half the country would suffocate.

the ACA (Obamacare) is a sort of midway solution that allows insurance companies to continue to be a pain but makes them charge more reasonable rates, and makes it affordable for americans with an income. The americans with low or no income'd were supposed to be covered by expanded medicaid but the supreme court is filled with awful people like Scalia and Thomas so that was shot down.

[ChairmanPoo]

Her teeth are rotting out from lupus, getting severely infected, and the hospital won't treat her because "they aren't dentists".

...but surely they have maxillofacial surgeons, right? Or some kind of NHS covenant with dentists?

[smeeprocket]

Her teeth are rotting out from lupus, getting severely infected, and the hospital won't treat her because "they aren't dentists".

...but surely they have maxillofacial surgeons, right? Or some kind of NHS covenant with dentists?

oh it covers that, I know because I have TMJ. But that doesn't cover pulling impacted teeth.

What is NHS?

During the last election, Romney joked that next Obama would be offering people dental care. The conservatives think this is so absurd they make jokes about it. That is how much it is not a thing.

Actually, medicaid will cover some costs for children under a certain age. Not things like braces I don't think, but stuff like cavities.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Maxillofacial surgeons and dentists are pretty much entirely separate from the rest of the medical system.

[Baffler]

Believe me when I say that very few if any Americans haggle with the hospitals, or with anyone other than their neighbor at a garage sale for that matter. Most people do the bulk of their business with, well, big businesses, whose employees will most likely be in a heap of trouble for letting a customer talk the price down.

Man, FUCK America's healthcare system. That is Class A Bullshit. 12K for a teeth pulling!? That's a third of what (I'd assume) a normal person makes per year...
Well, I think the 'Average' is higher, but averages don't mean anything.

So, what was Obamacare? Why did people hate it?

It was supposed to shift the focus away from private to public health service, essentially. What ended up happening though was, in order to compromise with Republicans in congress (none of whom actually fucking voted for the thing even after gutting it) they made it illegal to not have health insurance (under penalty of a small fine which will increase over time,) and set up "exchanges" to shop for it from mostly private concerns. They did do some good though, companies can't turn people down because they have a preexisting condition, for example, or do other things to screw people over if they actually get sick. There's more to it than that but that's really the consumer friendly version for someone outside the US.

[smeeprocket]

my mother in law, her dentures are so old you can see the wire on one of them, the gum part has worn away.

Those things are not getting replaced, either.

My dad paid for me to go to a very cut rate dentist recently to get cavities filled. Bastards charged me $100 first to tell me how to brush my teeth. That's a scam right there.

[UXLZ]

God Bless the Not-USA.

I would haaate to live there, holy crap. The medical services sound like they suck absolute ass. You'd probably be better off in rural *insert third world nation here* than America.

I wonder if it's worse than China...

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Yeah, "small" fine, sure. Now that the bills are coming it in it doesn't look that fucking small at all, I'm afraid. My mother, whom I was just getting to come around from a right-wing party line, is being smacked with a $2000 fine come tax day, and she makes almost nothing to begin with. Not only that, but what the insurance companies have offered her has about doubled in cost, so that fine might actually be preferable. Suffice it to say we're back to square one on how Obama is evil.

Obamacare is fucked legislation that managed to do more harm than good at this point. A more comprehensive reform that didn't seek a GOP approval stamp on every provision might have had a better outcome, but I'm convinced this is just going to ensure we never see any real healthcare legislation in the US. Next time the Republicans get the chance the ACA will be repealed and we'll have another 20 years where talking about healthcare law is verboten.

[smeeprocket]

you know it's weird because the poor, not covered by medicaid, are supposed to be exempt from the taxes. But now you are scaring me. What kind of income does your mother make (general estimate if it is not too nosey)