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Author Topic: Underground civ  (Read 4846 times)

Granite26

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2008, 12:42:35 pm »

Why DF orcs could not be modified to be fully underground?
They can't be underground because there are no orcs in DF, as for the idea, it would seem odd that a species would be entirely isolated underground by choice.

There are no orcs in DF YET... Who's to say that all the tunnels aren't going to 'discover' them, as it were...

Anyway, orcs is as good a name as any for the lightless ape monsters.

Puzzlemaker

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2008, 01:11:52 pm »

They arn't constructed walls though...

I seem to remember someone setting a coal vein on fire.
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phappyman

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2008, 08:56:57 pm »

Oops, I just realized this suggestion is roughly the same thing as "more underground diversity", which is a top 10 requested feature! Not only that, it's the #1 requested feature! Oops! :)
"Top ten" poll: (stickied to the top of this forum) - http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=6128.0
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Othob Rithol

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2008, 09:57:04 pm »

I wouldn't worry too much about it already being in the Top 10.

The idea needs to be fleshed out anyway. We all know Toady has a hell of a good imagination, but our ramblings here might spark an idea.

If you can, rename the thread as "underground diversity discussion" or something like that and we can brainstorm here, in one thread.

I'd like to see a second "underworld" beneath the surface at about 10 or so z levels underground. There would be enough room for a medium sized fort before excavating an opening into a sprawling cavern world populated by antmen or orcs or whatever seems appropriate.

And any fort, if it digs deep enough should encounter magma.

------

The old 2d Mountain had distinct zones that each had its own 'personality'. The area in between the outside and the cave river had great access to trade, hunting, and wood. It also was (conceptually)  in danger from goblin siege forces. Once you got to the cave river you had to deal with lizardmen and giant cave crocodiles, but you had the opportunity to make extensive farms and tower cap fortresses. Further in there was the chasm with its antmen and batmen. Next came the area between the chasm and magma, where the most efficient smithing could be done. Beyond that you had adamantine, HFS, and doom.

----

In an ideal (for me) 3d adaptation you'd have a layer of rock directly under the surface, with the possibility of a cave river winding underneath it (just like it is now).

But deeper you'd come to a layer of open caverns (analogous to the chasm) with underground civs, large subterranean lakes (fed by the cave rivers) and connections to other fortresses and goblin caves.

This layer would be the lair of the dreaded cave spider, packs of naked mole dogs, and rampaging hordes trolls, antmen, or troglodytes. The cavern would vary between 0 and 7 z levels in depth, with stalagmite/tites, bottomless chasms, mushroom forests and obsidian columns surrounding magma vents. The fort would need a second "entrance" and defenses down there.

Breaching the floor of the cavern would eventually bring you to the bottom of the crust... with an 'aquifer like' layer of magma. A lucky dwarf could every so often discover a vein of adamantine piercing this layer. Greedily digging out the vein would lead the doomed beneath the magma layer to the HFS.

Red Jackard

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2008, 11:02:03 pm »

...it would seem odd that a species would be entirely isolated underground by choice.

1) They may not suspect that aboveground exists
2) If sunlight and\or moonlight is dangerous for them, they would prefer underground 
3) This may be a religious issue.
4) Many, many other reasons

5) They have heard tales of the merciless Devourer race, whose hunger for war cannot be sated
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Neskiairti

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2008, 06:57:17 am »

thats a great idea there.. though it should vary as well.. not /every/ map would have the same things.. but a magma bottom would be a great idea.. unless its a chasm (like how it goes down now, bottomless) but surrounded by obsidian and then a magma layer.. and yea.. spires of adamantium (when you find 'special fun stuff' would be awesome as well..)

underground civs.. underground forests.. lakes.. rivers.. maybe even magma flows (underground rivers of magma)

or on volcano maps.. above ground rivers of lava that /sometimes/ dry up (similar to how streams in winter freeze over) then start again later.. (just a random thought)
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Mephansteras

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2008, 02:06:31 pm »

I like a lot of these ideas. Of course, WHAT is underneath any given fort should be varied. I don't want to see every fort deal with the same things.

So, some forts are on a solid bedrock, where you've got very few (if any) pockets beneath you.

Others, especially those with lots of limestone and similar rock, should have large cave complexes running underneath. These could be populated with all the usual stuff, underground civs, etc.

Maybe areas with Magma vents could have a different type of thing near them. Old, hollow, magma pipes and whatnot that are inhabited my imps and whatnot.

Sleeping horrors that aren't related to the usual HFS would be nice too. Something bad, but not quite so game changing. And no need for Adamantine, for those. Although treasure hordes or something would be nice.
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Othob Rithol

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2008, 04:44:23 pm »

Sorry I didn't mean to suggest the whole world would be generally the same.

The caverns etc should of course be varied, just like the existence of cave rivers, magma vents etc... but i would hope they would be common enough that you could find and play with them without need of a prospector program.

I would want to unhitch the "mountainous terrain only" however. You should find, having dug deep enough, the same possible features under a swamp as under the tallest peak. The peak just has more volume of rock in the play area, thus greater chances of hidden cool stuff (HCS).

Non-HFS buried stuff would also be excellent, and can take a wide range of options. For instance, it is more than possible that a sleeping dragon might slumber right through a major tectonic upheaval, leaving it buried (along with its treasure) deep underground....Urist McDoomedminer finding a very hungry dragon in what was to be the new housing complex.

RavingManiac

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2008, 08:58:23 am »

We could combine the underground civilization idea with the pits!

You have struck Hell!
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penguinofhonor

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2008, 09:59:07 am »

Oh, where was that picture...

Drats, I can't find it. We were talking about the digging into the underworld and someone drew up a quick picture of an elephant-carp-unicorn-hippopotamus mix. I saved it, but I guess that was on my old computer.
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Red Jackard

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Re: Underground civ
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2008, 11:25:15 am »

I remember that pic. Thought I saved it, but apparently not.

We could combine the underground civilization idea with the pits!

You have struck Hell!

And then all Hell broke loose.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2008, 12:31:12 pm by Red Jackard »
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