Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[MetalSlimeHunt]

You Have To Spend Money To Make Money, in regards to why we should cut the budget and lower taxes?

That's Keynesianism, isn't it?

Not if you're trying to eliminate the deficit with it.

[SalmonGod]

Women In New York Are Getting Arrested For Carrying Condoms

[Pnx]

Women In New York Are Getting Arrested For Carrying Condoms

...

I'm aware a lot of people think persecuting prostitutes is helpful, but could they please get it through their heads that it really isn't?

[Owlbread]

I don't see why it should be a crime. I can understand laws concerning brothels and such but prostitution should be legal everywhere, it's your choice to do what you want with your body for money.

[Max White]

You mean prostitution or carrying a condom?
Prostitution I'm sure you could make some sort of argument for keeping illegal. Not sure how it would go and I'm not going to try but I'm willing to concede a debate still exists there.
Carrying a condom? The idea that carrying one of these things should land you in trouble is offensive. Fuck you New York Police, you guys suck.

[Owlbread]

You mean prostitution or carrying a condom?
Prostitution I'm sure you could make some sort of argument for keeping illegal. Not sure how it would go and I'm not going to try but I'm willing to concede a debate still exists there.
Carrying a condom? The idea that carrying one of these things should land you in trouble is offensive. Fuck you New York Police, you guys suck.

I'm referring to prostitution, I should have made that clearer. Sorry.

[Boea]

I don't see why it should be a crime. I can understand laws concerning brothels and such but prostitution should be legal everywhere, it's your choice to do what you want with your body for money.

There's a difference between Prostitution by choice, by necessity, and straight on slavery/extortion.
I love how these large, and amazing laws are comparable to carpet bombings.

[Sheb]

Even in well-regulated place like Holland, it's estimated 50% of sex workers are forced into prostitution. The whole trade brings a lot of unpleasantness that apparently can't be regulated away, so it might be better to outlaw it.

[Owlbread]

But where would they be if they were not forced into legal prostitution? Wouldn't they just become illegal prostitutes and run afoul of the law? In any country, developed or undeveloped, there are going to be some women (and perhaps men) who find that there is nothing they can do to support themselves/their family adequately enough without selling their bodies. That's an ugly truth and governments should accomodate it, otherwise you're just making life harder for them.

[Putnam]

But where would they be if they were not forced into legal prostitution? Wouldn't they just become illegal prostitutes and run afoul of the law?

...forced meaning they wouldn't be a prostitute at all if they weren't, you know, forced to.

[Owlbread]

...forced meaning they wouldn't be a prostitute at all if they weren't, you know, forced to.

But I was taking the word "forced" as referring to becoming a prostitute out of necessity, not at gunpoint. That kind of thing is something that can be regulated, or should be by Law Enforcement services.

[Descan]

I think he just said it confusingly.

Whether the trade is legal or illegal, they would still be prostitutes. But an illegal trade makes their lives harder than it has to be, when it's already rather rough by whatever circumstances are forcing them, while a legal trade could instead let people go after the things forcing them into it. Pimps, poverty, that kind of thing.

[Frumple]

Even in well-regulated place like Holland, it's estimated 50% of sex workers are forced into prostitution. The whole trade brings a lot of unpleasantness that apparently can't be regulated away, so it might be better to outlaw it.

Except what exactly is outlawing it going to do? Stop the trade, or punish people potentially in an already dire straight that's committing an act that, in itself, is victim-less (the extortion and situations surrounding it definitely less so, of course). Something else?

Outlawing it really damn obviously doesn't work to prevent the practice and very much obviously makes it so the surrounding environs are necessarily more toxic for the prostitute as well as everyone else involved. If outlawing prostitution is doing less harm than good, I'd probably be pretty damned surprised, y'know?

Now, something along the lines of support networks, resources to help sex workers find other employment, should they desire it, and a system that provides means to prevent the negative aspects that seem to inevitably surround the trade, yes. Those are good ideas. Criminalizing the act, however, on the face of it provides precisely zero bloody benefit and inflicts an unnecessary and likely useless amount of suffering on people.

[Owlbread]

I think he just said it confusingly.

Whether the trade is legal or illegal, they would still be prostitutes. But an illegal trade makes their lives harder than it has to be, when it's already rather rough by whatever circumstances are forcing them, while a legal trade could instead let people go after the things forcing them into it. Pimps, poverty, that kind of thing.

Rather like outlawing alcohol and drugs completely, outlawing prostitution is going to make an ugly reality uglier than it needs to be.

Even in well-regulated place like Holland, it's estimated 50% of sex workers are forced into prostitution. The whole trade brings a lot of unpleasantness that apparently can't be regulated away, so it might be better to outlaw it.

Except what exactly is outlawing it going to do? Stop the trade, or punish people potentially in an already dire straight that's committing an act that, in itself, is victim-less (the extortion and situations surrounding it definitely less so, of course). Something else?

Outlawing it really damn obviously doesn't work to prevent the practice and very much obviously makes it so the surrounding environs are necessarily more toxic for the prostitute as well as everyone else involved. If outlawing prostitution is doing less harm than good, I'd probably be pretty damned surprised, y'know?

Now, something along the lines of support networks, resources to help sex workers find other employment, should they desire it, and a system that provides means to prevent the negative aspects that seem to inevitably surround the trade, yes. Those are good ideas. Criminalizing the act, however, on the face of it provides precisely zero bloody benefit and inflicts an unnecessary and likely useless amount of suffering on people.

I concur 100%.

I don't know about you chaps but I actually see sex work in general as a respectable profession. If you're good at something and people could use your services, why not make a career out of it? Or rather, use it to supplement your income from your day job for as long as it remains viable for you.

[GlyphGryph]

From what I understand, The Netherlands have significant problems with enforcing their existing prostitution laws because of the way it's treated despite being legal.

Despite 80% of Amsterdam prostitutes being illegally trafficked, local authorities have referred to it as "not their problem".

I think they generally have the right laws, but if it isn't an enforcement priority you're not going to wind up with good results. Prison sentences generally range from measly 1-2 months in prison for each person illegally and personally trafficked into the country to serve as prostitutes or servants. If you violently abuse and traffic hundreds of women, why, you could get anywhere from 8 months to 7 years.

Normal Amsterdam policy to evidence of abuse, violence, and trafficking isn't to arrest people, but simply to close the shop - the people involved simply move elsewhere and re-open.

It's pretty problematic. It's DEFINITELY not what I would call "well regulated".