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[Bromuzl]

Ahoy, btw! First post. 
Despite that fact I would like to emphasize
with as much humility as the statement
allows, that this isn't just some silly fun
but I would like to use this to move
creatures up and down z-levels safely.
Silly fun surely will follow however.

Proposed Challenge: Salmon Cannon

Spoiler: Source (click to show/hide)

http://www.iflscience.com/plants-and-animals/%E2%80%98salmon-cannon%E2%80%99-allows-safe-migration-around-hydroelectric-dams#

Spoiler: Relevant damage research (click to show/hide)

Falling Damage:
As mentioned earlier, falling damage is simulated by having a large cube of rock beat the creature to death with body slams.

. . .

I investigated further using a test embark, and found that the game respects the material of the floor when considering falling damage. Falling on a sand tile used sand properties, falling on a natural basalt floor used basalt properties, and falling on a constructed steel floor used steel properties.

Last night someone posted on a closed Dwarf Fortress group on Facebook a question "Now how do we make this?" and I having always been fascinated with waterworks, took the challenge! My initial idea was to build a standard Temperate River Dam with floodgates, construct several raising bridges facing upstream of various layouts to get as accurate a simulation of this technology being developed in human lands. Of course my first question was will they even survive the throw? I know cats and peregrine falcons fight critters, and that they're immune to traps. But are they immune to being hurled over walls? Or even more exciting, flung up entire z-levels, similar to a widened screw pump stack?


After embarking at an appropriate site, and preparing the first two screw pumps for temporarily lowering the river to workable water levels, further utilizations came to mind - transporting whales, sea lampy, or even sharks into a large, multi layer prison accessable only by narrow walkway, cages stocked, and water level increased by controlled flooding, to be lowered to safe levels for adding to the collection and looting. For extra fun, perhaps a waterproof portal connected to the Sherff's Dining room, complete with cage release level for parties. Plus Im sure other fun you can all think of..

For now, my Actual question is if anyone currently knows for certain the mechanics involved with a vermin on tile of a bridge being raised other than the water being destroyed. Also, if there is an increase in angle applied to the tossed creature. All things I hope to find out either here or in testing, as I cannot find any threads or wiki pages that detail this.

[Bromuzl]

Tl;dr Can I throw vermin fish by raising a bridge? Does throwing units in such a way throw them 'up' in z-level as well? Would they survive if they land inside of water?

[Quietust]

Can I throw vermin fish by raising a bridge?

If they are live vermin, no, you cannot.

Does throwing units in such a way throw them 'up' in z-level as well?

No - when units are flung by bridges, they are only flung to the sides, never up. Significant research on this was done years ago.

Would they survive if they land inside of water?

Don't recall.

[Bromuzl]

Shoot, project salmon cannon is a no go then. Suppose I'll try some of the merman capture techniques I read about for my prison design instead.

Thank you!

[Loci]

No - when units are flung by bridges, they are only flung to the sides, never up. Significant research on this was done years ago.

No. I believe you're confusing the "tossing" action of retracting bridges for the "flinging" action of raising bridges. I have personally witnessed many creatures flung by raising bridges and they certainly do fly up multiple z-levels. I have no idea how this would behave with submerged creatures, though.

[Quietust]

No - when units are flung by bridges, they are only flung to the sides, never up. Significant research on this was done years ago.

No. I believe you're confusing the "tossing" action of retracting bridges for the "flinging" action of raising bridges. I have personally witnessed many creatures flung by raising bridges and they certainly do fly up multiple z-levels. I have no idea how this would behave with submerged creatures, though.

Items fly upwards, but units only get flung sideways. Also, the only difference between raising bridges and retracting bridges is the distance things are flung.

See here for Sphalerite's research - it was done in version 0.28.181.40d, but I'm pretty sure they haven't ever changed - even in the 2D versions, bridges assigned random X/Y/Z velocity to flung items (they'd usually just hit the ceiling) and only X/Y for units (it was just +/- 7 for each direction, and while raising bridges had a fling "strength" of 10, retracting bridges just had a strength of 2).

[Loci]

As I stated, I've personally witnessed a creature go flying, so you'll pardon me if I'm a bit skeptical that it can't happen.

I just tested it with some military dwarves and a number of them indeed flew into the air. Unless they spontaneously learned how to levitate several z-levels off the ground, I'd say your ancient research is no longer valid.

[Bromuzl]

Well-done.

I have occasionally observed objects thrown to a higher z-level by raising bridges, so it would be interesting to see this experiment performed with the bridges in holes to see whether this is the same for retracting bridges.

found this, going to keep digging.
Sadly I don't think I'll be able to throw salmon to their hypothetical breeding grounds up river, but at least I may be able to hilariously locomotivise sharks and lamprey.

[Quietust]

Looking more closely, it looks like drawbridge has changed such that they do fling units upward now, and I'm pretty sure that change happened when Minecarts were added (along with parabolic trajectories). Clearly, further Science needs to be done.

[Bromuzl]

There's only one thing to do then.
Project Salmon Cannon are now live.

Though I don't think I'll try the salmon thing, due to nothing suggesting vermin can be thrown by bridges.

[Larix]

The bridge-based conveyor belt has been scienced up already:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=46509.msg925778#msg925778

It's only used to move items, creatures would get bludgeoned to death by wall/ceiling collisions long before getting anywhere.

As has been mentioned, bridges work differently from earlier versions and fling creatures up - and quite a long way when raising. I haven't looked into it rigorously, but a simple test rig hurled ~50 animals mainly up: they went 5-11 z-levels vertically and 0-~10 tiles horizontally (the latter mostly randomly, the only notable effect was that there was significantly less movement in the bridge's raising direction).

As a minor datum, there was also the cedar-dwelling giant olm of Charmcrafted, which got there by getting thrown (up, at least two levels) by a raising drawbridge. The bridge was used as automated atomsmasher and had a few tiles with open air instead of a ceiling above, so regularly sent critters flying.